best Telescope for view my cattle?

[shack living]

Interested to know everyones thoughts on a good setup for keeping an eye on my cows. Our property is a very steep hill (unaccessable by vehicle) and I was thinking it would be handy to use a telescope to view them from the bottom (distance would be between 300m and 1.5km). I am wanting to see them up close to see they are okay and not having problems calving etc. I have a old set of binoculars, but they are pretty much useless, not nearly enough detail or magnification.

[Big Dave (Dave)]

Probably a better set of quality binoculars would be best

[Alchemy (Clive)]

Probably better getting a spotting scope, a sort of refractor but made for birders, target shooters etc, variable power for some of them, not quite an astronomical scope....... But you are not doing astronomy. Most of the major retailers of astro instruments could help you.

Something like this. https://www.bintelshop.com.au/Catalo...tting%20scopes

[dannat (Daniel)]

binos will not really provide enough mag at 1.5km, 20x80 lightweight would be ok up to nearly 1km i reckon
HOW MUCH detail do you need to see?
whats best is to try some different binos/scopes ? where are you located? here is some advice - keep in mind everyone has a slightly different preference

on a recent trip to the US i took my 90mm maksutov cassegrain, i was viewing a grizzly a mile away feeding on a bison carcass - i could see detail in the fur, its eye, its breath on the cold morning & the 2 ravens under its belly trying to pick at scraps. i had this at 75x magnification.
the guy next to me had a swarovski spotting scope ($3000) & at 60x - he was struggling to see what i could though his view was a little crisper.

a maksutov spotting scope is the best value imo, though the fixed power ep's give crisper views. Andrews Communication use to have a 70mm mak at a great price with fixed power but its no longer available

a refractor spotting scope has a shorter focal length & its much harder to push up the magnification-they show deficiencies in the cheaper eyepieces more than the maksutov due to there shorter focal length

here is a link to what i have http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Meade-ETX-Mak...#ht_1281wt_883, though its difficult to mount - here is something similar http://cgi.ebay.com.au/1200-90-Seben...item4cf23e1ece

these are outside Oz, if you look up www.andrewscom.com.au - goto telescopes, then celestron - at the bottom there are some spotting scopes, a few of which are maksutov's - also this other Oz scope dealer has a konus mak http://members.ozemail.com.au/~aecclaudio/konus.htm Claudio is good to deal with & could recommend a decent fixed power eyepiece {keep in imnd you don't need the GOTO mount which is used for locating stars}. I have just looked claudio has a 65mm argus maksutov in the MISc section ts only 14x mag, you could ask him if he has other eyepieces to fit {some scopes do not take normal 1.25" eyepieces)

ONe eyepiece type i use which doesn't cost the earth is the orthoscopic type - it has less field of view, but is very sharp on objects - you can scan around the diff cattle. a plossl is also reasonably priced, bit more field of view than ortho but slightly less sharp

PLEASe keep in mind whatever you get you will need to mount it on a decent photo tripod , once you have a scope get a tripod that can handle atleast ~1.5kg above the weight of the scope you get..one with a video style fluid head (long handle) is easiest to use

[shack living]

thankyou for the feedback so far.
* is the magnification exact, in that 60x means that a calf 1 metre tall will appear 60 metres tall compared to what the naked eye sees?
* I have a heavy manfrotto tripod, so no problems for stability
* I researched the C65 Mini Maksutov, specs were impressive but comes up with really bad reviews unfortunately
* closest major town is Albury/Wodonga, could see if I can find some shops that sell suitable optics?

[wavelandscott (Scott)]

You might give the folks at BINTEL a call in Sydney (also a shop in Melbourne)...I've always found them to be very helpful and they stock a wide variety of scopes and or binos.

[Waxing_Gibbous (Peter)]

You could be me! But probably wouldn't want to.
I think the Minimak, could well be too 'mini'. I found in low light situations that 80mm is a sensible minimum so, I suggest an 80-100mm spotting scope as this apeture range will give you the extra light needed around dusk when cattle, at least ours, start their hi-jinx.
I have a Barska Blackhawk 22-70x, 100mm purchased abroad from Opticsplanet. Its weatherproof and the zoom capability is very helpful. It doesn't suck on stars though has not quite the resolution of dedicated refractor in that apeture range. It allows me to see a calf on our hill 1km away in fine detail. I can even see the grass they're munching.
The only problem with using a "proper" telescope is that they are rarely if ever weatherproofed or even resistant, and when was the last time your cattle behaved in wet weather?
Just my 2 cents, but though I have a perfectly awesome 120mm refractor, I still use the Blackhawk for 99% of keeping an eye on our bolshie livestock.
Good Luck!
Peter

[astro744]

Originally Posted by shack living

thankyou for the feedback so far.
* is the magnification exact, in that 60x means that a calf 1 metre tall will appear 60 metres tall compared to what the naked eye sees?
* I have a heavy manfrotto tripod, so no problems for stability
* I researched the C65 Mini Maksutov, specs were impressive but comes up with really bad reviews unfortunately
* closest major town is Albury/Wodonga, could see if I can find some shops that sell suitable optics?

Look at it this way: 60x magnification will make an object appear 60x closer. Therefore a cow 1500m away will appear as if it was 25m away. You need a good aperture to get good brightness at 60x. I recommend 80mm minimum but for your application a zoom would be highly recommended to get wider fields for searching and then close-up for examining. You could do this by changing eyepieces though.

Talk to BINTEL about a quality 80mm spotting scope or get an ED80 and a 8-24mm quality zoom eyepiece. This will give you 25x to 75x magnification with good brightness.

[Miaplacidus (Brian)]

Bare in mind that, depending on the telescope you use, the view that you get will be either inverted left-right or up-side-down. You will need to use a specific type of prism diagonal in order to correct the image through the eyepiece. Binoculars already have these built in, but astro telescopes don't.

Cheers,
Brian.

[dannat (Daniel)]

the correct image prism is called an erect image diagonal or erect prism..most are at 45 deg from the scope, it is fairly comfortable to look thru, i am originally from Wagga -there aren't too many scope suppliers in alb/wodonga area - there is an astro society though ww.asaw.org.au - if you contact them they may have some members who have scopes similar to what you are looking for...these is also a birders group up there though i can't remember there exact name - many birders now have spotting scopes - they may have one for you to try - it will probably be cheaper for you to buy from a melb/syd retailer - but better if you have a good idea what works for you first

[space oddity]

Have you checked if the binos have fungus in them? Fungus looks like little filaments. It is not that difficult to clean them out yourself. Professional cleaning will probably cost more than the binos are worth.
Binoculars have 2 big advantages- both eyes are used and portability.The upside down problem is corrected with a a prism.
15 x 70 s would probably be the minimum specification. All depends on how much detail you need. A novel solution to the Mak spotting scope portability problem is a gorillapod- just wrap the legs around a tree branch or the door of the ute. They come in a range of holding powers up to 5kg . I have just ordered a 5kg hold gorillapod from the USA for my 300mm f/2.8 camera rig.
A zoom eyepiece, wheras the sharpness of image will not be razor sharp, has the advantage of portability and simplicity.
Last option is a barlow type lens to bayonet on the end of a telephoto lens. This will act like a monocular. Higher quality can be achieved by adapting a telescope eypiece to the back of a decent fast telephoto lens. If you have the lens, this will be a cheap and portable rig although the image will be fairly dark.The bigger the front element size the better. Should be minimum 77mm.
***Now, very important. Do not let the P.C. brigade know that you are spying on your cattle- they will howl in protest that their privacy is being invaded and their civil rights violated. Be sure that the cattle are fully informed and consent to be spied on forms are signed in triplicate. Parental consent will be required for spying on calves. Under no circumstances should photos be taken- all hell will break loose if these images land on the net for vealophiles to slobber over.

[noswonky (Peter)]

I wonder if it's possible to collimate on a defocused cow.

[The_Cat (Jeremy)]

Hello Lydia,

Some numbers for you. To see your cows in detail you want (carving etc) consider this:

At 1500 metres a span of 5M is an angle of 0.2 degree. A distortion less view means that the view in your eyepiece should be less than 57 degrees. Now choose a good ep with a view of 45 degrees then you need a magnification of x235. What this means you need a pretty good 'scope to accomplish this.

An ED80 with a very good 2 - 3 mm ep will do the job.

Jeremy.

Addition: The viewing diagonal should be a prism diagonal and NOT a mirror (star) diagonal .

[shack living]

thanks for all the replies.
After a lot of research I decided to get a Nikon Spotting Scope to use on a tripod.

[GrampianStars (Rob)]

IMO for cows the best would be a
Ruger mini 30 with a 10 x 44 Zeiss scope

will make catching the mobile steaks quick and easy

[dannat (Daniel)]

the nikon spotting scope is a good choice, did you get the zoom or fixed ep?

[Allan_L (Allan)]

Originally Posted by noswonky

I wonder if it's possible to collimate on a defocused cow.

Sorry for the off topic!

But that is just so good a post !!!