Should you turn your computer off with a broadband connection?

[OneOfOne (Trevor)]

My wife's daughter insists on leaving her computer on, even when no-one is home, perhaps for 6 hours or more. Other than the waste of energy and cost, I have heard from somewhere that it is not a good idea to leave a computer turned on that has a broadband connection. We have Nortons virus and firewall (when the registration runs out I think I will change to something less hungry) with a wireless broadband connection. Her computer is directly connected (100Mbits) and my computer, laptop and iPaq are connected over the wireless connection. When not in use they are always turned off.

My understanding is that it is possible for hackers to automatically search for live connections and may be able to hack into the computer to gain access to your connection. I am also worried that other applications that you just "must have" like LimeWire, iTunes etc could be using the connection to allow file sharing etc when you are not using it. TaskManager is more than two screens long and she always complains about how slow it is (hmmm can't work out why?) Any thoughts?

At the moment if I come home and the computer is left on, I just "turn it off" and never shutdown properly, in fact if I am peeved enough I will start up a number of applications and turn it off before they are completely started Unfortunately, this has only caused one "improper shutdown" so far

[Zuts]

Hi,

I think the only relevant argument is that it is a waste of power. If you have power management turned on then this should be minimal.

If a hacker can get you then they can get you while you are using it, they dont have to wait until you go away. As long as you have a natted router and antivirus then you should be completely safe.

As far as itunes, emule et al sucking up your bandwidth you can monitor this; also it is possible to set emule etc to limit them to a certain amount of upload bandwidth.

Anyway, my teenage daughter is the same, it annoys the hell out of me but I have leant to live with it

Paul

[programmer]

Originally Posted by OneOfOne

My wife's daughter insists on leaving her computer on, even when no-one is home, perhaps for 6 hours or more.

What is her reasoning for leaving it on?

Other than the waste of energy and cost,

this wouldn't amount to much, but still doesn't make sense to waste it

We have Nortons virus and firewall

If correctly configured, that should keep you pretty safe

My understanding is that it is possible for hackers to automatically search for live connections and may be able to hack into the computer to gain access to your connection.

That's always possible, and if you're infected with trojans (if your daughter is prone to opening spam email, etc.) then it's a problem. It's easy enough to connect to a wireless access point. I'm assuming you have security turned on with your wireless connection and at least a 20-character random (non dictionary) encryption key.

I am also worried that other applications that you just "must have" like LimeWire, iTunes etc could be using the connection to allow file sharing etc when you are not using it.

They will because that's what they're all about, especially if you have left default settings (upload limits, etc)

TaskManager is more than two screens long and she always complains about how slow it is (hmmm can't work out why?) Any thoughts?

Is that 2 screens of 'applications' or 'processes'? If applications, that's pretty over the top!

At the moment if I come home and the computer is left on, I just "turn it off" and never shutdown properly, in fact if I am peeved enough I will start up a number of applications and turn it off before they are completely started Unfortunately, this has only caused one "improper shutdown" so far

Not sure what you're trying to achieve here.. just the annoyance factor?

[Barrykgerdes]

As it was said before. A good firewall will keep most of the nasties away. But a wireless network will allow alsorts of computers in range use your internet.

I had this trouble once but turned my modem off and the computer stayed connected to the internet through someone else's system. My wireless now is set for exclusive mac addresses and I don't have any trouble.

At the moment I have installed a program called "logmein" that allows me to access my computer anywhere by logging on through the internet. However if I can use it from the remote I am sure a commited hacker could also get in so there is nothing on my computer that you can't already find on the internet.

The main thing to remember is that if you have your computer on the internet don't put anything on it that you don't want to share with the world. Keep a separate computer for this and transfer any files you need by disk. No matter what you do there are so many holes in Microsoft's operating systems (for their own use) that nothing is 100% secure.

On the subject of slowing of computers. I have a lovely 2.5GH Pentium 4 computer in my garage that I was given by a friend who got another because it had become so slow and no one could fix it. She had children that had ipods, Limewire etc and Norton Anti Virus that got into a loop and 2000 errors in the registry. It took me 6 hours to remove all the garbage and clean it up but now it simply flies as a basic computer on my network and does real processing work for me.

Barry

[programmer]

Originally Posted by Barrykgerdes

The main thing to remember is that if you have your computer on the internet don't put anything on it that you don't want to share with the world.

Don't forget there's more harm to be done than 'just' stealing stuff on your pc. Your pc could become a 'zombie' doing lots of damage such as sending spam email, etc. as part of a larger network of controlled pc's.

Edit: I believe that MAC address filtering is not as secure as having a large, random security key and using WEP.

[snowyskiesau]

I have three computers on my home network and they are always powered on.

Major reason is that I work in IT and some contracts allow me to work from home. When at a customer site, I can connect into my home systems if there is something I need to retrieve. On occasions, I perform remote monitoring of servers and alerts need to get back to my servers.
I run a hardware firewall than does not allow any incoming connections except via a VPN.

I do have a wireless access point for use with the laptop (and a TV set top box connection) which I have this configured for MAC address filtering. So far, no one has been able to get free internet access via the wireless connection.

[acropolite (Phil)]

If you run skype and leave your machine on all the time with skype logged on you will be used as a supernode, i.e. your machine will carry some connection details and will incurr traffic for (some) other users initial call setup. On large networks with many skype users the resource used can be significant, that's the reason why many corporations and government bodies ban the use of skype. If you're curious, google skype supernode.

[programmer]

Originally Posted by snowyskiesau

I have three computers on my home network and they are always powered on.

Major reason is that I work in IT

There are definitely lots of good reasons for leaving PCs on, even for home users (overnight downloads, etc) but I'm not sure why the OP's daughter needs to.

So far, no one has been able to get free internet access via the wireless connection.

Or more likely, nobody has tried

Don't get me wrong I've left my wireless AP unprotected many times and never had anyone use it. Chances are pretty low, as they have to be physically close, i.e. a neighbour or someone parked out the front of your house.

[Benny L (Ben)]

my step brother leaves his computer on 24-7.. drives me bananas! so i know how the OP feels

So i wait until he gets home and flick the switch in the meter box to exact my revenge lol

[snowyskiesau]

Originally Posted by programmer

Or more likely, nobody has tried

Don't get me wrong I've left my wireless AP unprotected many times and never had anyone use it. Chances are pretty low, as they have to be physically close, i.e. a neighbour or someone parked out the front of your house.

I've had a few attempts to connect to my wireless access point. I have a monitor set up such that if too many attempts are made to connect from an unknown MAC address, the access point is disabled for a while. Continued attempts result in the access point being disabled. As I only use this for the set top box (and rarely the laptop), should the access point be disabled, it's not a major problem.

I have been tempted to try this option one day
http://www.ex-parrot.com/~pete/upside-down-ternet.html

[Glenhuon (Bill)]

We have 4 computers here 3 of which are connected to the net through a 4 port modem. They all get turned off every night and often through the day if no one is going to be home. The excuse that they don't use much power doesn't hold water. Indivdually not much, but collectively (e.g. 1,000 puters left on overnight and not being used) the power waste becomes much more significant.
I can understand where your coming from Re a two page Task manager, sounds pretty close to my step daughters machine . Why they have to have all these programs running at once I'll never know. Jacqui was on the 4th port of our modem for one month, our monthly usage doubled and we were "shaped" to 64 for the first time ever. She is now back on dial up, permanently.
A good way to speed up your machine is to dump anything connected with Norton. It is a resource hog of the first water, and not as effective as many other internet security programs. I got rid of it after it allowed a virus through on two occasions. Have used AVG+Firewall for over two years now with no problems.

Bill

[programmer]

Originally Posted by snowyskiesau

I have been tempted to try this option one day
http://www.ex-parrot.com/~pete/upside-down-ternet.html

That's great

[Barrykgerdes]

Originally Posted by programmer

Don't forget there's more harm to be done than 'just' stealing stuff on your pc. Your pc could become a 'zombie' doing lots of damage such as sending spam email, etc. as part of a larger network of controlled pc's.

Edit: I believe that MAC address filtering is not as secure as having a large, random security key and using WEP.

Yes I know that your computer can become someone else's slave but I think I have avoided that OK. I don't visit the sites that usually harbour these trojans and I don't read junk e-mail. Just consign it to the garbage.

Mac addresses are not totally secure as you say but I live in a residential area where there are only about 15 houses within the RF radius, about half of them have wireless routers but the owners are non techo. (I am the neighbourhood nerd and have set up all their computers at some time). It was the wireless routers that gave me some trouble that they probably did not have a clue about and rather than encryption I settled for mac addresses as the easiest. I actually provide free wireless 1500/256 internet access for two of my neighbours who can't get ADSL. Between use we still only use 1/4 of my allowance.

As a reward these neighbours are always trying to do things for me. While I was out the other day. I came home to find the front garden all re-landscaped and the back yard mown. Another time I was given a very expensive new HO locomotve that had been found in his warehouse with no owner. It pays to be "right neighbourly"

Barry

[programmer]

Originally Posted by Barrykgerdes

While I was out the other day. I came home to find the front garden all re-landscaped and the back yard mown. Another time I was given a very expensive new HO locomotve that had been found in his warehouse with no owner. It pays to be "right neighbourly"
Barry

What the.. ? Wow I wouldn't mind getting free gardening for a little internet usage! I'm friendly with the guy across the road who is an avid gardener, too.. Might be too far away though

[g__day (Matthew)]

I would advocate put it behind a hardware firewall - such as most NAT routers have anyway, and yes run TrendMicro or Nortons or Zone Labs Suite software protections.

[Barrykgerdes]

Originally Posted by programmer

What the.. ? Wow I wouldn't mind getting free gardening for a little internet usage! I'm friendly with the guy across the road who is an avid gardener, too.. Might be too far away though

Worth a try. Gardening is on list of the most tedious of chores, to be avoided at all costs. My range is about 100 metres at the front of the house but only about 25 metres at the back.

Barry

[OneOfOne (Trevor)]

In the big scheme, the power used by one computer may not be much....but if it was turned on at 10am (those admin logs come in handy) and she left for Uni by 11 and I come home at 5pm with the computer still on...it seems like a hell of a waste energy. Not just the computer though, lights left on. One day the heater was left on (she reckoned it was cold in the morning, ie. about 19 in the house). She would have left by lunch time and I came home to a stinking hot house of 26 degrees! Mind you it was 30 outside. Then I have to pay for the air conditioning to try to get the temperature down to a reasonable temperature by bed time, and opening the doors wouldn't help! Needless to say, I turned the lock on! Problem is you can't turn it on at all without entering the PIN. I would have thought you could just not change the setting, then I would just set it to 20 and leave it.

Oh, the task manager is processes running with no applications. We wore one computer out as it took 30 minutes to get to the login because it took so long for all the viruses to start up. We had someone remove them once and they got over a thousand of all varieties. Within a month most of them were back...

So now I do all my internet stuff on my computer and never bother to scan hers....not my problem any more. Mine runs much faster...except Nortons kicks in after a few minutes and takes all the CPU time...really must give it the flick. She doesn't know we have internet access on my computer and laptop, and she doesn't know the password either!

Starting up applications and turning off the computer can cause an "improper shutdown" which makes Windows do a scan disk at startup...which annoys the hell out of HER (revenge), but it doesn't seem to happen often. I might have a look at the power management and see if I can have it turn itself off after an hour or so of inactivity.

[programmer]

Originally Posted by OneOfOne

One day the heater was left on

Well with all that going on the computer (idling) would be only a small part but I agree, turn it off..

Oh, the task manager is processes running with no applications.

well that's not so bad, EXCEPT one of those pages is probably all trojans!

We wore one computer out as it took 30 minutes to get to the login because it took so long for all the viruses to start up. We had someone remove them once and they got over a thousand of all varieties. Within a month most of them were back...

If she just does browsing/chatting, maybe run in a virtual pc session each time and just delete the virtual session each time I'm joking of course... kind of.

So now I do all my internet stuff on my computer and never bother to scan hers....not my problem any more.

There's very little you can do when the user of the pc does not care.. some things require the users' help unfortunately

[Dooghan (Dooghan)]

I have my computer on 24/7. It's the most used device in my house. It gets used though out the day and into the night most days. I do have some power savings turned on. My NAT router gives me protection from the net but I also run a firewall on the computer. It's manly there for programs that make outbound connection. If I don't know what the program is that trying to make a outbound connection, then access is denied.

I'm a bit shocked that anyone thinks MAC address or WEP is secure. WEP keys can be cracked in under 60sec and MAC address in like 10sec. WEP was made be software engineers and not security people. It's a joke. I do have to say if you only have older hardware that only supports WEP then use it. It better then nothing. I would also be looking to see if I could upgrade to WPA by firmware. I use nothing less then a 63 character random encryption key (non dictionary) on my wireless (WPA) network. They say 20 is the minimum you should use.

As for MAC address. If your got a active wireless connections between your computer and the router. And I was to capture some of those packets between the 2 devices, I've got your MAC address. Then it's so easy to spoof the MAC address and make your router think my computer is your computer. The some goes with SSID. I've read and people have told me that it should be turned off. I can't see why. If you have got a active connection and someone is collecting the packets, then they can get your SSID from the packets

[JethroB76 (Jeff)]

Originally Posted by Dooghan

I'm a bit shocked that anyone thinks MAC address or WEP is secure. WEP keys can be cracked in under 60sec and MAC address in like 10sec.

My thoughts too...go with WPA if you can