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Old 24-06-2009, 02:51 AM
Enchilada
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Question Who or What Killed the Australian Megafauna? (Media?)

By accident on the 22nd June 2009 within the BBC on-line Science and Environment webpage ( http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8112885.stm ) that was placed a seemingly controversial article entitled "Human Role in Big Kangaroo Demise" by presumed science writer Jason Palmer.

Here it is very boldly claimed that;
"A fossil study of the extinct giant kangaroo has added weight to the theory that humans were responsible for the demise of "megafauna" 46,000 years ago." whose paper concludes that "The researchers concluded that the megafauna eventually met their end due to hunting."
(Comment : Really bizarrely, these exact same words appear on the same BBC on-line site! This time in an article entitled "Extinction 'by man not climate' ( http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7555206.stm ) of the 11 August 2008 by a British researcher, Professor Chris Turney from the University of Exeter! I.e. "The researchers concluded that these species were driven to extinction by hunting." How absolutely remarkable the the same conclusion was said by separate researchers and separate papers!
Does the BBC has it own agenda here or what!! )
It concludes with a quote from Richard Roberts (University of Wollongong);
"This study neatly ties up several loose threads in the long-running extinction debate, by independently reaching the same conclusion for two very different environments - the mountainous rainforests of Tasmania and the dry rangelands of inland Australia - the mystery is no longer whether humans were ultimately responsible for the disappearance of the giant marsupials, but how they did it."
Also in "The Australian" (Adelaide based, mind you) http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au...-30417,00.html ) says in another article "Evidence suggests humans wiped out prehistoric kangaroo" written by Science writer Leigh Dayton that;
"Weighing in at 230kg and standing 2m tall, short-faced Procoptodon goliah was wiped out by prehistoric hunters who lay in wait by water holes, according to an international team led by paleontologist Gavin Prideaux of Adelaide's Flinders University."
Dr Prideaux is quoted saying;
"Moreover, earlier research suggested Procoptodon [Giant Kangaroo] evolved in response to increasingly arid conditions, but, significantly, it became extinct during a wetter time than many it had survived."
This is followed by the writer's own comment.
"Despite mounting circumstantial evidence that humans were guilty of mass slaughter, other experts will not be satisfied until Dr Prideaux and his team find hunting and butchering tools found in direct association with megafauna remains."
However, the BBC article solitary line of actual dissent says in a quote by Larisa DeSantis of the University of Florida (one of the investigators of this paper), who says;

"I'm a little hesitant to make a big conclusion..."

Yet the ABC news website say otherwise.


This story yet again appears in another article entitled "Giant kangaroo extinction theory disputed" by Anna Salieh (Journalist for ABC Science on-line); ( See
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2...23/2606307.htm )

Anna says in direct contradiction; "Claims that the largest ever kangaroo was hunted to extinction in Australia 45,000 years ago are "unsubstantiated", says one archaeologist.*"
* The archaeologist she refers in Dr. Judith Field (Sydney University) a Senior Research Associate, who studies geography and palaeoenvironments. As far as I know is in one of the greatest experts in her field on the early Australian environment and has one many awards and commendations. Her significantly weighted viewpoint can be read at the UNSW Faculty of Science in an article "Climate - not humans - killed off our animal giants" at http://www2.science.unsw.edu.au/news...megafauna.html
Dr. Field says further that she "...rejects this conclusion as "completely unsubstantiated" and a "giant leap of faith"."

The ABC article importantly paraphrases by saying (quite rightly IMO), that;
"But just because the kangaroo was adapted to aridity doesn't mean it was hunted to extinction and was not vulnerable to extreme aridity, says Dr Field.
Her main concern is that there is no direct evidence showing the kangaroo was hunted by humans.
"If you're going to make any case about humans and these megafauna then you've got to have them in the same place in the same time," she says.
"You've got to find archaeological sites that have megafauna in them with evidence of butchering. And we just don't have these."
"
At the finish of the ABC version there is a very interesting comparison of the both sides of the argument. (IMO the ABC article is an absolutely brilliant example of good balanced science journalism. Way to go Aussie ABC - we should be 110% very proud of 'em!)



So what do you reckon?

1) Who ACTUALLY killed the Australian Megafauna, here?? Man 46,000 years ago, climate change, or was it the media all on its own-some?

2) Which theory is right here?

3) Which media organisation is right here?
Note: An article proposing some of the ideas we posted in Scientific America by Kate Wong on 8th June 2001 entitled "Humans Drove Mammoths and Other Megafauna to Extinction" ( http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...e-mammoths-and )
This article concludes the same thing, but it appears balanced on the debate. (Here the same the Richard Roberts (University of Wollongong) as the current BBC on-line article is quoted [as first study, mind you]. The ended quote on the second paragraph here is quite revealing, where he says; "The new date alone, however, cannot reveal whether human hunting, habitat destruction or some other human factor caused the die-off" Furthermore it reveals the origin of the age of the end of the extinction "...around 46,000 years ago." Agenda driven or really independent research, perhaps?

Note 2 : IMO. The Science Media overall has a lot of explaining to do!

Note 3: I absolutely love the quote of Dr. Prideaux in the ABC site supporting his human-killed them view ! He says;

"Let's face it, saltbush-fed sheep taste really nice, it's quite possible saltbush-fed kangaroo taste really nice as well." Touché!
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Old 24-06-2009, 03:41 AM
Enchilada
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On-line Published Article

Sadly, the published article referred to in the press will not be available on line to the end of the week. I'll post the link when it comes available on-line.

Both the original earlier scientific articles on this megafauna problem (referred in my previous post) are;

1) "Late-surviving megafauna in Tasmania, Australia, implicate human involvement in their extinction" was published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Science of the United States (PNAS) - appearing 21st August 2008!!

http://www.pnas.org/content/105/34/1...-ffa0d67d824a;

(The actual supporting data for this paper is at; http://www.pnas.org/content/suppl/20...01360105SI.pdf )

2) Judith Field's article appears in the same journal 31st May 2005, entitled "Prolonged coexistence of humans and megafauna in Pleistocene Australia"
http://www.pnas.org/content/102/23/8...c-5264c8ca2196

Both these are freely available in pdf form.
Trivia: President Obama addressed 146th Annual Meeting of this academy on 5th June 2009!
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Old 24-06-2009, 01:39 PM
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Baddad (Marty)
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Hi Enchilada,

I feel I'm not qualified to form an opinion on this. I do know that if climate changes occur, large animals have difficulty in evolving into a surviving species.

There are such things as transitional species which are short lived and small in numbers. These animals that provide the link don't survive long. Fossils are therefore rare.

Would the megafauna survive climate change? Prehistoric Man is also blamed for the extinction of the Mammoth.

So much to research before an informed opinion can be extrapolated.
An interesting article

Cheers Marty
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Old 24-06-2009, 09:28 PM
Enchilada
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If you want to find a useful list of the ancient Australian megafauna, the Wikipedia page is fairly good - with a good list of now extinct creatures. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_megafauna


An excellent list of Internet sites are available at; http://science.uniserve.edu.au/schoo...s/mgfauna.html

A good site with detailed information is from the Australian Museum.
I.e. http://australianmuseum.net.au/Austr...xtinct-animals
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