On-line: NBN Petition

[Hagar (Doug)]

Originally Posted by Steffen

You do realise that making a surplus is the most incompetent thing a government can do. It means they're overtaxing. If they run out of things to spend money on they should lower taxes. The reality is, a diligent government will never run out of things to spend money on, not in our lifetimes anyway, not as long as our economy is facing towering structural problems.

Cheers
Steffen.

Steffen, Better we have a small surplus than be in debt so deep we cannot afford the repayments let alone make the purchases and spending the country needs to continue. Your not Greek are you?

[Barrykgerdes]

I think this useless polarized discussion has been going on for too long and will make too many enemies so I have made a list of all those for and against.

Those who don't agree with my views (unstated) had better prepare yourselves. I am going to organize a fleet of floodlights and fog generators and will be around to ruin your night's viewing of the sky so you will all be able to find another more important thing to complain about.

Barry

[Paul Haese]

Originally Posted by Barrykgerdes

I think this useless polarized discussion has been going on for too long and will make too many enemies so I have made a list of all those for and against.

Those who don't agree with my views (unstated) had better prepare yourselves. I am going to organize a fleet of floodlights and fog generators and will be around to ruin your night's viewing of the sky so you will all be able to find another more important thing to complain about.

Barry

enjoy the drive Barry.

[The_bluester (Paul)]

Originally Posted by Paul Haese

Man that is funny. Clayton will not be getting fibre to the home ever. It is not going to be serviced by the NBN because the township is too small. If we are lucky there will be wireless. When I go to the NBN map there is not even a remote date for when and if construction would begin. I contacted NBN Co just out of curiosity and was told there are no plans to service our little township. That is what will happen to a lot of tiny towns around Australia. So for now I am happy with ADSL on site and I don't mind the ADSL2+ at home.

Keep wishin Mike.

Actually that is just plain wrong, it is a testament to how poorly the previous government explained the scope of the project. There is (Was. I make no assumptions of any sort under the new government except that we have to wait and see) NO town in Australia which was to not get the NBN, the service delivery method might have been fixed wireless and might have been satellite based, but it was still coming. And the fixed wireless was supposed to be completed sometime in 2015. Similar for the permanent sat connections, the NBN birds were supposed to launch in 2015 as well IIRC.

When NBN say "No plans" they meant "Not planned yet" Fixed wireless also pops up very quickly. I stopped looking for a couple of months knowing that I would not be on fibre anyway due to location (It would cost a couple of hundred K to connect us and even a fibre booster like me knows full well that it would be wasteful) When I stopped looking we were not on the rollout plan at all. A couple of months later I looked again and we were "under construction" for fixed wireless and a week after that it was RFS (Ready For Service) So long as the signal strength gods smile on me we will have a fixed wireless connection on Thursday this week. We have trees between us and the tower but otherwise good LOS and are only a couple of KM away. Unlike rolling out fibre, the fixed wireless sites go up very quickly (A couple of months) after construction begins.

[Paul Haese]

Originally Posted by The_bluester

Actually that is just plain wrong, it is a testament to how poorly the previous government explained the scope of the project. There is (Was. I make no assumptions of any sort under the new government except that we have to wait and see) NO town in Australia which was to not get the NBN, the service delivery method might have been fixed wireless and might have been satellite based, but it was still coming. And the fixed wireless was supposed to be completed sometime in 2015. Similar for the permanent sat connections, the NBN birds were supposed to launch in 2015 as well IIRC.

When NBN say "No plans" they meant "Not planned yet" Fixed wireless also pops up very quickly. I stopped looking for a couple of months knowing that I would not be on fibre anyway due to location (It would cost a couple of hundred K to connect us and even a fibre booster like me knows full well that it would be wasteful) When I stopped looking we were not on the rollout plan at all. A couple of months later I looked again and we were "under construction" for fixed wireless and a week after that it was RFS (Ready For Service) So long as the signal strength gods smile on me we will have a fixed wireless connection on Thursday this week. We have trees between us and the tower but otherwise good LOS and are only a couple of KM away. Unlike rolling out fibre, the fixed wireless sites go up very quickly (A couple of months) after construction begins.

Since you know so much about our situation here in SA. Take a look at South Australia around the northern and eastern part of lake alexandrina. I have contacted NBN Co and they said there is no plan at all to have a connection there. Don't tell me I am wrong if you don't actually know about my situation mate!

[RobF (Rob)]

Originally Posted by Barrykgerdes

I think this useless polarized discussion has been going on for too long and will make too many enemies so I have made a list of all those for and against.

Those who don't agree with my views (unstated) had better prepare yourselves. I am going to organize a fleet of floodlights and fog generators and will be around to ruin your night's viewing of the sky so you will all be able to find another more important thing to complain about.

Barry

Good plan Barry. We better get the IIS TOS changed so religion, politics AND NBN are limited topics
I think we all want superfast broadband, but there'll always be conflict over how to allocate scarce financial resources.

[Peter Ward]

Originally Posted by gary

Hi Peter,

Early in my career I swallowed the Red Pill and have been much deeper than that.
....


Gary Kopff.

An interesting read Gary..... I must admit to have been amazed watching Rene load revised hex code into the Gemini EPROMS and debug the software....but suspect we are going off at a tangent ..

FTTH will deliver best bandwidth compared to FTTN , the problem I have is: to what end?

I currently have cable, that delivers 34mbs most times, the bottleneck more often than not being the servers rather than the pipeline. I'm not inclined to want to pay even more for, depending what plan you are on, a slower service ( not all NBN products will be 100mbs)

For most users, high bandwidth will only deliver entertainment ...but if the current crop of TV shows is anything to go by.....they can shove it. I fail to see how getting entertainment over fibre will make the nation more productive.

To tear up perfectly serviceable cable or copper links just so we can *all* have optical fibre is brain dead stupid policy to me. NBN Co. have consistently failed to meet roll-out targets by an order of magnitude, begging the question, to actually have the system delivered what will the ultimate cost be? How many bridges, dams, thorium power plants ( ) hospitals, dual carriage ways, nurses, doctors & engineers could be built/trained for the same spend?

I'm not anti-NBN....I just think there are better things to spend a significant part of my wage - that I have no say in loosing every payday through taxation (along with many others)- on at the moment.

[Peter.M]

Originally Posted by Peter Ward

How many thorium power plants ( )could be built for the same spend?

Don't suggest that Peter, nuclear power is scary so Australia should never invest in it.

[Octane (Humayun)]

Hey. Breaking Bad is awesome.

H

[LewisM]

Someone call the RSPCA.

Poor horses. Poor poor horses. Flogged to death.

[Peter Ward]

Originally Posted by Peter.M

Don't suggest that Peter, nuclear power is scary so Australia should never invest in it.

Google " Thorium power " Australia has mountains of the stuff. I'd be happy to start a new threat on that old chestnut

[LewisM]

Originally Posted by Peter Ward

Google " Thorium power " Australia has mountains of the stuff. I'd be happy to start a new threat on that old chestnut

Fraudian slip?

Is that a threat or a promise to start a thread on alternate energy sources involving atomic physics?

[Peter Ward]

Originally Posted by LewisM

Fraudian slip?

Is that a threat or a promise to start a thread on alternate energy sources involving atomic physics?

*thread*. No Freudian slip...I'm always fighting my iPad's autocomplete and spelling.

[LewisM]

Same as my old man - as I am sure you know a certain airline uses iPads for EVERYTHING from ops manuals to crew scheduling etc. He hates it, but then again, he's not far from 70 He always comments the FMS is 1000 times simpler than a ruddy iPad

[The_bluester (Paul)]

Originally Posted by Paul Haese

Since you know so much about our situation here in SA. Take a look at South Australia around the northern and eastern part of lake alexandrina. I have contacted NBN Co and they said there is no plan at all to have a connection there. Don't tell me I am wrong if you don't actually know about my situation mate!

What they have told you is wrong, simple as that.

93% connected by fibre, approx 4% by fixed wireless and the remainder who can not be feasibly hit by fibre or fixed wireless to be connected by the permanent satellite service. That adds up to 100%. What some muppet in a call centre may or may not have said is not relevant here. Just look up the NBN website for yourself. A pertinent link below to save you some time.

http://nbnco.com.au/about-us/our-purpose.html

I felt strongly enough that Australia needed a reset of telecommunications policy and infrastructure and that the NBN model was the best on offer that I changed from a pretty secure job with a telco to a less secure one in a company doing significant work for NBNco to get amongst it. I know more than probably 95% of people in Australia do about the project.



If a direct link to an NBN co page stating figures that add up to 100% does not settle it in your mind that it was to have been delivered to your area under the old plan, so be it. As of the election you might well have become right. Only time will tell now.

[tlgerdes (Trevor)]

Originally Posted by blink138

ha ha paul you say that like the howard government knew what was around the corner with the GFC and that is what the pack of monkeys in there at the moment have us believe....... however the fact is that brittany spears would have given us a surplus during that time if she was our PM
good luck not good management!
pat

Have you talked to any bankers lately? They knew it was coming from as early as 2003, it was only a matter of time. The US subprime market had holes in it since Bill Clinton legislated it into existance. As if you couldn't see that one coming, they were just hoping some miracle of government would keep the economy moving forward long enough. Even Peter Costello said post 2007 election about the dark clouds on the horizon.

[AndrewJ]

Have you talked to any bankers lately? They knew it was coming from as early as 2003,

So why didnt they really do anything about it????
( And that includes the pollies )
Maybe they just kept quiet because they know profit can be made
from boom or doom, and stable just isnt profitable???
The more money moves about and the more unstable it is,
the more chance for them and their mates
to five finger discount a bit along the way without being caught.
What i want to know is why after 10 years of boom, we are still in deficit with nothing much to show for it.
At least the full FTTH NBN will give us an infrastructure to build on,
( that private industry run by bankers would never approve of )
assuming those in charge have enough vision to accept that they
are just building a skeleton that may not in itself be cost effective within a single parliamentary term.


Andrew

[tlgerdes (Trevor)]

Originally Posted by AndrewJ

So why didnt they really do anything about it????
( And that includes the pollies )
.............
What i want to know is why after 10 years of boom, we are still in deficit with nothing much to show for it.

Andrew

These twin questions are related, and brings us bank to our discussion topic. Everyone thinks the river of gold never ends and will just keep flowing to provide us with all we need.

6 years ago our government had no debt, and someone saw the river of gold flowing and thought they were rich and it would never end, they built there lifestyle around it, then watched the river dry up.

If the government had spent their surplus 6 years ago to build the NBN I would have applauded them. The problem was they spent the surplus 10 times over thinking the river of gold would never end. Now we just can't afford it. Our own belligerence has led is to this point, we have to live within our means and be conservative with our economy else we will be the next Greece or Spain.

[AndrewJ]

Gday Trevor

I fully agree we are living ( well ) beyond our means
and our heads will be pulled in for us in the near future
but re

6 years ago our government had no debt,

i must fully agree with several earlier posters,
that the only way the libs "balanced" the budget
was to sell the family silver.

They sold a lot of it under dubious circumstances ( ie 2nd Telstra )
to mum and dad Australia, and arent we paying for it now,
( and for a long time to come ).

The overall debt from that era is still there, just now a big chunk of it is directly with the people, vs the Govt.

Ie "We" ( Australia ) still went into debt during that time.

Both sides are as bad as each other.


And to get it back onto topic, just imagine if everyone did get the NBN whilst we can still afford it. The poor will be able to get their telemedicine and or TeleLaw at half price from a call centre in India
Be good to see those professions get a bit of "competition" from overseas like everyone else.

Andrew

If the government had spent their surplus 6 years ago to build the NBN I would have applauded them.

All i would say to that is, if was a good idea then, its a better idea now.
The fact they wasted money on other stuff first doesnt negate that.

[avandonk]

All I can say is enjoy your twisted pair last mile NBN! It is the obvious choice as the proletariat do not know any better.

I have Telstra HFC and on a good day on my shared line I can get 30Mb/s.

The upload speed is appalling at 1.3Mb/s. For this I pay $99 a month.

It is all sad really!

Bert