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Old 05-03-2008, 06:40 PM
Aces High (Mark)
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Is this right for Mars?

hi everyone.. I bought my new scope yesterday, an 8" (200mm) Dob.

I set it up last night for the first time, the clouds parted for little while.
I pointed it at Mars put in a 6mm lens and ..... a tiny little red dot ?
shimmering and no detail at all, tiny. It was Mars 100% not a star. Is Mars like that this time of year? Is that what appears to a 8" reflector scope.

Im sure Ive seen better with my old 5" Tasco scope many years ago?

my new scope is collimated as best i can with the cheshire eyepiece.
I left it outside for an hour to cool with the mirror fan on.

And...

And do all reflectors show stars as smears near the very edge of viewing?
Sharp in the middle but smeared a bit near the edge of view.


any help appreciated.
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  #2  
Old 05-03-2008, 06:55 PM
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Matty P (Matt)
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Mars is way past it best from December last year when it was at its largest. It is getting smaller every day and is quite a challenging target even in a large scope.

Have you been able to observe Jupiter and Saturn? Both will provide you with much more pleasing views.
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  #3  
Old 05-03-2008, 06:58 PM
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rmcpb (Rob)
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Mars is moving away from us very quickly so detail is not really possible at present. Couple of months ago it was OK but never good this time round. I saw it on Saturday and could resolve a disk with hints of darker bit but that was about it, or was that wishful thinking?

The smeared stars are a result of coma. It is reduced by better eyepieces and in extreme cases a paracorr but in the beginning just learn to live with it for a while, don't leap into the eyepiece and accessory market till you have had your scope a while.

Keep looking up
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Old 10-03-2008, 01:00 PM
tnbk00 (Daniel)
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Just a tip, with the way the sky is at the moment its really easy to confuse mars with beatleguse.......I made this mistake the other night in front of some more seasoned astronomers..quite embarrassing.
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Old 10-03-2008, 03:40 PM
Kokatha man
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmcpb View Post
Mars is moving away from us very quickly so detail is not really possible at present. Couple of months ago it was OK but never good this time round. I saw it on Saturday and could resolve a disk with hints of darker bit but that was about it, or was that wishful thinking?


Keep looking up
That's an interesting comment rmcpb - and no, I'm not doing one of my "stirs" - "mind mechanics" have quite a lot to say about how profoundly preconception influences our sensory perception.

We all talk on this forum about how our ability to discern detail etc (particularly planetary) "improves" as we continue to observe, both within the interim of one ob session and as we re-observe over time. Some of this (during the one session) undoubtedly owes an enormous amount to dark adaptation of our eyes; and of course as with anything visual, fine nuances etc become more apparent as we gain familiarity with a subject.

This does not, however, negate the fact that nearly all of us have some very strong pre-conceptions/images of what we expect to see; and I wonder where we can actually draw the line sometimes.

Before (or pre-empting) any indignation about "knowing what I can darn well see" etc occurs, let me add that last night, with very good seeing (and no flamin' wind) Saturn and Jupiter provided me with 2 somewhat contrasting experiences in my 10" dob: at approx 350x Saturn was becoming more and more visually detailed whilst Jupiter really yielded its' best at about 114x. (Saturn with GSO 9mm plossl and 2.5x barlow and Jupiter with 11mm T6 Nagler.

Now I appreciate the mantra about Saturn and higher mag (though seeing it so well at 350x was pretty darn good!) versus Jupiter/lower power but it all just made me reflect on what we see, what we expect to see, and what we actually get to see!

I should add that I wasn't doing any tracking, so Saturn zanging across my FOV would've made the detail discerned even more interesting.
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Old 10-03-2008, 04:38 PM
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madtuna (Steve)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kokatha man View Post
That's an interesting comment rmcpb - and no, I'm not doing one of my "stirs" - "mind mechanics" have quite a lot to say about how profoundly preconception influences our sensory perception.

We all talk on this forum about how our ability to discern detail etc (particularly planetary) "improves" as we continue to observe, both within the interim of one ob session and as we re-observe over time. Some of this (during the one session) undoubtedly owes an enormous amount to dark adaptation of our eyes; and of course as with anything visual, fine nuances etc become more apparent as we gain familiarity with a subject.

This does not, however, negate the fact that nearly all of us have some very strong pre-conceptions/images of what we expect to see; and I wonder where we can actually draw the line sometimes.

Before (or pre-empting) any indignation about "knowing what I can darn well see" etc occurs, let me add that last night, with very good seeing (and no flamin' wind) Saturn and Jupiter provided me with 2 somewhat contrasting experiences in my 10" dob: at approx 350x Saturn was becoming more and more visually detailed whilst Jupiter really yielded its' best at about 114x. (Saturn with GSO 9mm plossl and 2.5x barlow and Jupiter with 11mm T6 Nagler.

Now I appreciate the mantra about Saturn and higher mag (though seeing it so well at 350x was pretty darn good!) versus Jupiter/lower power but it all just made me reflect on what we see, what we expect to see, and what we actually get to see!

I should add that I wasn't doing any tracking, so Saturn zanging across my FOV would've made the detail discerned even more interesting.
um...so you're saying you saw Saturn and Jupiter okay last night?
I think the dude was asking about Mars though
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  #7  
Old 10-03-2008, 05:41 PM
Kokatha man
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betelguese....?

Quote:
Originally Posted by madtuna View Post
um...so you're saying you saw Saturn and Jupiter okay last night?
I think the dude was asking about Mars though
I do apologise madT - I thought I was around the mark with my comments by adding to those of the 2nd and 3rd posters......I see my error now, thanks; I realize I shoulda thrown in something relevant to the 4th post before I put that 5th one in.....shoulda made a mention about betelguese eh....?

Regards
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  #8  
Old 11-03-2008, 12:00 AM
Aces High (Mark)
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Thanks everyone

Thanks everyone.. When I seen Mars as a very tiny redish disk I was worried my new scope was faulty. I seen Saturn tonight it was nice to see, only one thing was strange.. when I used my 6mm eye piece I often seen double? Two Saturns just over lapping each other. The image was in focus and sharp. What was off, scope need adjusting? .. my eyes ? Astigmatism?
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  #9  
Old 11-03-2008, 12:59 AM
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skwinty (Steve)
E pur si muove

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aces High View Post
Thanks everyone.. When I seen Mars as a very tiny redish disk I was worried my new scope was faulty. I seen Saturn tonight it was nice to see, only one thing was strange.. when I used my 6mm eye piece I often seen double? Two Saturns just over lapping each other. The image was in focus and sharp. What was off, scope need adjusting? .. my eyes ? Astigmatism?
Keep one eye closed and stay off the beetle juice.
Regards
Steve
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  #10  
Old 11-03-2008, 08:27 AM
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rmcpb (Rob)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aces High View Post
Thanks everyone.. When I seen Mars as a very tiny redish disk I was worried my new scope was faulty. I seen Saturn tonight it was nice to see, only one thing was strange.. when I used my 6mm eye piece I often seen double? Two Saturns just over lapping each other. The image was in focus and sharp. What was off, scope need adjusting? .. my eyes ? Astigmatism?
If my scope is a bit out of collimation I have noticed that I tend to get double images of the brighter planets quite often. I would be checking the collimation again.

Cheers
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  #11  
Old 15-03-2008, 07:17 PM
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Astro78
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No expert but would guess it's your eyepiece or eyes. Only as the scope here has been out of collimation every which way but never seen that (but just read what Rob said, which contradicts that). Does it happen with your other EP's?

Add - see below from Wikipedia:

Internal reflection and scatter

"Internal reflections, sometimes called scatter, cause the light passing through an eyepiece to disperse and reduce the contrast of the image projected by the eyepiece. When the effect is particularly bad, "ghost images" are seen, called ghosting. For many years, simple eyepiece designs with a minimum number of internal air-to-glass surfaces were preferred to avoid this problem.
"
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