Suggestion - Buy / Sell ~ Consider imposing > 100 posts before you can sell

[leon]

Well I have actually trusted a member to pay for what he got, so I sent it off thinking he would do the right thing.

The money never came, it was not a lot, but the principal of the thing, has warned me to see the dollars in the bank before it leaves my place.

This was some time ago, and I never raised the issue and have never heard from him again.

leon

[Tandum (Robin)]

Originally Posted by qld

hi i must inform you that i paid $500 for a specific item as advertised and got an entirely different article

I'd be straight to the police, that's mail fraud. The feds could have easily found out who this person was and where they lived. However I don't think it's a moderators job to chase up bad trades unless directed to do so by the authorities. Maybe paying by paypal is an option then you have recourse, that would only have cost an extra $15 at most.

[iceman (Mike)]

While some of these stories are interesting and add weight to the suggestion that people should be careful buying stuff online, some of them are not really relevant to the original topic - that is, the SELLER having to wait before being allowed to post a new for-sale thread.

In fact some of those stories above were where the long-term member was the seller. It's obviously much easier to protect yourself when you're the seller.

There have been other suggestions about how you can protect yourself when trading online..
* Use (or insist) paypal,
* Use (or insist) registered post,
* Ask for their phone number and speak to them,
* Wait for the money to show in your account before posting
* etc

A general reminder from the TOS about using the IceTrade Classifieds (see section 10 for the whole list):

• Persons holding out items for sale shall be truthful in their description of items for sale, and shall not be indemnified by the administrators or moderators of the site in respect of any claim that a purchaser may have against such vendor under any trade practices or sale of good legislation.
• The administrators and moderators expressly have no liability for the transactions which may occur between members of the forum, whether through the medium of the IceTrade Classifieds, or otherwise.
• Each forum member who purchases an item from another forum member, does so at their own risk and they expressly waive any entitlement to bring any claim against an administrator or moderator with respect to any such transaction.

[torana68 (Roger)]

Originally Posted by leon

This was some time ago, and I never raised the issue and have never heard from him again. leon

what does he owe you Leon Ill chip in so the issue isnt the annoyance of spam posting (as yet, It may come to it, I forget how hard/easy it is to join, is the first post moderated?) but more in those who pop in for a short time and go, is it possible to be banned from the for sale/wanted's for some time or number of posts or?
Roger

[PeterM]

I have bought several items off IIS with no issue (including a $1500 purchase) I do however insist always that the item is sent COD where I then pay for it at my local post office - the seller also has to fill out a fair amount of personal details when sending. If the seller doesn't want to do business this way then I am not interested. It is not fool proof. I always exchange phone numbers before buying and ring to confirm the item has been sent. Sure there is no guarantee of what's in the box until its opened. Once you have paid Australia Post the seller is sent an Australia Post money order, so I guess there is a paper trail in the event of an issue.

COD slows the process in your favour after you have committed to buy and the seller must go through steps and they will be paid - no risk to them. If it doesn't turn up you don't pay. Be wary if COD is dismissed outright.
Not sure of weight or package size restrictions on this with Aust Post for COD.

For the most part if it is too good to be true then I always assume it is and take other measures to ensure the item and seller exist, maybe local family, friends, check white pages. Those that set out to scam rely on a quick response and $ transfer and it's not always the unwary that bite, just human nature.

So now we know of several members on IIS who have not received items they paid for, that is of concern and I feel for those who have lost $ but I don't see a link between having people post many times before selling and how that would have helped stop this. I don't see it as being the Mods role to get involved in sour transactions.

Buyer beware doesn't always save you. COD might help. Having the item sent by registered post may help in the locating a lost item but no guarantees there either. Staying vigilant, reporting what may look like suspicious ads and letting Mike and the Mods deal with it as they did recently seems a good start.



PeterM.

[MikeyB (Michael)]

I used to sell guitar gear on the old sold.com website and always used COD because I thought it was safe for both parties, although quite expensive for the buyer if only a small item. Unfortunately, one 'buyer' wouldn't collect his parcel from the Post Office, so it was eventually returned to me by Australia Post, with postage both ways and COD fees all payable by myself. I didn't do that again.

[casstony]

Originally Posted by PeterM

Be wary if COD is dismissed outright.
PeterM.

I'd rather not sell an item than be bothered mucking around with COD.

[astroron (Ron)]

Stephen! No where on this site does it state 7000 active members, it just says that we have 7000 members.
Clubs all over the world have a membership list but most of the time only a small proportion are active participants.

Most of those who have never posted in, say 2 years of their registration should be deleted

Are you going to do the deleting, is it really worth the effort

[Tandum (Robin)]

If you try and search without signing up and logging on you have to fill out one of those anti-robot code boxes everytime. On CN you can't search without signing up and logging on. I don't see the problem with non posters myself.

[stephenb (Stephen)]

Originally Posted by astroron

Stephen! No where on this site does it state 7000 active members, it just says that we have 7000 members.
Clubs all over the world have a membership list but most of the time only a small proportion are active participants.

Most of those who have never posted in, say 2 years of their registration should be deleted

Are you going to do the deleting, is it really worth the effort

Where did I mention "active" members, Ron?

In the end 7300 members looks better than 3000, doesn't it?

[astroron (Ron)]

Stephen! WHAT IS YOUR POINT?
If looks is all you are cribbing about, it's a bit sad.
As I said are you going to do the deleting?
I bet that cloudy nights does not delete members who do not post after a certain amount of time.

[Screwdriverone (Chris)]

Hi All,

I recently sold my long standing ad of a Robotic Lawn Mower (yay me!) for $2000 and the buyer very smartly asked me for verification that I was who I said I was and yes, I had the item with me. I supplied him with photos of me and the mower as well as proof of identity with licence but identifying details blacked out for MY security.

I did not ship the item until the money was deposited and this was only done after I had quite rightly put in writing that I would send the item and provided my address and knew his address and contact details.

All very sensible and all above board. Everything went smoothly and I kept him in the loop as to the delivery time, tracking number and company who is carted it etc.

The key to anything like this is to communicate and make sure the buyer AND the seller provide identifying information that can be verified.

I completely understood his request to identify me and sight the product to ensure he got what he paid for, in fact I commend him for doing so and I had no problems with the request, after all, it was a lot of money.

The difference is that I am an honest seller with nothing to hide and unfortunately there are some people out there who aren't. Not saying that I have any experience of this here, as all the items I have bought here have been fantastic, I am just saying to be wary, be informed, be smart and you won't have a problem.

This website provides a bulletin board for users to post items for sale, as far as I am concerned, (regardless of the legalese needed in the TOC), their responsibility stops there. This is not Ebay but a community forum of like minded individuals. It is no different than buying a chest of drawers from a flyer posted on a for sale board at the local shopping centre.

As with anything you buy, there is a certain risk. The secret is to learn how to minimise that risk by either buying from a dealer (who aren't allowed to sell on IceTrade) or take the chance online. Sure, you might get stung 1% of the time, but you simply have to weigh that up with the potential saving involved.

Importantly, back to the point of the thread, the first thing I notice about new posts for sale is the seller's post count and alarms start ringing if it is low and I am wary before I even scroll down to read the contents. My gut is an often overlooked early warning system which I have learned to trust as I have become older. I don't think a restriction on the minimum post count before sale is a good idea as it would exclude people who see an opportunity to maybe sell something they dont need but go elsewhere because its too hard to sell it here.

Bottom line: Human Nature being what it is, if you are an adult, who uses the internet to any degree and trust everything you read and you don't protect yourself, then sooner or later you WILL encounter untrustworthy people who only want to rip you off. It is naive to think otherwise.

Sorry for the length of the essay

Cheers

Chris

[allan gould]

Chris
Have to agree with you. If you cant get a prompt and clear reply to succinct questions or they start to spin a line about something you have not asked about then I'll purchase direct from a dealer or forget about it.

[Waxing_Gibbous (Peter)]

Its quite possible that someone may sign-up in order to only to buy / sell equipment. That seems perfectly legitimate.
It may also be reasonable that, like other fora, a modest 'subscription' is charged for those wishing to use the buy and sell section.
The subscriber would then have to supply a legitimate address/contact number. Not fool-proof admittedly, but more so than a post limit.

[Visionoz (Bill)]

There are also others like myself who contacts via PM only for purchases on items put up for sale by sellers as I want my transactions as discreet as possible

I can see not benefit in imposing a limit on minumum posts as it is not a mechanism that guarantees the honesty/integrity of the seller! As someone else said here, it's best for the two parties to communicate and verify each others bona fides before parting with one's money - after all the seller has to give me the bank details to bank the payment into and there's already a paper-trail so if anything goes pear-shaped at least the authorities can trace the account-holder's address etc; unless of course the individual is so great a scammer that even the banks get hoodwinked in allowing the person to open an account without proper 100-points ID!! in which case I'll have to consider that I've gone to the casino and threw a bad hand of the dice and lost!!

My 2cents worth

Cheers
Bill

[DavidTrap (David)]

I've bought quite a few dollars worth of stuff (and sold a lot less dollars worth) in the last 12 months on IIS.

I agree with Chris's sentiments - I go with my gut feeling on the issue. I'm probably naive and will get burnt at some stage. I'd be unlikely to purchase an expensive item from someone with a limited post count.

It is a great resource to have this site available for trading. To tie this back to the original post, I would support the need for a minimum time for registration and post-count to help sort out the wheat from the chaff.

DT

[hotspur (Chris)]

A good thread,glad its been bought up.I think 100 post before you can sell is

far too harsh,I am other photography sites a lot less than this one,and they

want minimum of 50 before you can sell,thats very difficult,for people like me

that dont go on often,However I feel around 20 is fair,also a good point has been bought up here-if you dont post a post in say three months,you should

be deleted,I think thats fair.I have enjoyed selling and buying of this site.

It has all been very good,I even sold a bundle of timber I thought I would never sell that here!I agree with a previous poster that say half the number
that are belonging to this forum,never post,or only once,I think the moderators
should look at a the list,and see how many.or few a person has posted,and if they havent posted,be deleted.

Yes,its a very sad fact,that some will see sites as easy targets and rip people off,my only guide has been -if it does'nt feel right-dont do it.

I always look at how many posts a person has done,and then looked at a few of there posts,If I have never heard of them,Fortunatly all my purchases
have been of BOMBOs or other S.E QLD chaps,that I know-this helps

[JethroB76 (Jeff)]

What do you gain from deleting accounts of people who haven't posted in three months?

[iceman (Mike)]

Originally Posted by JethroB76

What do you gain from deleting accounts of people who haven't posted in three months?

Nothing, and it will never happen.

[Screwdriverone (Chris)]

Just thought of something re the 100 posts also, what's to stop someone just posting a smiley on a thread 100 times or on 100 threads to bring their count up? nothing, so therefore the 100 posts isn't really a deterrent.

Cheers

Chris