NSW Boat license

[Peter Ward]

Got my boat license today.

Don't even have a boat.

BUT if you live in NSW....
....you've got until June 1st before the increasingly dim NSW pollies will make you jump over all sorts of hurdles before you can enjoy a day on the water....I strongly suspect only so they can be "seen to be doing something" about the occasional media hysteria generated from aquatic Darwin Award winners.....grrr...

[acropolite (Phil)]

Sadly, you're right. In Tassie, we have to wear life jackets at all times, even though I have a decent size boat I must have a life jacket on even if I'm fishing in mirror smooth water. My boat is 5.2 metres long, 600mm longer and I wouldn't have to wear a lifejacket. I'm not against lifejackets, I simply can't see the need to swelter on a hot summers day while I'm fishing in dead calm water.

Almost all boating incidents/accidents can be traced back to Alcohol, inexperience and "gottagetthereitis" i.e. the need to venture out and catch fish or dive when conditions are unsuitable.

[Kevnool (Kev)]

Its a good license to have, But while everyone drinks 1 person has to stay sober till the boy and his mates have finished there fun behind the boat, thats me.

Aint got the PWC tho.

Cheers Kev.

[dpastern (Dave Pastern)]

All I'll say isn't it better to be cautious and alive, than inconvenienced and dead if some unexpected accident occurs?

Dave

[Peter Ward]

Originally Posted by dpastern

All I'll say isn't it better to be cautious and alive, than inconvenienced and dead if some unexpected accident occurs?

Dave

It's the degree of bubble wrapping I detest.

I ( and all my school mates of 4 decades past) have managed to achieve a respectable age with all appendages intact...

Yet played with fireworks on the Queen's Birthday (penny bungers and all)

• rode a push bike without a helmet,

• flew glow plug powered aeroplanes in the local park

• drove a speed boat *without a license* with water-skiers in tow, before my teen years

• made my own fireworks, rockets & hydrogen filled baloons

• used a spud/pop gun without a firearms license

• scuba-dived without a PADI card

• went surfing at beaches that these days would be "closed"

• worked outside without a fluro-jacket......yet was never hit by anything other than a nesting magpie.

Life has risks.

Yet it seems to me many have lost the ability for critical thought and let others control our activities by deeming an outcome, however remote, is a "possible" outcome....and must be legislated against!!

I frankly don't think your average Aussie these days has the slightest notion of what the price of freedom is....except maybe that poor ******* (looked like an accountant in a hawaiian shirt) who got his face buried in the footpath during APEC, by the NSW Police, well, for jay-walking.

I'll get off the soapbox now....

[dpastern (Dave Pastern)]

I do understand what you're saying Peter, but sadly, your average person (not just Australian) doesn't really contemplate what they're doing. You might, but they don't. That's the difference between *you* and them, and why you haven't gotten hurt, and they do.

I'm a poor swimmer, so If I was going out on a boat, I'd be making sure to put a life jacket on. That's common sense. I know I don't need the law to tell me to do it, at least in my circumstances, but I'm sure there's plenty of others who are weak swimmers who would benefit as well, but don't use commonsense.

Dave

[Hagar (Doug)]

Originally Posted by Peter Ward

It's the degree of bubble wrapping I detest.

I ( and all my school mates of 4 decades past) have managed to achieve a respectable age with all appendages intact...

Yet played with fireworks on the Queen's Birthday (penny bungers and all)

• rode a push bike without a helmet,

• flew glow plug powered aeroplanes in the local park

• drove a speed boat *without a license* with water-skiers in tow, before my teen years

• made my own fireworks, rockets & hydrogen filled baloons

• used a spud/pop gun without a firearms license

• scuba-dived without a PADI card

• went surfing at beaches that these days would be "closed"

• worked outside without a fluro-jacket......yet was never hit by anything other than a nesting magpie.

Life has risks.

Yet it seems to me many have lost the ability for critical thought and let others control our activities by deeming an outcome, however remote, is a "possible" outcome....and must be legislated against!!

I frankly don't think your average Aussie these days has the slightest notion of what the price of freedom is....except maybe that poor ******* (looked like an accountant in a hawaiian shirt) who got his face buried in the footpath during APEC, by the NSW Police, well, for jay-walking.

I'll get off the soapbox now....

I do hope after this expose you have a pilots license.

You do have to remember the rule makers are only in business because of the irresponsible and fools amongst us.

[Peter Ward]

Originally Posted by Hagar

I do hope after this expose you have a pilots license.

A what license ?

Originally Posted by Hagar

You do have to remember the rule makers are only in business because of the irresponsible and fools amongst us.

"death by mis-adventure" is Nature's way of firming-up the gene pool....

Seriously though...I suspect something in the fabric of society has changed, and the majority of people through ignorance or fear of litigation are happy to pass on the responsibility of their actions to others,
who in turn, don't want to be responsible, so take the easy way out and simply ban or restrict anything even mildly "risky"

[TrevorW]

I work for the Education system and let me tell you

the Federal Govt give employers of apprentices and trainees

$4500 for them to achieve a Cert III qualification

Apprentices and some trainees are entitled to

Tool allowances $800 p/y
Fee allowances $500 p/y (trainees $400)
Travel and accommodation allowance if they travel over 35klms one way to TAFE
Payment by the State Government to training organisations for delivery to an apprentice $13000 over 3 years and most of this is on the job training

The employer and apprentice pay nothing and these same apprentices once qualified could be earning $100000 or more per year.

My daughters are going to UNI, one to be a nurse, HEC's debt when they finish, pay for all their books and ancillaries get nothing for travel and still have to work part time to pay their way.

The Govt gone loopy they've got it all wrong we are moddle coddling a generation who will grow up thinking they are not responsible for anything including their own future.

[Karls48 (Karl)]

I totally agree with Peter Ward. I have done most of things he describes and many more that would be described by today’s standards irresponsible, stupid, crazy, politically incorrect, dangerous and so on. Sailed 30-foot yacht for three years around Australia without any licence or any knowledge of sailing (done one year course on gliders when I was 16 years old so I had some clue about navigation). Enjoyed it all even when it hurt sometimes. I’m old fart now but I thank my lucky star that I was young in fifties. If this is an evolution, most of the humankind is on its way to extinction.

[koputai (Jason)]

Yes, in NSW at the moment it's very easy to get a boat license, but I actually think making it harder is possibly a good thing. There are so many people out there in charge of boats who have absolutely no clue as to what they are doing. I'm out on the water a lot, and I'd say 30% of people in power boats should either grow a brain or keep off the water. At the moment you can hire a boat and take it out on the water WITHOUT a license, and that is bad. People with no water sense, or common sense, putting peoples safety at risk.
I don't think we're over regulated. We can still go out hoist the sails and race in 35 kts of wind. We can still go offshore and travel up or down the coast whenever we like. For your own safety you should have appropriate training, but there's still plenty of freedom to be had out there.

Cheers,
Jason.
35ft Beneteau "Chica Pica"

[Peter Ward]

Originally Posted by koputai

I'd say 30% of people in power boats should either grow a brain or keep off the water.

No problem with that sentiment, but I'd prefer for the Maritime Coppers to fix the problem by simply rounding the offenders up (eg, "Hey! Iditot! Come 'ere! " ) than bubble wrap legislation.

Originally Posted by koputai

...I don't think we're over regulated...

!! Guess we'll have to agree to disagree there

[avandonk]

Nothing beats pulling an 6g loop in a Pitts and hoping you don't black out as the tunnel vision starts to cut in.

All done under controlled conditions. I could push the stick forward!

If we all started doing this they would make even more regulations.

I propose that before anyone does something really stupid they should pass an intelligence test. DOH!

Bert

[Baddad (Marty)]

Hey Bert and All,

I propose that before anyone does something really stupid they should pass an intelligence test. DOH!

Bert

Not long ago, speaking with a customer. She told me how she was driving home after picking up her son. The son had just passed his learner driving test.

The son requested to take the wheel and drive home. Aaahh!
Having been turned down he started begging and harrassing to be able to drive.
Ignorance breeds over confidence. The son had no idea of the driving skills he lacked.

I believe this is the main reason for a lot of accidents. Lack of training and people not giving due care, believing they know better.

Cheers Marty

[Peter Ward]

Originally Posted by Baddad

.........
Ignorance breeds over confidence. The son had no idea of the driving skills he lacked.

Sure, it is very much a case of "you don't know what you don't know" but
if there is only one way to get experience....

The son was an albeit newly licenced driver, but licenced none the less.

I taught both my kids how to drive, manual transmission, I was hard on them but they both passed first go. I would have been happy for them to drive me home (in fact I think they both did!)

I find it laughable that kids now have to spend more hours in a car (in NSW) to get their "P's" than it takes to get a private pilot's licence.

Ergo, shouldn't we also be seeing a spate of young men and women crashing light aircraft all across the country?

I suspect the problem is a cultural and attitudinal one rather than lack of driving skill....but the dopes in Macquarie street legislate, again, and again, and again.....

[robgreaves]

A boat license? That's hilarious

Coming from the UK, we thought that was bad for needless bureaucracy, 'Health and Safety gone mad', and 'A piece of Paper' mentality, but sadly, after one and a half years of experience living here, Australia takes the biscuit

I have never before seen so many pieces of paper for various things, including tests, 'qualifications' (I use the term loosely) for doing even the most basic everyday tasks, and inane knee-jerk governmental rules and regulations.

Sadly, once things like this start to erode your everyday life, there's no turning back.

Regards,
Rob

[koputai (Jason)]

Originally Posted by Peter Ward

Ergo, shouldn't we also be seeing a spate of young men and women crashing light aircraft all across the country?

Um, we probably would if their mums and dads had taught them how to fly.
It's all about the quality of the training. Not many bad pilots become instructors. Bad drivers do, every day, in your suburb and mine.

Cheers,
Jason.

[dpastern (Dave Pastern)]

Personally, I feel very confident in saying that 95% of drivers currently on the road should NOT be. People do not take the right to driving seriously I'm afraid. You should be lucky that I don't make the decisions - I'd be lifting the minimum age for a drivers licence to 21, and making them do a advanced road safety course as well. In most European countries, it is far harder to get a drivers licence than here. There are simply far too many idiots on our roads. And these idiots are so self centered that they care for no one else other than their own greedy little selves. I know there are good drivers out there, don't get me wrong, but they are an extreme minority imho.

Dave

Originally Posted by Peter Ward

Sure, it is very much a case of "you don't know what you don't know" but
if there is only one way to get experience....

The son was an albeit newly licenced driver, but licenced none the less.

I taught both my kids how to drive, manual transmission, I was hard on them but they both passed first go. I would have been happy for them to drive me home (in fact I think they both did!)

I find it laughable that kids now have to spend more hours in a car (in NSW) to get their "P's" than it takes to get a private pilot's licence.

Ergo, shouldn't we also be seeing a spate of young men and women crashing light aircraft all across the country?

I suspect the problem is a cultural and attitudinal one rather than lack of driving skill....but the dopes in Macquarie street legislate, again, and again, and again.....

[Peter Ward]

Originally Posted by koputai

....
It's all about the quality of the training. Not many bad pilots become instructors. Bad drivers do, every day, in your suburb and mine.

Cheers,
Jason.

Quality, not quantity of training? Now there's a concept!

Germans can barrel down, *very safely* on autobahns at speeds that our legistaltors would put you in gaol for, yet happly ignore the German model and licensing requirements.
eg. First aid, Compulsory driving school (where cars have dual controls),
auto mechanics, autobahn driving etc.

We won't change while State Governments in Oz make millions from speeding fine & license revenues.... as Rob says a license or certificate to serve beer, make sandwiches, float a boat, work on a roof, own a cat, cut down a tree.....

[marc4darkskies (Marcus)]

Originally Posted by dpastern

Personally, I feel very confident in saying that 95% of drivers currently on the road should NOT be...I know there are good drivers out there, don't get me wrong, but they are an extreme minority imho.

Originally Posted by dpastern

..., but sadly, your average person (not just Australian) doesn't really contemplate what they're doing.

Yikes!!! You're not serious are you Dave? An average person (errr - like me) doesn't think about what they're doing??? Are you an average person? And do you really believe that only 1 in 20 people deserve to hold a drivers license??!! That means that of the 11 or so people who have responded to this thread, no one is good enough to drive a car???!!!

I believe it's just that kind of holier than thou mentality that drives the thought processes of some of our legislators when they seek to introduce more stupid regulation to control our lives ... I.e. we government folk know better than you poor ignorant plebs - we'll save you from yourselves!

I say the majority of people ARE capable of critical thought and ARE able to make sensible choices without having rules dictated at them. And for the true idiots there are prisons and hospitals that will fix them right up.

Marcus

PS: Good thread Peter!