Looking around for a few more bits and pieces for the powerseeker and was wondering what was peoples thoughts on this kit, I can buy it directly from amaon for roughly 52aud delivered but will have to wait until after christmas for it to get here
Hi Trev .
As good as the Kelner eyepieces were in their day I would personally save up a few more dollars and grab the GSO 'Superviews' from Andrews Communinations about $39 each in 1 1/4 inch and $49 in the 2 inch size , these are a much better eyepiece all round with a much larger field of view 68 degrees compared to 40-45 degrees of the Kelner design and with todays tech in the coatings the SV's will give a way brighter image .
My 5c mate , save your self some grief and get the GSO Superviews .
Brian.
Thanks Brian, happy to spend more than the 70aud but being a noobie was hoping to get some type of kit ( upto $250) that could also be used in a different telescope in the near future looking at dob 10"
btw Im an idiot and just realised that I posted this thread in the wrong section,, feel free to move
no stupid Q's here Trev go for it mate , and I am sure a few others will chime in here on the merits of the GSO , SV's they will shine in a 10 inch scope for sure .
Brian.
Quote:
Originally Posted by terra05
Thanks Brian, happy to spend more than the 70aud but being a noobie was hoping to get some type of kit ( upto $250) that could also be used in a different telescope in the near future looking at dob 10"
btw Im an idiot and just realised that I posted this thread in the wrong section,, feel free to move
What scope do you have now Trev? that will help in narrowing down what SV to start with but I would start with the 15 and 20mm , 1 1/4 inch eyepieces then as you get better at observing and when the 10inch ( if it has 2 inch capability ) arrives the 30mm then 42 mm and last the 50mm , you wont be disappointed .
I have told this story before here on IIS but a year or so ago a friend with a Meade ETX90 wanted a 20mm eyepiece so I grabbed one from Andrews for him , a total $39 .
When it arrived I tried it out and WOAW!!! it was almost as good as my $300 TelVue 19mm Panoptic in my Takahashi sky90 ,,, far out ! for the price these eyepieces are amazing .
I almost told old mate it got lost in the post and we need to buy another , these are that good I don't know how they do it for the price .
Brian.
Your scope is the Celestron 127 Powerseeker (Trev mentioned it in another theread). This scope can only use 1.25" eyepieces. While the Superviews are an excellent range, you would be limited to only the 20mm and 15mm. Your scope being what it is, I would suggest you limit your Superview collection to the 15mm for now. But...
Thing is too, your scope being what it is, I'm not sure how the Superview would end up performing in it. Your scope has a barlow lens stuck in the end of the focuser tube. Your scope's primary mirror is spherical in shape rather than parabolic, and the supposed reason for sticking the barlow in the light path is to correct for spherical aberration. Sadly, this system doesn't work as well as intended, and spherical aberration is very much still present. Your scope will be limited in how high it can go magnification wise before the image starts degrading significantly. The Superview eyepieces being so more wider in field of view, the outer edge of the field could be significantly poor. That's why I'm not sure the Superviews are the best eyepiece selection here.
Honestly, you would be better served by sticking with the scope's existing eyepieces and learn to use them and the scope. When the time comes you can upgrade the scope to a better unit. The eyepieces you then can 'upgrade' appropriately too.
Yes, it would be nice to upgrade, but you are asking your "Morris Minor" scope to change its engine to a Ferrari engine - it ain't gonna work the way you would want it to. To change the eyepieces on it now, you'll get a slightly better image at low power, but you will still be unsatisfied for the money spent, and high magnification isn't going to be much better.
I'd rather be honest than see you do your money and end up disappointed and lose interest in astro.
Yep bang on again Mental , I did not know Trev had one and yes those 'Barlowed ?' spherical mirrored newtonions are terrible sorry to say but if kept around the 100x mark they perform ok .
I personally hate them as much as the dreaded 'Dept store 50-60mm refractors' as these sell on great expectations but sadly mostly fall short on their promises , eg. 675x magnification ,,,, OUCH !! that hurts more aspiring astronomers than cloudy nights ever will .
Sorry Trev to put your scope down but if kept at low to medium magnifications it will be fine until you grab the 10 inch in the future and I will disagree with Mental on this , grab the 15 and 20mm SV's just to see the difference they will show for a small out lay in your scope .
Brian.
Brian.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mental4astro
Hi Trev,
Your scope is the Celestron 127 Powerseeker (Trev mentioned it in another theread). This scope can only use 1.25" eyepieces. While the Superviews are an excellent range, you would be limited to only the 20mm and 15mm. Your scope being what it is, I would suggest you limit your Superview collection to the 15mm for now. But...
Thing is too, your scope being what it is, I'm not sure how the Superview would end up performing in it. Your scope has a barlow lens stuck in the end of the focuser tube. Your scope's primary mirror is spherical in shape rather than parabolic, and the supposed reason for sticking the barlow in the light path is to correct for spherical aberration. Sadly, this system doesn't work as well as intended, and spherical aberration is very much still present. Your scope will be limited in how high it can go magnification wise before the image starts degrading significantly. The Superview eyepieces being so more wider in field of view, the outer edge of the field could be significantly poor. That's why I'm not sure the Superviews are the best eyepiece selection here.
Honestly, you would be better served by sticking with the scope's existing eyepieces and learn to use them and the scope. When the time comes you can upgrade the scope to a better unit. The eyepieces you then can 'upgrade' appropriately too.
Yes, it would be nice to upgrade, but you are asking your "Morris Minor" scope to change its engine to a Ferrari engine - it ain't gonna work the way you would want it to. To change the eyepieces on it now, you'll get a slightly better image at low power, but you will still be unsatisfied for the money spent, and high magnification isn't going to be much better.
I'd rather be honest than see you do your money and end up disappointed and lose interest in astro.
Cheers gents will pickup the 15 and 20mm sv's just as a starting point and worse comes to worse i can always off load them if there not suited to the new scope, options are only limited to the $$ i want to spend so im discovering. I'm gobbed smacked just how big this industry actually is for a home and travelling setup but its keeping me entertained thats for sure
Ahhh, Brian, always a subtle as a sledge hammer on fine crystal...
Trev, all is not lost on your 127. The trick with any scope is it will have some things it is good at, others not so much. While a spherical mirror ain't great, what it does mean is the scope will do best at low to medium magnification.
I have two of these spherical mirrored scopes myself. One of these (a 76mm Celestron Firstscope) I use as a big finder on my 17.5" dob. I even made a set of crosshairs in an old 25mm EP I had for it. It is bloody marvellous as both a finder, and it does really well on its own as a little scope. You see it on the 'back' of the big beast in the first pic.
The second spherical mirrored 'horror' is the kids 114 f/4.4 scope. I made a table top dobbie mount for it where it is fantastic out bush, and I also use it as my video scope at public star parties. Damn brilliant video scope it is too! I rigged it up onto an old Meade fork mount that was about to be scrapped, and made an equatorial wedge for it, and it is an outstanding video rig. It can show galaxies on the monitor that are now invisible even in large scopes due to light pollution in the city. And it reveals colour in nebulae. The second pic is of another scope like the kids' that I made a table top mount for - looks just the kids' mount. The third pic is of the scope being used for video astronomy, and the fourth pic is a snapshot image of M42 I took with it last week.
I've learnt not to 'hate' these cheapies. Instead, I've found their sneaky strength, and I work with it.
Trev, don't feel disheartened with the scope of yours. Just understand its strengths an you will be rewarded. High magnification isn't all what astronomy is about. There is much to be said for low power, rich field work. My latest scope acquisition was also my smallest aperture, a 100mm achromatic refractor. These are not great for high magnification, but that's not what I got it for. I got it because it gives me WIDE expansive views at low power. In fact, next dark sky site trip I'm making, the 17.5" will be staying at home. I'll just be taking the 100mm refractor an just the one low power eyepiece. That's it. Oh, yeah, and my sketch pad...
The 15mm and 20mm Superviews are fine eyepieces that won't kill the piggybank. But like I said, I'm not sure if they will be the best match for your scope, but they will be rip snorters in what ever scope you get next. The one eyepiece that WILL excel in your 127 scope is a 25mm plossl. Plossls were the bees knees of eyepieces 30 years ago, but newer designs and glass technology has seen them be relegated to 'beginner' eyepieces. The one major problem with plossls is as their focal length shortens, the eye lens (the lens you actually look into of the EP, the lens at the other end is called the 'field lens' as it faces the field of view) becomes smaller and smaller, and you need to get your eye closer and closer to the eye lens until with the shortest focal lengths you need to park your cornea on the blasted eye lens to see into it. BUT, the thing with plossls is they are good optical match with Newtonians, and the 25mm is a great match for scopes with a spherical mirror.
Yeah, a bit long this post, but there is a lot to say and explain. This stuff is not mystical - it's just taken me 30 years to figure out a thing or two. And if I can put it down, it will save you time and money as you'll make more informed choices, .
Mental.
PS, the eyepiece set you put the link to, FORGET THEM!!! Those are a waste of money - they are all compiled of old technology eyepieces that cost jack to produce, and are sold at a criminal mark up to the unwary. Sure, SOME of the individual elements will be fine from some of the kits, the asking price for these kits is insane, and most elements are poor compared to even the cheap new eyepiece designs currently available.
Last edited by mental4astro; 12-12-2013 at 10:40 AM.
Thanks Alexander I really do appreciate it and no your post wasn't too long and because I do a fair bit of camping I will catchup with you at a gathering one night a buy you a cuppa and learn a thing or 12
Found these guys who are relativly close by, the price is a little high ( but unsure) but that's ok I wont have to wait for the mail, but will hold off spending too much on this little scope until I go nuts with the next one
For the price I've paid for this scope when taking into account just how much fun I've gotten out of it so far was a great little buy but as said the clarity of the magnification and detail is missing a lot, yup I still have scope envy
Andrews Communications has the best prices I know of on the Superviews, $39 each on the 15mm & 20mm. Their 25mm plossl is $29. Look under the Guan Sheng (GSO) banner. The eyepieces are about 2/3rds of the way down the page:
The very best inexpensive high power eyepieces that I know are the TMB Planetary Type II's. These are now only available as clones of the original from the Chinese company that made the originals. But even the clones are excellent! The eye lens on these is huge, some 20mm across on ALL of them. And the eye relief is great, meaning you don't need to put your eyeball on the lens to look into it, again for ALL of them! The Aparent Field of View (AFOV) in all of them is around 58deg, as opposed to 52deg with plossls. These TMBs are a little larger units than plossls, but they are tiny when compared to other contemporary designs.
I still have my 9mm and 6mm TMBs. My 9mm is my fav of the two. It also shows fainter stars than my more highly spec'ed 8mm Vixen LVW that was 5X the price!
The best price I can find on these now comes from ebay:
Cheers again, picked up the 25mm plossl and the build quality of it compared to what came with the scope is apples and oranges, Also spent 10minutes drooling over a 15" dob for 6k while I was there, have ordered the gos's from andrews.
Hopefully clear skys tonight so I can play around with my new glass.
as far as a barlow goes are they all pretty much the same or with this scope is it a waste of $$ to buy something decent
Your scope already has a Barlow in it. Another will actually make things worse.
Barlow lenses can be a good tool, but like eyepieces, but quality varies greatly. But, unlike eyepieces, they are not as practical. In most instances they are a ineffective as they can end up producing magnification that greatly exceeds both the capbility of the scope &/or the atmosphere. There is a fine balance with Barlows. I have two, one 1.25" & a 2", both 2X. The 1.25" I've never used, the 2" only once. That one time was because the scope & eyepiece I was using it with didn't exceed the scope's capablity, & the atmosphere was playing nice. With every other scope of mine, I wouldn't have been able to use it as the eyepieces I have would have been enough to push things to the practical limits. Exceed those limits & the image just degrades. I'll mention these limits later today - gotta water the garden first.
Ooohh, mental! I have a firstscope and an 8"dob....probably no good as a finder on that one, but interested in the crosshair from the eyepiece...I kept the Firstscope because, well, it was my first scope! Sorry to butt in guys...
Part 1: Scope limits. A rule of thumb that guides the upper limits on magnification comes from the diameter of the scope. This is 50X per inch of aperture. So, for Trev's scope, 127mm is a 5" scope, so the upper practical limit would be 250X. The problem for Trev's scope is, the primary mirror being spherical, rather than parabolic in shape, the light won't all focus at the same spot, so as magnification increases, the image becomes fuzzier and fuzzier. My 17.5" should theoretically be pushed to 875X. But, I could never realistically achieve this as the ultimate limiting factor is the atmosphere, see part 2.
Part 2: Atmosphere. Here, no matter how good or big your scope is, the atmosphere is the great leveller of magnification. Typical conditions will allow an upper limit of between 100 and 150X. Good conditions can see this go to between 200 and 250X. Exceptional conditions will allow 400X, and this is a rare fish.
But, despite the magnification limitations, aperture is still king. Simply put, the larger the aperture, the fainter the amount of detail that can be seen, and with greater clarity.
Shaun, I for one don't mind. Adding crosshairs to an eyepiece is an easy matter. For this you will need an old telephone wire, strip it and you will find extremely fine wire. And you will need fast setting super glue, tweezers and a scalpel blade, oh, and a suitable eyepiece. Look inside the field end of the eyepiece barrel and locate the 'field stop'. This is a ring of metal that sits inside the barrel. It will sit at the very focal point of the eyepiece, and this will allow the eyepiece to then have a nice and sharp finish to its field of view. To work out how to go about the cross hair addition, just look at the pics on how I added a grid pattern to the field stop on one eyepiece. With crosshairs, you would just be using one pair of wires, not two. Very easy to do.
Hi Trev .
no stupid Q's here Trev go for it mate , and I am sure a few others will chime in here on the merits of the GSO , SV's they will shine in a 10 inch scope for sure .
What scope do you have now Trev? that will help in narrowing down what SV to start with but I would start with the 15 and 20mm , 1 1/4 inch eyepieces then as you get better at observing and when the 10inch ( if it has 2 inch capability ) arrives the 30mm then 42 mm and last the 50mm , you wont be disappointed .
WOAW!!! it was almost as good as my $300 TelVue 19mm Panoptic in my Takahashi sky90 ,,, far out ! for the price these eyepieces are amazing .
, these are that good I don't know how they do it for the price 
Yep bang on again Mental , I did not know Trev had one and yes those 'Barlowed ?' spherical mirrored newtonions are terrible sorry to say but if kept around the 100x mark they perform ok .
.
