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Old 15-08-2019, 09:20 PM
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Ancient unknown civilizations

I have been looking at the possiblity of there being a civilization that was wiped out approx 11000 years ago due to a massive sea level rise caused by a possible cosmic impact in North American.
The interesting thing is so many cultures have in their history a great flood. And although it is probable that any flood was not like the biblical flood it certainly seems from the ice cores a sea level rise of 30 feet within 24 hours did occur followed by a further rise of 400 feet over the following year or two...that could hide an earlier civilization ..if that happened to us it would mean places like New York and London would be 400 feet under water and covered by heaps of silt for folk looking 10,000 years from now.
So have you looked at this proposition at all...
The proposal is that a comet hit North America and that caused the sea to rise..there is a possible crator but as it is under a lot of ice they have not dated it as yet..but if that crator is dated at approx 12000 years ago it is clear that our history is different to that we have believed.
Have you looked at the possibility that a civilization existed and wiped out 12000 years ago.
It certainly seems most cultures talk of a flood which may suggest there is something to the findings of a dramatic sea level rise.
If the crator turns out to be 12000 years old will put history need to be rewritten?
Alex
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Old 16-08-2019, 01:32 AM
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There is the story of the Lost City of Atlantis, but I think that's fictional and not based on fact.
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Old 16-08-2019, 07:16 AM
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It's all a myth. Humans can't be civilised.
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Old 16-08-2019, 07:16 AM
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There is the story of the Lost City of Atlantis, but I think that's fictional and not based on fact.
Yes ...the story was told by Plato who apparently was told by one of his ancestors and I think he had it that the story was handed down over many generations and originally came from an Eygptian priest.

There are folk who think of Atlantis as an island that went under the sea..regarding it from myth to fact … but there are others who use the term Atlantians to loosely describe what they believe was a world wide somewhat advanced civilization that was wiped out by the supposed comet impact of approx. 12000 years ago.


There is a great deal of material on the net and I find it most interesting and certainly has me wondering if there could have been a civilization that is now hidden mostly by 400 feet of water and 10,000 odd years of fading away.


Most of this stuff was considered rat bag but there was a paper in Nature of all places that perhaps took the matter to another level.


I will try and find a reasonable vid from youtube and post it..the one I am thinking of is not too bad ..although as with most of these things folk get a little too heavily invested and can make little leaps where they really should not.


Even if the comet crator they have found fits the time line these folk follow more evidence is needed to establish the ancient civilization aspect.


One common feature of those views is that both the Sphinx and the Pyramids were not built by the Eygptians and that they merely took them over at some stage. And on this aspect it is interesting that the Eygiptians made no recording of them building the Pyramids...and also that notwithstanding common belief that they were tombs it seems no bobies have been found in any pyramid...the tombs are from the valley of the Kings ..


The proposition has been put forward that the Sphinx is some 12000 years old and that is because the water erosion at the sides of the enclosure could only have occurred when the climate was such that the rain would provided the water necessary to effect the erosion observed.


I find it all very interesting now that I have looked at many videos and sifted through what is hard evidence and what is supposition.


I do think the fact most cultures have a big flood story is interesting and if there was a flood it may be the sea level rise apparently recorded in the ice cores.


alex
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Old 16-08-2019, 07:20 AM
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Younger Dryas impact hypothesis
The Younger Dryas impact hypothesis or Clovis comet hypothesis posits that fragments of a large (more than 4 kilometers in diameter), disintegrating asteroid or comet struck North America, South America, Europe, and western Asia about 12,800 years ago. Multiple airbursts/impacts produced the Younger Dryas (YD) boundary layer (YDB), depositing peak concentrations of platinum, high-temperature spherules, meltglass, and nanodiamonds, forming an isochronous datum at more than 50 sites across about 50 million km˛ of Earth’s surface. Some scientists have proposed that this event triggered extensive biomass burning, a brief impact winter, the Younger Dryas abrupt climate change, contributed to extinctions of late Pleistocene megafauna, and resulted in the end of the Clovis culture.
Younger Dryas impact hypothesis - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Younge...act_hypothesis
Data from: Wikipedia
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Old 16-08-2019, 07:23 AM
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from NASA

The Hiawatha impact crater was first suspected to exist in the summer of 2015, from examination of a compilation of Greenland's sub-ice topography radar measurements made by NASA over two decades. The visualizations of the subsurface shown below are derived from a spring 2016 airborne survey by Germany's Alfred Wegener Institute, using a new ultrawideband radar sounder developed by the Center for Remote Sensing of Ice Sheets at The University of Kansas. Subsequent helicopter visits to the deglaciated terrain in front of Hiawatha Glacier by scientists from the Natural History Museum in Denmark recovered sediment samples from the main river that discharges water from beneath Hiawatha Glacier, through the northwestern rim breach. Laboratory examination revealed that these sediment samples contained shocked quartz and elevated platinum-group-element concentrations, both signs that the sediment records evidence of the impact of an iron asteroid more than one kilometer wide. The Hiawatha impact crater is potentially one of the youngest large impact craters on Earth.


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Old 16-08-2019, 07:25 AM
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Yeah i was going to say Atlantis too. Stories about Noahs flood and Atlantis must have come from somewhere. Even Japanese history talks about an underwater city.
The last ice age when there was a land bridge from Indonesia to Tasmaina and also one across the bearing straight between Asia and Europe and Americas.
This ice age ended around 10000 to 11000 years ago which the sea levels would have risen to their current levels give or take 10m or so.
So these stories of instant floods and sunken cities may have happened over many years but got translated to folklore.
Also this may explain where the Jewish people came from. A large migration of people coming from Northern Europe to a warmer equatorial region and over many years.
These people would look different and have totally diferent cultures but eventually settled in the area. Fast forward thousands of years and it might explain a few things about why these people have been persicuted for thousands of years and have been called "a wondering tribe" etc.
The Americas have been populated from Asia over 3 main ice ages.
The first populaion wave about 40000 years ago ended up in South America and are Incas, Astecs, and the current indigenous people that are still there today.
The second wave when Europe and Asia was freezing over came over around 20000 years ago and have settled in North America and are the American indians.
The Last population wave when a not so dramatic ice age came about 10000 are the Eskimo which have still asian similarities.
Then we have Australia and New Guinea which definitely have 3 distinct races of people but with similar DNA but only little pices of written history that we know about. Hopefully we havent fully destroyed the history of the aboriginal people that goes well past 40000 years but we are doing a good job if it and not understanding it.
We will never really know but human DNA is a pretty good indicator.
Anyway im only telling what ive learnt at school so could be wrong but it does make sense.
Cheers
Andy
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Old 16-08-2019, 07:29 AM
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Here is a reasonable video..he does get a little distracted mid way through but like most things on youtube it is an production made by a guy with limited resources...but if you have the time...

https://binged.it/2KOBX4E


alex
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Old 16-08-2019, 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by mynameiscd View Post
Yeah i was going to say Atlantis too. Stories about Noahs flood and Atlantis must have come from somewhere. Even Japanese history talks about an underwater city.
The last ice age when there was a land bridge from Indonesia to Tasmaina and also one across the bearing straight between Asia and Europe and Americas.
This ice age ended around 10000 to 11000 years ago which the sea levels would have risen to their current levels give or take 10m or so.
So these stories of instant floods and sunken cities may have happened over many years but got translated to folklore.
Also this may explain where the Jewish people came from. A large migration of people coming from Northern Europe to a warmer equatorial region and over many years.
These people would look different and have totally diferent cultures but eventually settled in the area. Fast forward thousands of years and it might explain a few things about why these people have been persicuted for thousands of years and have been called "a wondering tribe" etc.
The Americas have been populated from Asia over 3 main ice ages.
The first populaion wave about 40000 years ago ended up in South America and are Incas, Astecs, and the current indigenous people that are still there today.
The second wave when Europe and Asia was freezing over came over around 20000 years ago and have settled in North America and are the American indians.
The Last population wave when a not so dramatic ice age came about 10000 are the Eskimo which have still asian similarities.
Then we have Australia and New Guinea which definitely have 3 distinct races of people but with similar DNA but only little pices of written history that we know about. Hopefully we havent fully destroyed the history of the aboriginal people that goes well past 40000 years but we are doing a good job if it and not understanding it.
We will never really know but human DNA is a pretty good indicator.
Anyway im only telling what ive learnt at school so could be wrong but it does make sense.
Cheers
Andy
Thanks for your contribution Andy.

Something I noticed the other day and did not follow up..which I regret now...but apparently dna tests link Australian Aboriginals to South America..which is something I have never heard of...so I must follow up on that.

If you look at the Sumerians history you can form the impression that survivors of the supposed sea level rise were the gods they refer to ..or at least these survivors were seen as such...interestingly they lived in the garden of eden or paradice which translates to "where the animals are kept"...


There is a underwater city in India that I understand the government stopped research on because it threatened to cut across popula history.


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Old 16-08-2019, 07:47 AM
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AND this...the implication can only be that agriculture started well before popular history suggests as it would be near impossible for hunter gathers to build this....from wiki...

Göbekli Tepe (Turkish: [ɟœbecˈli teˈpe],[1] Turkish for "Potbelly Hill")[2] is an archaeological site in the Southeastern Anatolia Region of Turkey approximately 12 km (7 mi) northeast of the city of Şanlıurfa. The tell has a height of 15 m (49 ft) and is about 300 m (980 ft) in diameter.[3] It is approximately 760 m (2,490 ft) above sea level.
The tell includes two phases of use, believed to be of a social or ritual nature by site discoverer and excavator Klaus Schmidt, dating back to the 10th–8th millennium BCE.[4] During the first phase, belonging to the Pre-Pottery Neolithic A (PPNA), circles of massive T-shaped stone pillars were erected – the world's oldest known megaliths.[5]
More than 200 pillars in about 20 circles are currently known through geophysical surveys. Each pillar has a height of up to 6 m (20 ft) and weighs up to 10 tons. They are fitted into sockets that were hewn out of the bedrock.[6] In the second phase, belonging to the Pre-Pottery Neolithic B (PPNB), the erected pillars are smaller and stood in rectangular rooms with floors of polished lime. The site was abandoned after the Pre-Pottery Neolithic B (PPNB). Younger structures date to classical times.
The details of the structure's function remain a mystery. It was partially excavated by a German archaeological team under the direction of Schmidt from 1996 until his death in 2014. In 2018, the site was designated a UNESCO World Heritage Site.[7]

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Old 16-08-2019, 07:49 AM
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It's all a myth. Humans can't be civilised.
Many a true word spoken in jest.
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Old 16-08-2019, 07:53 AM
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and re Aboriginal link to South America ..a lead...needs more work.
https://thenewdaily.com.au/news/nati...human-history/

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Old 16-08-2019, 01:56 PM
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This guy is disliked by mainstream and this video perhaps demonstrates why.

https://youtu.be/cYbe154a6C8

Alex
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Old 16-08-2019, 02:05 PM
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Alex
My skin cancer guy , Dr Phil Flambas wrote a book about the lost city of Atlantis I think about 5 years ago
He’s into Greek history , Greek philosophers and Paintings etc...
I don’t have a link but type his name in and his profile will come up
Maybe check it out
Martin
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Old 16-08-2019, 02:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xelasnave View Post
This guy is disliked by mainstream and this video perhaps demonstrates why.

https://youtu.be/cYbe154a6C8

Alex

FMD another conspiracy theory! And about as convincing as the fake moon landing.


After I got the drift I skipped ahead to a random point and the first thing he said was total BS. Either I got 'lucky' or the stuff is easy to find on that video.
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Old 16-08-2019, 03:08 PM
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Gee Alex you are a fascinating fella, with some great talent and great history telling stories.
You are probably right to an extent, so where do we start looking for this hidden treasures.

Leon
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Old 16-08-2019, 03:09 PM
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FMD another conspiracy theory! And about as convincing as the fake moon landing.


After I got the drift I skipped ahead to a random point and the first thing he said was total BS. Either I got 'lucky' or the stuff is easy to find on that video.
What did you think was BS specifically?

Do you think he is wrong about there being humans in America before the Clovis people is wrong...if you saw that part. I don't know that's why I ask.
Alex
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Old 16-08-2019, 04:00 PM
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Gee Alex you are a fascinating fella, with some great talent and great history telling stories.
You are probably right to an extent, so where do we start looking for this hidden treasures.

Leon
The story isn't mine Leon.
I am not sure what the story is other than folk into the possible earlier civilization idea are convinced a comet hit North America approx 12000 years ago causing much ice to melt instantly and causing sea levels to rise by 30 feet world wide within 24 hours (their claim is such a rise is found in the ice cores) and another 400 odd feet rise over the next year (or so)...They say it was this event that saw the disappearance of the Mega fauna.. mainstream has it that the mega fauna disappearance was due to humans hunting them to extinction...to me that sounds implausible given we have not hunted stuff to the extinction like bears lions elephants giraffes etc ..presumably there were less people and without our ability to kill...so I find a comet much more plausible.
Anyways it was this rise in sea levels that took out an earlier civilization.
Evidence for the earlier civilization is the unexplainable megaliths found world wide such as the pregnant woman megalith some 1000 to 1500 tons and the use of such huge stones in a nearby temple...also the rich work found world wide such as that in Peru where the earlier work is more sophisticated that stuff on top the presumption being that folk like the Incas for example inherited ruins which they added to..Hench the difference in ruff work following exceptional work.

When the hypothesis that the dinosaurs were killed by a comet impact was first presented it was rejected in much the same way as this current idea. There is various things that can be seen to support the currently unfavourable idea ..however if the crator referred to above proves to be the correct age I doubt anyone can continue to say it just did not happen.

As I indicated earlier these ideas are put forward by non mainstream and the response is predictable and certainly some get carried away with wild ideas but for me sifting through the stuff and eliminating that which is probably BS a picture arises which certainly does not fit mainstream...that site in Turkey does however show that the idea that agriculture started only 5000 odd years ago is almost certainly incorrect simply because a hunter gather culture does not have the time to do that sort of thing...it is most curious.
I do think that these alternate ideas cause problems for certain beliefs and therefore the idea of a comet hit is dismissed without proper analysis. And folk like Handcock..who is a bit out there... are sought to be discredited...for me a lot of it adds up ..but then I have no desire for any particular outcome so am impartial.
You will see the emotional reactions to this stuff which suggests a predetermined view point consistent with a particular view of the world.
It is interesting that the crator NASA discovered is pretty well found where folk like Handcock predicted the comet of their story would be found.
Same when the initial hypothesis re the dinosaurs being wiped out via a comet..the opponent's said..yeh but there is no crator..if there was a comet that big there would be a crator...well they found the crator responsible for the dinasoirs extinction...the one NASA found just needs to be dated...if 12000 years ago the proposition of an earlier lost civilization becomes much more solid.
I would imagine the opposition could have something to do with folks ideas about a biblical type flood as opposed to a sea level rise..however there are many cultures that have their flood story so whatever way you approach the matter it seems there was a flood of some kind .it then becomes a matter of finding a plausible explanation for such an event..it would seem that there would be more opportunity for it to be a natural as opposed to a supernatural event.

Anyways Leon if you care to look at the videos I have posted here and perhaps take the time to watch all the way thru without going in with a preconception that you already know the facts you will at least find the subject of some interest I hope.
Alex

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Old 16-08-2019, 04:24 PM
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If you do the math for the great pyramid for example it seems rather improbable that it was built in twenty years for example...I took the time to work it out and you find something like 10 blocks an hour 24/7 for twenty years. Irrespective of how many labourers it gets to a matter that they could not all fit on the work site...and my sums don't take into account the time to build the chambers.. all I am getting at is the presumption is that it was built for a certain king for his tomb and that is where they get the twenty years...but no Dody was found in it..there is a stone box which some think was a coffin but that is a mere guess with out evidence to support such a proposal...anyways all the king's were buried in the valley of the king's and no body has been found in a pyramid...so one must wonder why it that the popular belief...and I do think it is very odd that the Eygptians left notes on everything..how to make bread and beer...but there is nothing whatsoever where they say they were building these things.
And some of the rock work defies an explanation that they used copper tools...just try and do what they are supposed to have done on the materials like pink granite etc and see how far you get with a bronze chisel.
The point is there are enough inconsistencies to make one think...most folk don't and simply buy whatever explanation they hear...but for me I do think the story we are told does not add up or fit many observations.
Alex
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Old 16-08-2019, 04:31 PM
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Leon have a look at this.
https://youtu.be/0la8txUkgUM
Alex
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