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Go Back   IceInSpace > Equipment > Eyepieces, Barlows and Filters

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Old 11-08-2015, 10:21 AM
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stefang (Stefan)
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Denkmeier 21mm 3D EyePieces (LOA) First Light review

I have recently acquired a set of the 21mm Lederman Optical Array 3D EyePieces from Denkmeier. L-O-A 21 (Lederman-Optical-Array) is a revolutionary new patent pending system that allows you to see The Deepsky in 3D!! I was fortunate to receive 1 of the first 20 pairs in the initial production run.

I post BillP's excellent technical review from CN below for those that are interested. I am in no way affiliated with Denkmeier or Russ Lederman, I am merely an amateur Australian astronomer.

http://www.cloudynights.com/page/art...eyepiece-r2997

I have reposted in its entirety, my first light review from Saturday night using this amazing invention. If anyone is at Wiruna this coming new moon weekend I will have them with me, come say hi and take a look. sG

=
Saturday evening I had the opportunity to experience first light with my LOA's with my TeleVue 127is under Southern Hemisphere skies near Sydney for the first time. While I will leave it to Eddgie and BillP to elaborate on the technical aspects of the array in all there technical glory, I wanted to provide a elementary commentary on my experience.

By way of background I took up Astronomy only recently, Sept 2014. As with any of my hobbies, I entered with gusto and enthusiasm. I have flipped, bought, and sold over 5 scopes in that time, experimenting with gear, seeing what I like what I don't, and what could be improved upon. I'm the first to admit that I have been very fortunate to be able to stand on the shoulder of giants while I have pursued this amazing hobby.

5 months ago I purchased a Denkmeier Binotron from Russ, and during the sale process, he alluded to something he was working on that would be unique and a game changer.

As a novice, you don't know what you don't know, so I stayed in touch, and made sure that I was on the waiting list for one of the first pairs to come of the production line. 3D viewing of astronomy targets was something that intrigued me, and with an extensive career in working in CGI Visual Effects for Motion Pictures (Happy Feet 2, Prometheus, 3 x Harry Potter films, Great Gatsby etc) I thought I'd be well placed to see if the LOA's stood up to the chatter.

Saturday night, reasonable conditions (18.86 according to the Sky Quality meter), from my backyard, my NP127is, Gibralter 5 mount, and the LOA's. I used them with a Baader Clicklock Mirror Star Diagonal and Denkmeier Binotron with 45-OCS.

War driving to Sagittarius, and Scorpius, I sat on my chair, Headphones on listening to Hans Zimmers "InterStellar" sound track, and I swam!

I swam in one of the most enthralling visual eye candy experiences I have had as yet in this amazing hobby. I think i sat around NGC6231 (Jewel Box) for a good 40 mins, playing with the LOA moving it between Near and Far with Array EP, watching as the stars resolved, and the depth of field changed, catching the difference and subtleties of the arrays effects around the FOV with each 180 degree turn.

The LOA's truly facilitate swimming in the cosmos. Life is about experiences, and the LOA's provide the user with an experience that to date is the closest to a "SpaceWalk" experience that I have had to date. First light with the LOA's was as Ah ha moment, an order of magnitude greater than the first time I looked through a 31mm Nagler 5 through my EdgeHD 11 at Orion.

I do have a full set of TV Ethos's that up until Saturday night I thought we the closest to Space Walking EP's available. Not anymore!

I think for purists, they may find excuses why they don't like them, but for the sheer experience of diving into a world that seems only that much closer, more real, and more tactile I can't for a moment not recommend you have the experience. Now I have read the comments around "its fake 3D, its not precise et al. I'd like to say to the community, a rainbow is also an optical illusion, but does it make any less beautiful?

As the forum lists say "Seeing is believing". As a new participant in this pastime, I must say, my universe has opened up that much more from the experience of the LOA. If you get the chance, take a look, and don't be afraid if the first 15 minutes of your seeing is spent ranting expletives that would make a merchant marine blush. Its all good!

Clear Skies.
Stefan
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  #2  
Old 13-08-2015, 07:19 AM
WilliamPaolini
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I think your NP127 is perhaps a perfect scope for these eyepieces too! Wide field and nice aperture. Congrats on going 3D
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  #3  
Old 17-12-2018, 08:04 AM
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Rather than start a new thread I thought I would tack onto this thread by Stefan....

I recently bought a pair of LOA 21mm "3D" eyepieces (Thanks Andrew ) to see what the fuss was about.....

The planned First Light on Saturday at Charlotte Pass, KNP, was beset with a sky coated in the red soil of the interior but thankfully that cleared and gave a pristine sky over Canberra and the Brindabella Mountains last night

I set up the Baby BiTSA on its AZ-EQ6GT in the twilight at Mount Stromlo
and watched the moon with normal eyepieces (Tak LE30, LE7.5 and Pentax XF8.5) while waiting the sky to darken....

Once it got a little darker I swapped in the LOA21s.......
I wasn't expecting much given the Moon was doing its best to light up the sky so I dialled in M42 which I had heard was a good target for these '3D' gadgets.

The eyepiece is designed so that ,by rotating it 180 in the focuser, the centre area can be made either recede into the background or to sit ahead of the field stars around it. The are also 4 other segments that placed the surroundings at differing depths...

The effect is actually sensational and the fact that this is an artificial 3D representation of the target area takes nothing away from the fact that it is an enjoyable way to see familiar object in a different way.

The other targets where the effect was very good were 47Tuc, Eta Carina, Jewel Box, M45 but the biggest surprise to me was when I centred 46P-Wirtanen in the array and brought the comet to the 'foreground'.

In this position I was able to see the comet much more clearly and as a slightly elongated object. While M42 and 3372 looked better with the centre receding, the comet looked as if plucked out of the background stars to be examined more closely.

I then went back to 47 Tuc which had improved as the sky darkened and used the same 'Near' setting which had the globular floating in the space between me and the background ...... this made it easier to discern star colours around the core...

During the evening several CAS members turned up as well as the MSO Security officer so we all took turns at the eyepieces until well after midnight........ (after which I retired to the comfort of my motorhome for a hot cuppa and a sleep before heading off the mountain in the morning)

Cheers,
Matt


P.S. For those who haven't been at MSO at night, there are hundreds of kangaroos, rabbits and wallabies and though I have spent most of my life camping in the bush, it still sends a chill down one's spine when a large male kangaroo creeps up behind you and then announces his presence scraping the ground and grunting only a few feet behind you !!!! My pulse went from its resting 58 to double that in a few milliseconds...
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Old 17-12-2018, 10:02 AM
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FlashDrive (Col)
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Matt ...Good Review ... sounds like a 3D trip into Space.
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Old 17-12-2018, 03:44 PM
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ab1963 (Andrew)
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Wait when you throw them into the big dob Matt......
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Old 18-12-2018, 08:23 PM
Wilso (Darren)
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Nice reviews Stefan and Matt,

Very enjoyable and haven't seen any reviews about these eyepieces.
Just wondering if your observing session was reduced using these eyepieces?
I have noticed watching anything in 3D for a long period I suffer from eye fatigue.
Also have you tried the mono eyepiece (the one without adjustment) for viewing? These are also available and was wondering how they preform compared to other eyepieces / 5 element & 3 group ones you have?

Most interested
Thanks
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Old 19-12-2018, 07:04 AM
gaseous (Patrick)
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I've got the 21mm and 32mm LOA eyepieces, and the effects are amazing. As Matt said, the artificial nature of the 3D view takes nothing away from the experience, and is quite breathtaking. Familiar objects are given a new appreciation, and otherwise 'so-so' targets become a lot more interesting. 47Tuc in a 20" dob is something else.
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Old 19-12-2018, 07:18 AM
Kunama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilso View Post
Nice reviews Stefan and Matt,

Very enjoyable and haven't seen any reviews about these eyepieces.
Just wondering if your observing session was reduced using these eyepieces?
I have noticed watching anything in 3D for a long period I suffer from eye fatigue.
Also have you tried the mono eyepiece (the one without adjustment) for viewing? These are also available and was wondering how they preform compared to other eyepieces / 5 element & 3 group ones you have?

Most interested
Thanks
The 'non 3d' eyepiece on its own is actually very good, it has a 65 apparent field and is very good on axis and most of the way to the edge.
but I did not use it singly for very long.
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  #9  
Old 19-12-2018, 07:53 AM
Kunama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ab1963 View Post
Wait when you throw them into the big dob Matt......
I am tempted to do just that, just need to find a GPC to get it to focus....
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  #10  
Old 19-12-2018, 02:27 PM
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MattT (Matthew)
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I have had a love hate relationship with binoviewers for the last seven years.

Earlier this year I decided to ditch them for good.

So Andrew, Im curious, if the LOA 21s were so good, why did you sell them?

I always thought they were a trick that one would grow tired of quickly.
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Old 19-12-2018, 03:04 PM
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ab1963 (Andrew)
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Hi Matt
About 2yrs ago i tried to buy a 1978 hand made Fylde Goodfellow acoustic guitar and the deal was in the bag then he got cold feet so to speak and i was gutted but the opportunity arose again a couple of weeks ago amazingly ,You can buy them new "Massive waiting list"but you cannot buy 40yrs worth of tonal maturity so i had to sell quite a few items i didn't want sell to fund the purchase of this very special acoustic guitar that i now have and TBH would have sold all my astronomy gear to get my hands on it as i could replace all my astro gear in time but not that guitar.
Definitely didn't want to sell them as they are amazing but had to go for the greater good and could not have ended up in better hands
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Old 19-12-2018, 03:30 PM
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MattT (Matthew)
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Ahh....yes can understand selling to get something else, specially a musical instrument. Are you an amateur guitarist?

So if Stefan is still around....what do you think of these eyepieces now ? Still as amazing as first sight,or something else?
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