A Gallaxy disappearing forever.

[xelasnave]

Originally Posted by Stonius

I thought all electromagnetic forces were mediated by Bosons? The Graviton hasn't been discovered yet, but neither had the Higgs Boson until recently.

I think you are correct as to your first assumption ... that is if you are going to take the standard model over my ideas☺

I dont know the latest in the hunt for the graviton I will have a look.
Alex

[xelasnave]

It seems that there is no hope in finding one as the equipment required would involve enlisting a mass similar to that of Jupiter.
And then the GR folk really dont want it found as that would put them all out of work from yhe little I can understand.
So if this is indeed the case there will remain a large hole in the standard model.
Alex

[silv (Annette)]

But they or "we" are trying to detect actual gravity communication.
Think of LIGO https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LIGO as antenna for that special language / communication medium, no?

I like the way you think and express your thoughts. But it's a bit harsh assuming we are not trying to detect it at all.


LIGO doesn't necessarily have to be the antenna for actual gravitational communication.
It might "only" be an antenna for the result of such a communication when it influences its environment of known-to-us communicators and makes them whisper to each other: "Hey, have you heard what happened in a galaxy far far away?"

The disturbing thing - in your line of thought disturbing, I assume - with LIGO's 12 detections is that the sources were of 2 items which only "exist" theoretically to explain away gaps in the standard model: mergers of a) black holes and b) neutron stars.

[xelasnave]

Hi Annette

I dont think LIGO is at all interested in anything but a GR explaination...but I am trying to form opinions on matters I dont understand really.

But it does seem that if you mention " a mechanical explanation" or "the graviton" GR folk get somewhat defensive...but as I said I dont know.

I am not a fan of LIGO.

I see no virtue in continuing looking for gravity waves...they found gravity waves and can tell two black holes merged billions of light years away...who cares.

Lets spend the money on exploration of every place in the solar system to find life and at least understand different geologies.

Alex

[blindman]

Originally Posted by xelasnave

I think M31 is blue shifted.

Maybe there are others?

But if all we observe are red shifted galaxies I think that under the Big Bang Theory that means the Universe is expanding...under other models it could mean the discredited tired light idea is correct...I don't know what it means under say ancient Summerian cosmology.

Are you are suggesting the universe is expanding or do you have something else in mind?


I like red it is the colour of blood....mmm blood.
alex

Something else

[xelasnave]

There are about 200 others but M90, M86 and M98 are most notable from ourclocal group.
Alex

[silv (Annette)]

I see no virtue in continuing looking for gravity waves...they found gravity waves and can tell two black holes merged billions of light years away...who cares.

Hi Alex,
but you do care. You want to understand how gravity works and how it speaks. Detecting a symptom of a black hole merger here on earth helps understanding more. Not you and me. But them who are doing it professionally.

Lets spend the money on exploration of every place in the solar system to find life and at least understand different geologies.

Why not do both?
Even geologies in our solar system were and are affected by gravity. So understanding more of the latter expands knowledge of the former, as well.
ALMA was used to detect protoplanetary dust clouds, or rings rather, around young stars. Got published in a special issue of 12 articles just a few days ago.
https://export.arxiv.org/find/all/1/.../0/1/0/all/0/1


That helps understanding our solar system, too, I reckon. And in its wake maybe narrows down the search for ET on exoplanets.

But I get it that you're cranky that they or we are not focusing enough on gravity, rocks, dolphins and all the rest. *flower bouquet smiley*

[xelasnave]

Hi Annette.

I am a old man who cant live with others...its my job to be cranky and critical of all things and I take my job seriously☺.
And its hard work as there is just so much that deserves a pasting☺
I already know how gravity works☺ and I dont need any information that may conflict with what I already know...I dont want to have to sort thru and realise that this or that agrees with me and disregard anything that does not fit my view☺.
There would be just so much to throw out☺.

But finding life or not would be neat.
There may be an advanced civilization under some of that ice out there and yet we think recording a short bleeep and speculating one black hole was this big and the other was that big and they were 2 billion light years away...yawn...which means it was 2 billion years in the past....old news...not interesting, not useful and you cant mine it.

Thanks for the link and you have a nice day.
Alex

[xelasnave]

What I would find interesting is speculation as to the physical process in a black hole merger explained to show how the hypothetical gravitons crossed space to cause a fluctuation in space time and caused the beeeep.
Mass tells space how to move..how? How is that message transmitted?
I want move than observing the results I would like to know what is going on at a particle level...I enjoy the show but would likecto know how is the magic done.
Alex

[xelasnave]

For Blindman..7000 maybe

https://www.physicsforums.com/thread.../#post-2489760

[blindman]

Maybe you will have interest to see this interview...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=554TOFX3FW8
Let me know, interesting, isn't it?

[Stonius (Markus)]

Originally Posted by xelasnave

What I would find interesting is speculation as to the physical process in a black hole merger explained to show how the hypothetical gravitons crossed space to cause a fluctuation in space time and caused the beeeep.
Mass tells space how to move..how? How is that message transmitted?
I want move than observing the results I would like to know what is going on at a particle level...I enjoy the show but would likecto know how is the magic done.
Alex

I'm not sure I understand your objection. Do you accept Bosons operate in the mediation of other forces (strong, weak and electromagnetic)?

If so, is it a matter of distance (but photons travel large distances already, so there is precedent for that too).

If not, do you have issue with the idea of all Bosons?

Best

Markus

[xelasnave]

Originally Posted by blindman

Maybe you will have interest to see this interview...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=554TOFX3FW8
Let me know, interesting, isn't it?

Most interesting.

It is really scarey to think there are people like that out there...however they seem to be contained in nice facilities that look normal ...I thought no bars on the windows was a nice feature and I guess part of a philosophy to give these poor people some sence of dignity even though they are clearly insane.

I was on the edge of my seat waiting for proof of a flat Earth but sadly they must have run out of time.

Thanks for presenting the vid as it makes you realise just how lucky one is to be normal well adjusted and non delusional.

It is so sad folk like these lie and distort the simplest of facts to pad out a delusion that has no basis in reality.

They seem harmless but if folk like that were allowed they would herald in the next dark ages.
These attacks on science is alarming.


But one thing they are right in so far as each of us are the center of our observable universe but sadly those guys would not undetstand my meaning at all.

The author is a liar the interviewer is a fool they should remain locked up and well sedated.

Thank you for the vid once again but it does have me worried about leaving the house as it reminds me how many crazy people there are in the world.

And thanks for probably getting my thread closed by introducting religion which is against the rules ...you could be banned for a blatant breach of rules.
Alex

[xelasnave]

Originally Posted by Stonius

I'm not sure I understand your objection. Do you accept Bosons operate in the mediation of other forces (strong, weak and electromagnetic)?

If so, is it a matter of distance (but photons travel large distances already, so there is precedent for that too).

If not, do you have issue with the idea of all Bosons?

Best

Markus

Hi Markus

I do not have a problem with bosons at all.

The reason I refer to the graviton as hypothetical is because it is indeed hypothetical and the reason I ask for speculation is because as far as I am aware there is no model speculating with a hypothetical particle...a y views can only be speculative I would have thought.

What I am asking is ...does anyone have an idea how the boson may work and show how they would work in a black hole merger...a quantum explaination of gravity waves.

I am not disagreeing with anything I am just trying to be respectful of the science which has not included a graviton as far as I am aware.

What I am looking for is ...the current thinking is the graviton may work this way or that way and there would be millions or a few crossing space to regulate or pass on the message of gravity.

So no I worded my post out of respect for science not a lack of such or a disbelief in any aspect of the standard model.
Alex

[xelasnave]

Perhaps I should encourage members to look at the vid presented by blind man with a recommendation not to turn it off a short time in as one can get a hint at the problem science must recognise.

I saw a "talk" given by the chap in the vid and it is most alarming that his message is being told which is no more than lies lies and more lies.
His game is to take science and manipulate it and also various experiments to give a science approach to the destruction of science.

It is no wonder that flat earth is being taken up by idiots when folk like the chap in the vid is making folk think science is bunk.

The movement this chap appeals to must be seen as a real threat to civilization and if you think its all just hsrmless fun just think how the movement plays a huge roll in wheter or not action will be taken re climate change...to name one example.

But when you get folk presenting that the world is stationary and the center of the universe dont just write them off as nutters, which they are, but realise they appeal to between 2O% and 80% of the polulation of the most influential nation in the world.

Their lobbying will have more effect as time passes and as this mob gathers on their mind will be a good old book burning and perhaps a couple of public hangings.

Want to understand why Trump is in office well understand it is folk like these in the vid who we must thank.

Our rules here prevent a discussion but please realise that the problem is real and it is growing and promises a slide into another period of dark ages.

I hope this post does not get me banned but if it does the problem is greater than is healthy.
Alex