Superlube or White Lithium Grease

[bartman (Bart)]

So i have opened up the NEQ6 and had a bit of a gander at the innards.
And as per many a post on IIS, the NEQ6 has got some serious cost cutting issues with the amount of grease in both roller and tapper bearings. I did find that there was no 'black goop' bearing grease on mine. It was a clear-ish graese and in some parts had gone 'black'.
Reading the various posts about re-greasing the mount and lubricants used, I still am curious which grease to go buy. Superlube seems equal to White Lithium in the 'use this grease' stakes.
Went to Bunnings and had a look for white lithium grease but all they had was Superlube. So I bought a tube and started on the project.
After thoroughly cleaning the bearings and drying them, I started to repack them with the superlube.

Question: How much grease can a bearing bear?

I packed and packed, spun the bearing quite a few times, and then put even more grease on/in it, then spun again etc etc.
Do you fill it to the brim with grease?
Whats the go ?

2nd question: Superlube is more expensive than White Lithium. I think I can get 3 roller bearings and dec tapper bearing out of the one tube of Superlube. Should I do the ra in white lithium, just to save some $$$?
or stick with SL?

Any input from your experiences would be great!!!!
Thanks
Bartman

[[1ponders] (Paul)]

Ahh Bart, maybe you might want to scrape some of that lube off and repack it into the tube. On the bearing surfaces you really only need a pretty light smear. Not packed anyway. Keep it for you next half dozen or 12 lube jobs . Well that's the Losmandy way

[adman (Adam)]

there's grease and there's grease. The oil in Superlube tends to separate out - you need to find something that doesn't do that. If you PM Brundah (Dave) he will give you the name of a you-beaut grease that is good for use in mounts - I have some - but can't for the life of me remember the name....

Adam

[Visionoz (Bill)]

Bart

Don't use white lithium grease either - it drys out over a period of time and separates!!!

HTH
Cheers
Bill

[bartman (Bart)]

Originally Posted by [1ponders]

On the bearing surfaces you really only need a pretty light smear.

Paul you only mean the roller bearings not the taper ones right? And by surface you mean just the outside??? or do you take the dust caps of and (after cleaning) apply a small amount inside?

Originally Posted by adman

If you PM Brundah (Dave) he will give you the name of a you-beaut grease that is good for use in mounts
Adam

Will do....

Originally Posted by Visionoz

Don't use white lithium grease either - it drys out over a period of time and separates!!!

What have you used in the past Bill?

These are only two of the sites that I have had a look at and looks like they have used a bit of grease in the bearings....

http://www.beevo.com/Components.htm
http://www.astro-baby.com/EQ6%20rebu...%20rebuild.htm

Thanks for your input guys!

Bartman

[multiweb (Marc)]

SuperLube (PTFE) Synthetic Grease or SuperLube Spray from here.

[bartman (Bart)]

Originally Posted by multiweb

SuperLube (PTFE) Synthetic Grease or SuperLube Spray from here.

Thanks Marc, that is the one I bought.
But Adam doesn't recommend it due to the oil separating
Any thoughts?
Cheers
Bartman

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by bartman

Thanks Marc, that is the one I bought.
But Adam doesn't recommend it due to the oil separating
Any thoughts?
Cheers
Bartman

I've used it for years on my G11. The spray on the DEC and RA bearings, the gel on the worms and gears.

[astronut (John)]

Another vote for Superlube.....I've used it in extreme heat and bitter cold, never let me down.

[[1ponders] (Paul)]

I've infact only just finished redoing the RA Axis about half an hour ago from the Mapleton Observatory. I've still got the Dec axis to go. Not fun when you find the roller bearings seized solid in the RA axis. Took a bit of persuasion and lot of degreaser and WD40 to get them suckers rolling again.

The roller bearings (inside axis) and worm/gear meshes got a light smear with the fingers (very clean fingers that have usually been in and out of degreaser and water and WD all day, but squeeky clean". I'd say pea size dob of grease if that. I find the older the bearing a bit more isn't going to hurt.

The other bearings, taper? rings? just a few small drops of oil. any outer "washer surface I either put a light smear of oil or very light smear of lube.

Mind you this is only the 4th (or fifth?? ) time I've pulled a G11 or G8 apart and each time I learn something new about the mount and its little idiosyncrasies

[bartman (Bart)]

Sooooo I might have over done it then......:q uestion:
Bartman

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by bartman

Sooooo I might have over done it then......:q uestion:
Bartman

With bearings less is more. All they need is a thin film of grease. You don't have to pack them
Turp'em up then a bit of spray. All this grease will eventualy get contaminated with water/dew/dust and turn to glue. Then your mount will really labor to get from A to B.

[casstony]

Sealed bearings I've bought over the years for motorbikes typically have very little grease in them - seems to be normal.

I regreased a mount with Superlube a few years ago (after seeing a recommendation from Bintel) and it hasn't seperated - massive improvement over the original chinese grease.

[bartman (Bart)]

Cool , thanks guys.
I'll start again!
Cheers
Bartman

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by bartman

Cool , thanks guys.
I'll start again!
Cheers
Bartman

Whatever you do remember these things don't spin fast but they need to spin freely. So the less grease the better. But they need to be kept super clean. Stiction is the killer. More grease+water over time = glue.

[Brundah1 (David)]

Seeing Adam has mentioned it, for those interested, the grease I would recommend is sold in USA as Mobil One Synthetic PDS:

http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lub...ic_Grease.aspx

I suspect Superlube is a close relative of Mobil One although Mobil don't reveal all their secrets - but I have not seen mention of PTFE additive.

Mobil synthetic is mainly sold here to the aviation, coal and oil industries. The smallest pack is 40 x 400g price is approx $450! As an aircraft engineer I found ways of obtaining a small quantity - legally!

ScopeStuff sells the same grease as "Pete's Red Grease" 1 oz. pack USD 6 plus Intl. shipping.

"Pete's Red Grease
This is the same red grease that is supplied with several of the
Peterson Engineering kits. This synthetic grease maintains its
viscosity over a very wide temperature range, and it won't run.
Very good for lubrication of mounts, bearings, bushings, etc.
About one ounce of grease by weight, sealed in a plastic pouch.

FYI Celestron USA recommends Mobil One Grease as a fix for Celestron SCT Baffle tube grease dripping oil on the corrector plate in high ambient temp such as Arizona and Texas.

I had this happen to my CPC800, you may know the Celestron CPC carton is normally shipped and stored with the OTA facing downwards. It would appear the manufacturer applies ordinary bearing grease generously to things like baffle tubes and their grease liberates oil in high ambient temps e.g. above 30 degC.

All greases will exude some oil at the bearing contact point - that's what greases are designed to do! But Mobil Synthetic greases are temperature stable across a wide range, see the Mobil PDS: This grease will not dry out or cake! But excessive application will lead to the grease spreading where you may not want it to go - this is not oil separation.

Ponders is correct, the bearings in telescopes need just sufficient grease to coat all bearing surfaces "with just a smear"

The above applies to Mobil synthetic and I would suggest Superlube too! Being generous with grease application in G11 bearings will lead to oil (or grease) on the RA clutch disc and on the Dec clutch disc too if you store the G11 mount on its side!)

Don't "pack" grease in any of the bearing areas, that goes for CST baffle tubes too!

BTW during my 40 yr career, Qantas used Mobil Jet Oil II exclusively in all their engines (others use it too) and that is a pure synthetic oil with excellent high temperature qualities. Yes it will burn as in the A380 RR engine failure out of Singapore, but not in normal operation! I still regard Mobil as the leader in synthetic oil technology and monitoring.

Hope the above is helpful & clarifies any misnomers.

David

[bartman (Bart)]

Thank you David for your in depth explanation!
I'll redo them and see how I go!
Cheers
Bart
ps and thanks too Marc!

[[1ponders] (Paul)]

You are just the man I need to talk to David. I hope Bart doesn't mind if we talk grease, in particular, old grease.

The attached image is the Dec shaft of a G11 I stripped over the weekend. The grease was like dried honey. All things being equal, how old would this grease be? I've not seen grease this dried before. Could this happen in a couple of years. The roller and taper bearings were frozen solid and I didn't think I would get one of the roller bearings moving again. There was some serious WD40 and degreaser and rotational force with a rubber handle of a hammer to get the rollers to finally move.


The mount has been permanently mounted in an observatory since it was bought. I'd be interested in your thoughts.

And Bart here's the layout of a GM8 (all but identical to a G11)

[bartman (Bart)]

Originally Posted by [1ponders]

You are just the man I need to talk to David. I hope Bart doesn't mind if we talk grease, in particular, old grease.

Nope dont mind at all....the more to read, the more I learn I guess (even old grease stories)!!!!
More examples....the better!

Originally Posted by [1ponders]

And Bart here's the layout of a GM8 (all but identical to a G11)

Cheers....maybe a closeup pic of the bearings (properly greased)

Anyway thanks again Paul
Bartman

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by [1ponders]

The attached image is the Dec shaft of a G11 I stripped over the weekend. The grease was like dried honey. All things being equal, how old would this grease be? I've not seen grease this dried before. Could this happen in a couple of years.

Not a chance. Unless it's a really bad grease. You'll have to sand that DEC shaft to get rid of the bearing tracks. If the shaft is marked like this then the bearings have to be worse and need changing. I reckon this mount coped some serious water contamination.