Outrageous Electricity rise

[alan meehan (Alan)]

Ipod,Iphone,mp3,Wiifi ,nintendo,xbox,playstation,blueray, dvd,foxtel,kindle,sony reader,android,boombox,laptops,comp uters,printers,mobile phones,Tbox,photo frames,digital phones,digital cameras,electric toothbrush,hair dryers,hair curlers hair straightners,cloths dryer,dishwasher,microwave,touch lamps,plasma led tvs,digital clock,recharchargale drill ,screwdriver,not to mention christmas ,my house is a robot chewing away at the meter box ,oh St!*ff ive blown a fuse
AL

[FlashDrive (Poppy)]

Originally Posted by alan meehan

Ipod,Iphone,mp3,Wiifi ,nintendo,xbox,playstation,blueray, dvd,foxtel,kindle,sony reader,android,boombox,laptops,comp uters,printers,mobile phones,Tbox,photo frames,digital phones,digital cameras,electric toothbrush,hair dryers,hair curlers hair straightners,cloths dryer,dishwasher,microwave,touch lamps,plasma led tvs,digital clock,recharchargale drill ,screwdriver,not to mention christmas ,my house is a robot chewing away at the meter box ,oh St!*ff ive blown a fuse
AL

You forget the ' Toaster '

Flash

[AndrewJ]

Gday Chris

Pay your electricity and gas bills weekly via BPay as a periodic payment. Divide up an average year by 52 and pay that each week. Tiny amount - no surprises or major headaches at bill time.

This is a good idea in one way and a bad one in others.
Whilst it may help to smooth out some bills, it also further removes peoples perceptions of how much things really cost,
and you normally still end up paying the same amount in the end.
Modern financial methods love using lots of small transactions to cover up the real costs of things.
If you took the money out of the bank as cash each month,
( i know, not feasible anymore )
and paid the bills by handing over "real money"
it would hit home a lot faster whats really going on.

Andrew

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by Allan_L

My panels produce mostly during peak time, when I am being charged 46c per KwHr. (Soon to be increased by 18% from July). I agree it should have been fixed to the Peak Rate. But it is fixed and I expect the Peak rate to exceed 60c shortly (carbon tax + new infrastructure charges).

Fair enough I based my calculation on the single rate which I am on around 21c-24c anytime. In a way I am lucky our network hasn't been upgraded yet to smart meters because as I'm working from home and account for 50% of my daily consumption a jump from 20c to 40c and over wouldn't be ideal.

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by Omaroo

My tip? Everyone on the internet has access to electronic banking through the institution they're with. Pay your electricity and gas bills weekly via BPay as a periodic payment. Divide up an average year by 52 and pay that each week. Tiny amount - no surprises or major headaches at bill time. My last bill when it arrived was $68 - an easy to fix shortfall.

I do this too for all my major bills including rates on two properties - at tens of dollars per week and that's plenty.

Even better do a direct transfer to a higher interest account just for bills and bulk pay on the due date.

[michaellxv (Michael)]

Originally Posted by FlashDrive

You forget the ' Toaster '

Flash

and coming soon 'the electric car', now aint that going to be cheap to run

[Larryp (Laurie)]

I'd like to see the proceeds of the accursed carbon tax used to make it easy for most of the population to install solar-then we could at least say the carbon tax was actually reducing CO2 output! When you install solar now, you are credited with Renewable Energy Certificates, which are usually assigned to the system provider to reduce the system cost to the purchaser-this scheme could be expanded financed by the carbon tax. Better than handing out a couple of hundred bucks which just gets spent willy-nilly.
I know solar can never provide base load, but it can sure reduce the cost of power.
Ten years ago, I lived in a large house with 3 bathrooms, ducted air, automatic everything and swimming pool. My bills back then were over $1000/ quarter. We had Energy Australia test the meters (at my cost), and of course they found nothing wrong-they never do!
Best thing I ever did was downsize to my current 1950s renovated box-everthing is so much cheaper.
I shudder to think what the new owners of my previous house are paying.

[traveller (Bo)]

Hate to burst our bubbles, but Aust used to have the best PV brains in the business. He ended up going back to China because of lack of Govt support (or is that resistance from vested interest )
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shi_Zhengrong
End result: we now buy solar panels made in China from a guy who became an Aust citizen and studied here

As for solar baseload power, there are operational sites in Spain using molten salt technology as heat sinks for extended generation (upto 7.5 hours without direct sunshine)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andasol..._Power_Station

Yes I know it's all Wiki stuff, but the point is Govt can take a longer vision and invest in smart technologies, which will have huge export potentials, but are too busy digging stuff out of the groud to notice.

[TrevorW]

Yes I know it's all Wiki stuff, but the point is Govt can take a longer vision and invest in smart technologies, which will have huge export potentials, but are too busy digging stuff out of the groud to notice. [/QUOTE]


To busy making lots and lots $$$$$$ to notice more likely

[marki]

This will probably cause a ruckus but so be it. I do not believe there is an easy answer to any of this. Sure its fun to slag off at the polies, hell I consider it a national sport, but to blame governments of any flavour as being responsible for the brain drain is fairly short sighted. They would be foolish to ignor the sheer volume of cash and its out flow into Australian society available from mining and other primary industries. How much and how long would it take to aquire the same impact from new technologies? Sure selling ore over seas is an easy option but I ask how many of us (myself included) are willing to or have personally invested our own money in supporting or developement of new technologies and I don't mean as an end user, a few maybe and probably got burnt in the process. We have all read about new and wonderful inventions made by Australians over the years of which the inventor in frustraion sold to overseas concerns due to lack of local support. We have watched our manufactruring industries die as we consumed mass produced goods sold by local retailers sourced from other countries simply because it was cheaper to buy. We have allowed and by our own actions ecouraged the death of real skill, inventiveness and even genius, hell we used to make our own aircraft during WWII, we even had foundries in Perth, all gone. Textiles gone, all but the essential metal working industries gone, woodworking on it way out etc etc. We have pursued personal wealth through real estate which is now so costly I fear for the plight our children will find themselves in. In Perth housing is in such shortage people are paying stupid prices to own or rent property here. How have electricity prices, food prices and the geneneral cost of living got so high? We might like to blame governments but in my opinion it is our own fault. We have become a society driven by our own greed in the pursuit of personal wealth even at the cost of the future of this great nation. We have too much yet we want more. We have squashed creativeness and as a consequence encouraged monopolies which now dictate terms. When something goes wrong we blame the governments almost as if they were negligent parents. For all intents and purposes we have shat in our own nest and are now complaining because we don't like the stench and expect someone else to come and clean it up for us. Well its time to wake up, smell the coffee and really consider what we (myself included) can do to make Australia a better place.

Mark

[Larryp (Laurie)]

You make some good arguments Mark

[Omaroo (Chris Malikoff)]

Originally Posted by AndrewJ

Whilst it may help to smooth out some bills, it also further removes peoples perceptions of how much things really cost,
and you normally still end up paying the same amount in the end.

Uhm... yes. Obviously My intent is not to hide it or pretend it doesn't exist. My intent is not to be hit with large sums of money all at once - having to be paid when it isn't convenient. I'm recently divorced, and my idiot ex wife lumped all of our mortgages and personal loans back on me to pay, choosing instead to skip her responsibilities and have me maintain our combined stellar credit rating. Where I used to be able to take a weeks wages and pay the electricity and rates off in one hit with that weeks earnings - along with the mortgages, food and every other thing that week including buying yet another telescope, it's not an option any more. The good old days have gone for the perceivable future. I'm not on low wages by any stretch of the imagination, but I have massive outgoings until our marriage is eventually settled - which is proving a nightmare. Paying in small allotments makes it far more manageable and easier to swallow.

Even after everything is finalised, I'll be continuing this practise. I think it works for many other people who don't, for their own multitude of reasons, have much left over each week after paying their mortgage, rent, food and travel expenses. It's difficult to come up with three and four figure sums to pay (sometimes highly) variable utility bills. As far as putting this into an interest-bearing account and paying from that, yeah, maybe. For the length of time the funds accumulate before they have to go again, the effort it isn't worth the measly interest. At least by paying small chunks as a periodic payment each week you can't forget to pay the bill on time either.

[Stu Ward]

Originally Posted by silv

yeah - saving.
or how about solar energy and feeding that back into the provider's network?
do you have such (subsidized) models in NZ or Oz?

I just read that in NZ, houses will need to comply a certain insulation standard from soon-ish onwards.

I am from Germany - and it grieves me horrendously how no house here in NZ has double glazing or proper insulated walls, floors and ceilings.
Not even the posh 6-year old I am currently renting a room in.

Admittedly, we don't get temperatures here like -15 for weeks on end but still - the power consumption of the dehumidifier and heater during winter is like crazy because of these buildings.
In South-Ireland, comparable to the climate/temperature here, in Auckland/NZ, I lived in a (luxurious) stone town house apartment (~80 years old). Outside walls 40-50 cm thick. And double glazing.
There was NO need for heating. Except for that 1 week in January 2010
when temperatures dropped below zero for almost a week.

The outside walls of this house here are less than 20cm. And all those beautiful panorama windows are single glass panes.

There is soo much sun here - if only the house could store the heat somewhere ... no chance, though, in these thin paper walls.

This is way really agrieves me.
We live in rented accomoadation, beautiful house, but insulation is non-existent.
So in winter time I have no option but to heat the buggery out of the place. Our only option is electical heaters, and these are very inefficient and expensive


Stu

[cometcatcher (Kevin)]

Originally Posted by michaellxv

and coming soon 'the electric car', now aint that going to be cheap to run

I think that's why it isn't happening. Imagine if 20 million Australians suddenly started driving electric (not hybrid) cars. The power grid couldn't handle it. Not by a long shot. We would need to find a powerful source of cheap electricity to make it viable. Like nuclear. Home solar doesn't produce enough power to charge an electric car.

Now with high density housing and no yard to speak of, solar is limited to the roof. While the price of solar has plummeted, the efficiency of the panels hasn't changed that much in recent times. With solar you can't have tree shadows so not suitable for everyone.

I've managed to cram about 700 watts of self funded hobby solar panels on my shed roof which charge a battery bank. And I have a huge backyard. Where possible I've converted my energy use to either 12 volts or low power appliances. All the house lighting is 12 volt, fridge, freezer, TV, radios, ceiling fan, all 12V now.

I don't feed anything back to the grid. Too much red tape for a DIY. Because I use less grid power, my last quarter bill was $83. Unlike grid connect systems, when the grid goes down, I still have power.

Of course it cost money to do all this, so my savings are not so great. I just do it as a hobby for independence from the grid if needs be.

It seems a bit screwy to me that in the 21st century, a first world country that claims to be at the forefront of technology can't even afford electricity. If we can't afford electricity, how are we ever going to advance with technology?

[mplanet62 (Michael)]

On positive side - it will be darker at night. Practical advice - buy a simple non-electric tea kettle. Will save you a lot - except it won't save my attitude towards electrical companies...

[jjjnettie (Jeanette)]

Originally Posted by alan meehan

Ipod,Iphone,mp3,Wiifi ,nintendo,xbox,playstation,blueray, dvd,foxtel,kindle,sony reader,android,boombox,laptops,comp uters,printers,mobile phones,Tbox,photo frames,digital phones,digital cameras,electric toothbrush,hair dryers,hair curlers hair straightners,cloths dryer,dishwasher,microwave,touch lamps,plasma led tvs,digital clock,recharchargale drill ,screwdriver,not to mention christmas ,my house is a robot chewing away at the meter box ,oh St!*ff ive blown a fuse
AL

I was about to report you as a spam bot!!!

[Colin_Fraser]

Originally Posted by marki

but to blame governments of any flavour as being responsible for the brain drain is fairly short sighted.

The Victorian government just slashed 300 million dollars off the TAFE funding and as a result 1000 jobs will go. So the government IS responsible.

We have watched our manufactruring industries die as we consumed mass produced goods sold by local retailers sourced from other countries simply because it was cheaper to buy.

Manufactures chose to close factories and move off shore, not to compete but to increase profits. The consumer HAS NO CHOICE. We have to buy these goods or go without.

We have allowed and by our own actions ecouraged the death of real skill, inventiveness and even genius

What actions? It is the large companies that have reduced apprenticeships to record low in favour of importing cheap Chinese labour.

we have pursued personal wealth through real estate

Nothing wrong in wanting to own your own home to raise a family.

How have electricity prices, food prices and the geneneral cost of living got so high? We might like to blame governments but in my opinion it is our own fault. We have become a society driven by our own greed in the pursuit of personal wealth even at the cost of the future of this great nation.

Two young people meet and fall in love, get married and have a child. They rent while saving for a deposit for a home. Husband looks to future and puts away an extra $10 a week to his super fund then loses the lot. Rent goes up because there is a housing shortage. Fuel costs increase cutting into budget. They now have to reduce spending. Child gets ill and goes to doctor who no longer bulk bills, more expense. This family has no control over the cost of living nor did they contribute to it.

When something goes wrong we blame the governments almost as if they were negligent parents.

Well they are to blame. They have created this situation through poor policies and looking after the interests of multinational companies.

[blindman]

Better to unite and make protests instead of wasting time commenting.
Country with the most coal resources and "they" are making fools of "their" Citizens. Right?
Cheers all.

[AndrewJ]

Gday Chris

Uhm... yes. Obviously

I think that for many now, esp the younger generations,
its NOT obvious, ( which was the intent of my post )
and thats where a lot of people miss out on whats really happening.
( Ie the thread started about the ever increasing rate of price rises,
more than finding means to ease the load of paying for them )

You obviously watch carefully what goes on ( as do i )
but for many, the disconnect between money and cost when
"ongoings" get broken down into "little sums that are taken
automatically" means they dont see what is going on until its too late.

What i'm waiting for next in Victoria is the govt allows the owners of smart meters to dynamically change the tariffs "whenever they like".
( And just to be a bit Machiavellian, they will probably force you to link a meter to a bank account with direct debiting or suffer a penalty percentage )
Its blocked at present, but its sure to come in.
It will make the old "coin in the slot" electricity look tame.
I saw a debate on it about 6mths ago, and the weasel sent in by the supplier groups said you could "buy a device" to put inside your house that allowed you to see what your current tarriff is.

Andrew

in the state where the top three growth industries are now
a) State fines
b) Private fines
c) Creating scripts for Death insurance adverts

[Allan_L (Allan)]

Putting this back on topic:
Increases in electricity Prices

YES. Electricity Prices have increased significantly in recent years.

Who is mainly responsible:
State Governments (Privitisation, or preparation for privatisation)

Secondary Cause:
Increase in cost of coal due to huge demands for coal from export markets.
(check the number of ships waiting off Newcastle harbour)

Was there any Federal Government cause:
No, not directly. Not until 1 July 2012.

What about Consumers' responsibility:
Well, Yes, some. Increasing our power usage requires further infrastructure investment.

What can we do about it:
Not much.
Reduce usage when we can, especially during Peak Load periods.
Switch to cheaper fuel alternatives. Gas cook tops. Solar hot water. etc.

any more questions?