Waste of life and potential

[graham.hobart (Graham stevens)]

So they executed Myuran and Andrew.
South East Asia's drugs cartels will still grind on unhappily.
Those with a literal biblical bent may say "an eye for an eye"
others May say if they can't do the (eternal) time, don't do the crime.
Here's what I say. Or rather Portia in The Merchant of Venice " by Wm Shakespeare ...
The quality of mercy is not strain'd
It droppeth as the gentle rain from heaven
Upon the place beneath : it is twice blessed;
It blesseth him that gives and him that takes
After all the comradery of recent national days we let two reformed and inspiring ( in the prison system , no one was asking for a pardon, just another chance) prisoners get mowed down - for what ?
Mercy costs us nothing. We have all been given a second chance at something.
I find it utterly repulsive. My 2 cents
And before anyone wades in with the " you haven't seen the harm drugs do " yes I have , for a number of years it was my job.
Yet I say again, mercy.
Second chances folks. Redemption. New starts .
A 24 yr old and a 21 yr old when arrested. Hardly international drug baron material, but even so, how many mistakes on the road to adUlthood?
Graz

[LewisM]

I feel the same.

Killing the people who are in it just for money (to what end they use that money varies) - the mules - is pointless and does NOTHING whatsoever to hinder the industry - there will always be others willing to risk it.

In short, killing does nothing to the drug industry at all. It's just a pointless, stupid temporary knee-jerk reaction to a problem.

[AstralTraveller (David)]

I'm old enough to remember Nixon declaring 'war on drugs' back in 1971. Forty four years later drug use is more prevalent than it was then and there are more dangerous drugs available. The 'war' hasn't worked! All we have done is transfer truly astronomical amounts of money to crime lords, entrench corruption in our police and politicians and ruin, or end, a lot of lives. We need a new strategy.

BTW I agree with the sentiments of the OP but I think Graham has misrepresented the intent of Matthew 5:28. The New King James text says:

38 “You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.’ 39 But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. 40 If anyone wants to sue you and take away your tunic, let him have your cloak also. 41 And whoever compels you to go one mile, go with him two. 42 Give to him who asks you, and from him who wants to borrow from you do not turn away.

I don't have a religious bone in my body and I don't fully agree with these sentiments (and the rest of Matthew 5 has some pretty awful stuff) but it isn't expressing approval for vengeful behaviour.

[Regulus (Trevor)]

A waste. And there are others sitting in gaol for abetting them in the attempt. They may not have been good people then, but I think they grew up and 'grew' to be good people.
Indonesia has lost out here given the work they were doing with prisoners. They (Indonesia) wants the rehabilitation programs they started continued, but without the head, the body will die.
For the sake of their own prison system they should have let them live.

[OzStarGazer]

They rehabilitated them just to kill them. It sounds absurd. Really.

[linstar88 (Linda and Guy)]

This is a very intelligent approach to understanding some of the problems faced associated with drug addicts/users & social ridicule of these victims. We need more people like Dr. Gabor Mate to stand up & speak out for any real positive changes to take effect.
Hope this short clip sheds some light on a dark subject for some.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfR3v7inC7Y

"Ignorance is mankind's greatest sin"
quote from Gautama Buddha (founder of Buddhism)

Peace

Guy

[BPO]

Or... Don't traffic illegal narcotics in countries with death penalties for such offenses. We demand foreigners respect our own laws whenever they visit.

[timelord (Al)]

Any one considered what if they had gotten away with it? 8 mill worth of heroin would have caused some major misery for lots of people and in the meantime rehab for these two cashed up scumbags would not be an option but a route to more criminallity.
As for the death penalty if it was ok for the Bali bombers then---------

[barx1963 (Malcolm)]

Originally Posted by BPO

Or... Don't traffic illegal narcotics in countries with death penalties for such offenses. We demand foreigners respect our own laws whenever they visit.

Yes, that is true, and no one is asking the Indonesians not to enforce there laws. The death penalty is only one option under the law there. They have a whole system of clemency options available under their law, and these 2 guys from what I could see where prime candidates for clemency. The rules were put there to allow for cases of rehabilitation to be recognised by the granting of clemency, but it wasn't politically convenient to do so.
One of the reasons why I strongly oppose the death penalty is that it ends up becoming a political toy, using it to demonstrate "toughness" is too easy.

Malcolm

[BPO]

Originally Posted by barx1963

Yes, that is true, and no one is asking the Indonesians not to enforce there laws. The death penalty is only one option under the law there. They have a whole system of clemency options available under their law, and these 2 guys from what I could see where prime candidates for clemency. The rules were put there to allow for cases of rehabilitation to be recognised by the granting of clemency, but it wasn't politically convenient to do so.
One of the reasons why I strongly oppose the death penalty is that it ends up becoming a political toy, using it to demonstrate "toughness" is too easy.

Malcolm

They knowingly trafficked illegal narcotics in a country that regularly executes drug offenders. I'm no fan or advocate of capital punishment, but these guys knew exactly what they were getting themselves into. Would the people who demanded clemency for this pair have cared about them if they weren't Australians? Not likely.

[GrahamL]

I think i was 20 when I found a friend I'd grown up with dead of a heroin overdose , he happened to live behind me at the time and I'd check on him as I knew how his life had derailed , nothing pretty about his death , he'd some sort of hemorrhage as he died , coughed blood everywhere on that lime green pillow he lay on . The sureal talk with police in the back yard as they packed him away ,picking up the bunch of toe tags dropped on the floor and all the other stuff , all the medical gloves thrown at a bin in the bathroom , missed completely , at days end go pick his step daughter up from school.

My friends younger brother lost it after the death and jumped a bridge a couple of years later I heard.

I thought often of these two recently and still can't come round to thinking that state sanctioned killing is either an answer or a deterrent to involvement in narcotics .

[Hagar (Doug)]

Some really mixed emotions on this topic. I don't see the execution achieved anything but had they not been caught how many of our children may have died as a result of their actions.

[doppler (Rick)]

Originally Posted by timelord

Any one considered what if they had gotten away with it? 8 mill worth of heroin would have caused some major misery for lots of people and in the meantime rehab for these two cashed up scumbags would not be an option but a route to more criminallity.
As for the death penalty if it was ok for the Bali bombers then---------

Did any of the bali bombers get death sentences?

http://www.businessinsider.com.au/it...on-them-2015-2

I would have thought it would have been better policing for the AFP to keep quiet and follow the mules back to their final destination in Australia and try and get some of king pins?

[AndrewJ]

Any one considered what if they had gotten away with it?

Yep, but in this case, the AFP knew exactly what was going on.
All they had to do was walk up to them when boarding and whisper in their ears that they would be undergoing a full body search when they came back.

One interesting thing also mentioned today ( that i had not heard before and am not 100% sure is true ) was that some of the people bringing drugs into Indonesia who were caught have been given life sentences, but those coming to take it out got death.
If that is true, then there is something seriously wrong.
If those executed today were taking drugs in, i could possibly understand what has happened, but not when they were going there to get the drugs.
I suspect they were just used as berley, and when the big fish weren't caught, someone had to suffer to "save face".
Time will tell

Andrew

[clive milne]

Originally Posted by doppler

I would have thought it would have been better policing for the AFP to keep quiet and follow the mules back to their final destination in Australia and try and get some of king pins?

That strategy didn't work out so well for Gary Webb and Dany Casolaro.

http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/08/...witcher=mobile

So there is that.

[clive milne]

Meanwhile, in Afghanistan:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/28/wo...anted=all&_r=0

[clive milne]

https://clareflourish.files.wordpres...ghan-opium.jpg

[marc4darkskies (Marcus)]

Originally Posted by graham.hobart

...
The quality of mercy is not strain'd
It droppeth as the gentle rain from heaven
Upon the place beneath : it is twice blessed;
It blesseth him that gives and him that takes

What beautiful, gentle words! Many would do well to commit them to memory! They contrast so starkly with the brutality, cruelty and senselessness of this horrible event. The decision to go ahead with the executions last night sickened me. A shamefully inhumane and ignorant decision IMO.

Though I happen to be a supporter of the death penalty for the most heinous and premeditated of murders and when there is no doubt about guilt, no sentence should preclude the administering of mercy and compassion when it is so clearly earned as it was, by all accounts, in this case.

[hobbit]

Originally Posted by Kunama

Hopefully this will make others think a little more about their future when being offered these courier jobs. There certainly is no deterrent value in the Australian legal system, if these people had brought the 8Kg of heroin into Australia they would have been back on the street peddling the stuff within 4 years.

From the commonwealth criminal code

Subdivision C--Possessing border controlled drugs or border controlled plants reasonably suspected of having been unlawfully imported

307.8 Possessing commercial quantities of border controlled drugs or border controlled plants reasonably suspected of having been unlawfully imported

(1) A person commits an offence if:

(a) the person possesses a substance; and

(b) the substance is reasonably suspected of having been unlawfully imported; and

(c) the substance is a border controlled drug or border controlled plant; and

(d) the quantity possessed is a commercial quantity.

Penalty: Imprisonment for life or 7,500 penalty units, or both

Whilst I'm against the death penalty in general, I'm very much against implementing when the case is still before the courts.

[AndrewJ]

There is a very good reason they don't whisper in their ear, it is to give the Indonesian Police an opportunity to try to find out who is supplying the drugs to these mules.

That didnt work very well tho did it, and if as stated, the ones they have caught bringing stuff in werent given death sentences, why not???

Many people believe part of the reason is the police/army etc are getting a cut, just as they were with people trafficking.
I suspect what really goes on there is far more incestuous than we are being told at present. It will be interesting to see what facts/accusations on what really happened start leaking out, now that there is no need to be polite.

Andrew