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Old 29-09-2010, 04:54 PM
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mental4astro (Alexander)
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October Obs. Challenge- a little bit more...

Hi all,

September's Challenge turned into something really, really special. I'm amazed, dumbstruck and humbled at the reaction and contribution. I can only hope to be able to contribute a sketch to it soon too, if life & clouds would only co-operate...

Encouraged, this month's Challenge sees a few more targets on offer, to wider range of instruments and levels of experience, to have a go at sketching. Orestis' sketch binocular sketch of the "Coathanger" cluster inspired me to select a couple of objects specially suited to binoculars, or rich-field-telescopes (RFT's):

http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...ad.php?t=65906

The other targets, though none an absolute visual challenge, they all offer different qualities for all sizes and types of scopes.

Binocular/RFT targets:

Helix Nebula, NGC 7293, in Aquarius. The largest, and presumably the closest, planetary nebula in the sky. It is large and faint, yet binos and RFT's are the best tools to see it with.

Small Magellanic Cloud, NGC 292, & surrounds, in Tucana & Hydrus. This satelite galaxy of our Milky Way is so detailed. Sure it can be seen in scopes, but the whole thing in the one field of view is only possible in binos or an RFT, again it is so big. Along with its big brother, the LMC, I like to call this region of the sky "the killing fields", as both these satellite galaxies are in the process of being devoured by our monster Milky Way, but also the "skeletal remains" of another galaxy lies in the field of view of the SMC, 47 Tuc, the second largest Globular Cluster in the sky. Now believed to be the remant core of a galaxy long ago consumed by the Milky Way. The SMC has a second 'companion' globular NGC 362, a smaller, more 'normal' globular.

Telescope targets:

M16, the Eagle nebula, in Serpens Cauda. Another cluster/nebula combination similar to M8. The challenge for larger scopes is to make out the dark pilars and bok globuals that form the "Eagle".

Grus Cluster, NGC 7582/90/99, in Grus. A relatively bright trio of galaxies that easily fit into a low magnification eyepiece.

NGC 253 & NGC 55, in Sculptor. The Sculptor Galaxy, NGC 253, is one very large, nearly edge-on spiral. Its elongated shape can be seen even in a 2" scope from a dark site. Larger scopes will begin to make out a mottled structure. NGC 55 is also large & lenticlular in shape, but it is an irregular galaxy.

Saturn Nebula, NGC 7009, in Aquarius. So named for its gaseous shell resembles a faint ringed planet. Not as large as the Ring Nebula, but if you've seen Saturn, this one will make you do a double-take and say 'what the...' .

Any other suggestions?

A handy gizmo to help with binocular viewing is a binocular/tripod adaptor. Some binos have a thread on them that allows for one of these adaptors to be used to attach them to a photo-tripod.

Clear skies, and happy sketching,

Mental.

PS, any suggestions for other Challenge themes? I fear I may not be able to prepare a challenge sometime soon, so, anyone happy to dip their toe lest one month there isn't a Challenge, that Orestis had so enthusiatically reserected!

Last edited by mental4astro; 30-09-2010 at 11:49 AM. Reason: typo
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Old 29-09-2010, 05:40 PM
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Ro84 (Roberto)
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Very nice selection!

Using your 'southern' perspective, I suggest for binoculars two more objects that I enjoyed when I was near the equator. Even if they are not at the top in this period, october is also a good month to see (and sketch) them.

NGC 6397 in Ara: a nice and brilliant globular cluster, and one of the closest one to our solar system, at 2200 pc (7200 ly). Using telescopes it can be partially resolved into stars.

NGC 6025, between Norma and Triangulum Australe: this very elonged open cluster at the edge of Milky Way seems to have an age similar to the Pleiades. Nice both with binoculars and small reflectors, the brightest stars are 9th magnitude. NGC 6025, at 830 pc (2700 ly), may belong to an inter-arm region of our Galaxy, or at the external edge of the Sagittarius Arm.

Last edited by Ro84; 29-09-2010 at 07:20 PM.
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Old 29-09-2010, 11:10 PM
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michaellxv (Michael)
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Challenge accepted. Hopefully october is a better month for getting out under the stars.
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Old 30-09-2010, 06:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michaellxv View Post
Challenge accepted. Hopefully october is a better month for getting out under the stars.
Agreed,Can't wait.

Orestis
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Old 30-09-2010, 11:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mental4astro View Post

NGC 293 & NGC 55, in Sculptor. The Sculptor Galaxy, NGC 293, is one very large, nearly edge-on puppy. Its lenticular shape can be seen even in a 2" scope from a dark site. Larger scopes will begin to make out a mottled structure. NGC 55 is also large & lenticlular in shape, but it is an irregular galaxy.
Did you mean NGC 253? Both NGC 253 and NGC 55 are large visually and elongated due to their side on tilt. I wouldn't refer to them as lenticular.
NGC 253 is also a binocular target.

Regards, Rob
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Old 30-09-2010, 11:48 AM
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253!! Ta, Rob

No, they are not leticular. 253 is a big spiral, 55 irregular. I've reread my first post & I'll make a couple of edits to clarify.
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Old 01-10-2010, 12:47 AM
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Thanks Alexander.
A few more suggestions.
The GC NGC 288 near NGC 253.
The galaxies NGC 300 and NGC 7793 near NGC 55.
The Veil nebula.
Here is a rough "map" and some images.
http://picasaweb.google.com.au/dunlo...hernObservers#
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Old 05-10-2010, 10:58 AM
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BUMP
Just thought i'll push this thread up as it is October.

regards orestis
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Old 06-10-2010, 10:20 AM
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Gonna hafta shift my red led finder to the 10 " and pray to the rain gods so I can have a go at this.
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Old 06-10-2010, 11:17 AM
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My first session with a scope in close to two months, and I managed a sketch of NGC 253, ok, Rob?

I'll post the thing in the next couple of days.

Copped a great transit of a Jovian moon. Both the eclipse shadow, and the moon were visible. Only because of the close-to-opposition position of Jupiter could this be possible. The eclipse shadow was decidedly "black", with the moon being a little lighter. Freaky coincidence as it was my last gasp view as the clouds started to roll in. I viewed this with my 17.5" scope. Conditions weren't fantastic, but I did manage the occasional clear view at 333X. The sighting occured between 11:40pm and 12:00am, eastern summer time.

Hickny was over at my place with his 13.1" scope, where we doing the deed. The transit shadow was clearly visible, but the moon was alot more difficult to spot.

I'll add a sketch of this sighting too.

As both Hickny's and mine big dobs are open truss scopes, I'll try using a solid tube 8" scope as a test scope as we had an aweful time trying to spot the Grus galaxy complex given in the Challenge. Last year, when my big scope was still a solid tube type, and with an 8" f/6 solid tube dob, these galaxies were quite easy to spot from my place one year ago. Have things gotten so bad in just one year here in Sydney?

Mental.
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Old 06-10-2010, 01:47 PM
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Nice going Alex.

looking forward to the sketch.

Regards orestis
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Old 06-10-2010, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mental4astro View Post

As both Hickny's and mine big dobs are open truss scopes, I'll try using a solid tube 8" scope as a test scope as we had an aweful time trying to spot the Grus galaxy complex given in the Challenge. Last year, when my big scope was still a solid tube type, and with an 8" f/6 solid tube dob, these galaxies were quite easy to spot from my place one year ago. Have things gotten so bad in just one year here in Sydney?

Mental.
Funny you mention that Alexander, I ask myself the same thing these days. 6mths ago I used naked eye some objects that I no longer can do, and the sky was blacker. Nowadays the sky isn't so black (suburbia black if that makes sense), and more on the grey and purplish glow side. Hubby seems to think its all the lighting coming off the new improved Ipswich Motorway. Perhaps there's some roadworks that have been carried out your way?
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Old 07-10-2010, 11:55 AM
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Here is my sketch of NGC 253, done from my home in Sydney on 5th of October using Odessius, my 17.5" f/4.5 scope and a GSO Superview 2" 30mm eyepiece.

The scope showed a brighter central hub, and one side of the galaxy a hint of a band of a dark dusty streak of one of the arms. There were a few superimposed, very faint stars. I was surprised at the amount of detail I could see, and averted vision was the only way to see it. A little squint when viewing the picture gives a better representation of the view through the scope.

This was a very dewy night. I was most impressed with the dew zapping system I've added to Odessius. All the optics that were rigged up were kept dry. The one finder not hooked up & Hickny's scope needed the occassional burst from a hair drier. The scopes ended up dripping from dew, and the dew zapper and hair drier duo kept our cyclops's seeing over four hours.

The sketch of Jupiter will follow soon.
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Old 07-10-2010, 12:42 PM
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Lovely sketch, as always, Alexander. Very impressive observing from Sydney skies. It must be quite a challenge.

Here are my sketches of a couple of the October challenge objects - the Grus trio and Saturn nebula. I'm really starting to to enjoy the process of res-sketching onto black paper with white pastels. There are a few tricks to learn in this and it doesn't seem as easy to control as graphite on white. I find that making a mark with pastel pencil and then softening and shaping it with a smudge stick seems to work OK. But it's harder to remove mistakes.

Anyway, here are my latest efforts. Both obs with 16" dob and dark skies. Any suggestions/critiques are most welcome.
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Old 07-10-2010, 12:52 PM
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mental4astro (Alexander)
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Oh, yeah, Paddy! Cool stuff those sketches.

It's all practice & trial & error.

This last sketch I actually "layered". I started with a grey colouring pencil to get the really soft "glow" effect, then used a white pencil for the brighter areas and highlights. I really found it much, much easier to control the onto-black drawing this way. A bit like the reverse of drawing onto white paper where you start dark and then work down the softening shades.

It was almost 'spooky' when I laid down the grey after placing the stars!
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Old 07-10-2010, 01:31 PM
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Thanks Alex, that's a great tip. I find getting the soft glow the hardest, so now I have another tool.
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Old 07-10-2010, 03:25 PM
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Excellent sketches guys well done,

Can't wait to do some sketches of these objects.

regards orestis
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Old 07-10-2010, 06:59 PM
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Thanks for posting your sketches fellas, love seeing how others see DSOs.

Paddy, have you tried scanning your pencil sketches and inverting it in an image processing program? That way you still get the advantages of a pencil with the realistic white on black effect.

Here's my sketch of NGC 253 from last weekend with the 12". I can only imagine the view from a dark sky...
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Old 07-10-2010, 10:01 PM
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Great sketch Sab and incredible detail on those dark lanes. I reckon what you'd pick up at a dark site would be amazing.

re your question, up until the last few sketches, that's what I have been doing. I have to say that I find getting the shading just right using a scanner or camera a bit frustrating and I don't think my GIMP skills are quite up to it. I've found that scanning the graphite on white ends up with the subtler shades washed out. So I started using a camera, but couldn't get the light even enough. Interestingly the white on black paper seems to scan quite well And I've been so impressed by Alexander's white on black work that I'd like to see what I can get to with it. I think I'll keep experimetning with both methods. I think once I looked at my last posts that I have to clean my scanner - every bit of dust seems to stand out against the black paper.
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Old 08-10-2010, 02:20 AM
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No sketches from me this month, but managed a quick 'whistlestop tour' of the October targets tonight, under pretty good skies. It was a bit late to go for the Eagle Nebula (too low, in the lights of town), and NGC 300 escaped me because it was too close to the zenith to reach.

Using Tasco 4.5" f8 reflector (apparently these are a heap of plasticky junk that you can't see anything through, according to some threads in the Beginners sections) with Celestron 21mm X-Cel & 40mm E-lux eyepieces (the latter newly acquired and my first run under good skies).

OK, started with the Helix Nebula, a big round faint ghost - got a lot of 'flickering' in averted vision and all in all the view wasn't very satisfactory, not as good as I've had. The Saturn Nebula was bright but very tiny and seeing as I'd left the 8mm EP inside I didn't linger. SMC was awesome, with little bright knots and patches, and its sky neighbours gcs 47 Tuc and NGC 362 were great too.

NGC 253 was pretty good, spanning half the field at 43x (21mm), but in better skies I've seen mottling. Checked NGC 247 while I was there, a bit like the ghost of 253! Moved on to gc NGC 288 - just a grey blob with a hint of gradual brightening to the centre, very different to Patrick's description, LOL!

Went to the Grus Quartet - all four galaxies visible, little faint gashes that fitted easily into the FOV. Wanted to linger but had no time. Moved to NGC 55, which I haven't seen for a while, and it didn't disappoint - lovely, with the bright core offset and nice extensions. Spanned over half the FOV. Did linger, just a little! Then to NGC 7793, a nice bright little galaxy that strangely enough looked a little like NGC 288, only elongated slightly.

Then went to NGC 1365, a bright face-on spiral. Couldn't see much detail so moved down to the rich galaxy field near it. Wow, little tufts everywhere - didn't have charts but I've done this area in detail before. Just enjoyed what I was seeing! Thought I might try the 40mm, but while the little galaxies were bright they were very, very tiny - better with the 21mm. So I flashed back to NGC 253. The 40mm EP put it in a wider field and brightened everything up - a classic bright edge-on spiral sitting in a nice starfield. Just beautiful, stunning in fact. OK, why not try the SMC again? Again, beautiful! But 47 Tuc amazed me - it seemed to be literally blazing, so bright was the core! Similar with NGC 362, but smaller.

That was so good, wonder how Tarantula Neb would look? Went there but funnily enough the 40mm didn't do much for it. But the LMC itself was magic, drool!

Well, it's taken me longer to type this than I spent out there - hope you enjoyed it. It's just so good to get some clear sky therapy. Pity I can't see anything through the heap of junk I own!

Cheers -
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