ICEINSPACE
Moon Phase
CURRENT MOON
Waning Gibbous 90.3%
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17-06-2018, 01:08 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Melbourne, VIC
Posts: 889
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Nebulae or Galaxies?
Which do you prefer to shoot? Galaxies, being relatively small need dark skies, a big scope and LRGB, VS Nebulae, which can be quite big, that emit in narrowband, which you can do from just about anywhere!
So, what do you guys prefer? This becomes important especially with limited time to image each month.
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17-06-2018, 02:39 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 17,996
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I think the limiting factor is cost and location. Medium light polluted can still capture the brighter galaxies but the dimmer ones is really a dark site proposition.
Even with a dark site a lot of galaxies will require 6 hours minimum to image reasonably and ideally a lot more than that. That assumes a sensitive mono CCD astro camera and a reasonably fast F ratio and aperture. It then also becomes somewhat not portable and requires a permanent installation.
So you can see where remote imaging makes sense in order to get enough hours up into the image.
Nebula on the other hand can be captured anywhere, light pollution is not an issue with narrowband and small scopes can do very well.
So cost and time are less.
Some scopes are a compromise for doing either. Some refractors come with a range of reducers to do wider field nebulas and still do the brighter galaxies. They are within the bounds of portability as well.
If you have to travel to get dark enough skies to image then a fast scope with as large an aperture as you can afford makes a lot of sense.
Greg.
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17-06-2018, 04:49 PM
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PI cult recruiter
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 10,584
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I like a mix of both.
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17-06-2018, 06:41 PM
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Novichok test rabbit
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Somewhere in the cosmos...
Posts: 10,388
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ME: planetary nebulae, dusty nebulae, and sometimes bright nebulae.
I love galaxy images - OTHER peoples. I realise my f/5 106mm setup is not ideal for GX imaging, and nor was my FSQ-85, but I still try occasionally. (will buy the extender)
Last edited by LewisM; 17-06-2018 at 07:30 PM.
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17-06-2018, 07:05 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Melbourne, VIC
Posts: 889
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It is always nice to image things people dont do often isn't it Lewis Galaxies, i'm not sure why but i really am not too big of a fan of imaging them!
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17-06-2018, 07:13 PM
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PI cult recruiter
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 10,584
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Galaxies are often quite challenging and different targets require different treatment. Same with nebs. I reckon it's good to have a go at everything, except perhaps planetary
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17-06-2018, 07:32 PM
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Novichok test rabbit
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Somewhere in the cosmos...
Posts: 10,388
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Oh, I take my hat off to the planetary imagers...I tried it several times, failed miserably. I simply don't have the patience for learning planetary imaging - taken me long enough with DSO's lol.
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17-06-2018, 07:39 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: North Queensland
Posts: 3,240
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I think it is nice to start with emission nebulae, in particular narrowband imaging, as a small aperture works pretty well for such imaging.
Galaxies, on the other hand, benefit from a larger aperture and therefore present a more challenging task.
One day I hope to move up to a 10" or so aperture and in this way open the doors to galaxy and planetary nebulae imaging, and for exploring interesting bits within emission nebulae in narrowband as well.
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18-06-2018, 08:32 AM
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My God it's full of stars
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 3,271
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One can add a dash of creativity to a narrowband Nebula image.
You have the choice of colour palette and framing.
Harder to be creative with LRGB though- if it’s not right it usually just looks bad!
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18-06-2018, 11:20 AM
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Galaxy hitchhiking guide
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: The Shire
Posts: 8,268
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Galaxies...even small faint ones...can be imaged very successfully from the burbs. Sky brightness per pixel is the key, and this is minimised by using long focal lengths. The native FL of my system is some 3300mm and it regularly pings mag 21 on nights of good transparency from the southern fringe of Sydney.
Nebulae are easy if they are bright, not so much if you want to do LRGB and they are faint little suckers...gradients can be problematic.....but if you are happy to go narrow band, there is virtually no advantage with a dark site. Get your self a set of 3nm AstroDons and even the full moon can be worked around.
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18-06-2018, 11:38 AM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Melbourne, VIC
Posts: 889
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3nm astrodons would be great - bloody expensive! People even say they aren't worth it???
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18-06-2018, 01:29 PM
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Novichok test rabbit
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Somewhere in the cosmos...
Posts: 10,388
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Logan, JUST DO IT!
I image from a HORRID red zone - and I image strictly OSC and I don't care! Just take your time. Whatever. There is no rush pumping out a buzzillion images.
Most important thing about AP is do it for fun, personal satisfaction and enjoyment, not to impress people (that's called Wankology ).
Get out there and capture photons! You'll discover what you prefer. Yes, I like the seldom imaged obscurities and the dark 'n dusty. Grabbing little PN's, even if the resolution/scale is crap doesn't phase me in the least.
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18-06-2018, 02:50 PM
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Ultimate Noob
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 7,001
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I personally prefer nebulas over galaxies... Unless it is the super large galaxies like the Magellanic Clouds but this pretty much explains why the only long focal length scope I own is a visual one
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18-06-2018, 03:33 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: North Queensland
Posts: 3,240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lognic04
3nm astrodons would be great - bloody expensive! People even say they aren't worth it???
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3nm Astrodons are worth 1000 fold their mass in gold. I used to have 12nm from another brand and 3nm Astrodons are just so much better in a light polluted zone or in a full moon conditions. For example, data for this image was captured around the full moon and on one night the scope was pointing less than 15 degrees away from the full moon: https://www.astrobin.com/350290/?nc=user
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18-06-2018, 04:10 PM
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Novichok test rabbit
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Somewhere in the cosmos...
Posts: 10,388
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One word of advice on filters: Baader = NO (honestly, NO!!! I have had some HORRID flare/reflection issues with Baaders). I got better results with el-cheapo Chinese SVBONY/OPTOLONG (who, rumour has it, makes the Astronomik filters)
Got better results with the Astronomiks. Astrodons are indeed GOLDEN
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18-06-2018, 04:26 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Melbourne, VIC
Posts: 889
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Thats awesome Suavi - I though only ha could be done in LP/moonlight?
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18-06-2018, 04:59 PM
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Galaxy hitchhiking guide
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: The Shire
Posts: 8,268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LewisM
One word of advice on filters: Baader = NO (honestly, NO!!! I have had some HORRID flare/reflection issues with Baaders). I got better results with el-cheapo Chinese SVBONY/OPTOLONG (who, rumour has it, makes the Astronomik filters)
Got better results with the Astronomiks. Astrodons are indeed GOLDEN
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Beg to differ.
http://www.atscope.com.au/BRO/gallery431.html
Captured with Baaders and many 20 minute subs, the reflections are well controlled....plus the bright OB cluster is fully resolved.
I have 65mm sqaure Baaders and 50mm AstroDons. Apart from the bandpass, there is little difference IMHO.
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18-06-2018, 05:04 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: North Queensland
Posts: 3,240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lognic04
Thats awesome Suavi - I though only ha could be done in LP/moonlight?
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All of my narrowband images (Ha, OIII and SII) have been captured either in a heavy LP environment or around the full moon. I am hoping to be able to get my first ever narrowband image with darkish skies and with little moonlight soon
That's a fantastic image Peter.
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18-06-2018, 05:17 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Melbourne Australia
Posts: 467
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Just a word on 3nm filters - you can get significant shifts of the central wavelength with fast f ratios (below ~ f/3.6 - f/4).
Mark
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18-06-2018, 08:32 PM
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Lee "Wormsy" Borsboom
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Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Kilcoy, QLD
Posts: 2,058
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I like both, but prefer galaxies. Nebulae are good too though; they give you something to image when the moon phase isn't agreeable to galaxies. They also get a better reaction from my wife, who tends to grunt and mumble "spiraly sh*t" when I show her one of my galaxy photos.
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