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Old 19-12-2007, 08:28 PM
Venessa
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Question Flashing light in Taurus or Geosynchronous Satellite?

Hi there, I am a new member and a very amateur sky watcher! We live in the north of South Aust, near Pt Germein - no city lights!! Hubby and I like to watch the night sky always in the hope of seeing something special and boy we have seen some sights that we need experienced sky watchers views on. Most recently was Saturday 8th December (sorry it was so long ago, but it has taken me a while to find your website) Between 10pm and 10.30pm in the NNE sky in Taurus - and more specifically I think it was near the star with the symbol similar to the letter "u" -"above" and slightly to right of the "V" arrangement of stars (Haydes) - we saw a flashing light (naked eye-no telescopes or bino's)- approx 5 seconds between flashes (when visible - was not overly bright, blue tinge)- it seemed quite stationary - we believe the movement we saw was the stars movement rather than our light - we observed it for maybe 20 minutes before we lost visibility. Over the next 5 nights we were able to see it again when we didn't have clouds - same time frame, same spot
Did we see a spinning geosynchronous satellite?
Apologies for my amateur descriptions, I hope you may be able to make some sense of where and what I am talking about!!
Cheers all, hoping someone can tell me what we saw.
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Old 19-12-2007, 08:52 PM
AUSMCMLXXXV
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i was going to say an iridium flare but 20 mins seems like a long time for that. have you tried heavens-above.com ? punch in your location and it helps predicts when satelites pass overhead. hope that helps.

cheers
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  #3  
Old 19-12-2007, 09:35 PM
Jarrod
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Hi Venessa, and welcome to IIS.

although I can't tell you what it was, I saw a similar blinking light around 10:30pm on the 30th of November, while at our our farm in central Victoria. I'm pretty confidant it would have been invisible under light polluted sky's.

You describe exactly what I saw, although it appeared to be moving very very slowly, I don't think this was an illusion due to the background stars moving, as it appeared to be moving NNE. It was somewhere near the constellation 'Pictor', I believe.

Jarrod
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Old 19-12-2007, 10:11 PM
Venessa
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Thanks guys
It definitely wasn't an iridium flare - we watch those quite frequently. This was a "flashing" light, 5 sec intervals and stationary . It was quite faint, our eyes had to be looking within a couple of finger widths to pick it up - but we were able to watch for a good 20 minutes. In this time it's position relative to the star "u" - it moved about 3-4 finger widths towards the east.
The only reasonable explaination we could come up with was a tumbling/spinning geosynchronous satellite - do they exist?
We love "heavens above" but he doesn't have anything that seemed to be appropriate to what we saw
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  #5  
Old 19-12-2007, 10:23 PM
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citivolus (Ric)
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There are tumbling geosynchronous satellites that have failed due to catastrophic component failure, both before and after deployment into service, or have had their fuel vented at the end of their service life. If the geometry was right, you could have seen the sun off a solar panel or other flat surface. 5 seconds is a fairly fast spin, but if the satellite had a ruptured fuel tank, the off-gassing could have given it one of any number of possible spin patterns.

http://members.aol.com/_ht_a/hattonj...asohp/GEO.HTML has this to say on the subject:

Quote:
The observability of geosynchronous satellites varies considerably. Whilst the smallest geosynchronous satellites may be almost impossible to observe visually except with a very large telescope, some non operational satellites may flash as brightly as magnitude +2 - visible to the naked eye even from a light polluted site. The factors which contribute to the brightness & observability of geosynchronous satellites include the nature of reflection of sunlight off the satellite structure (ie. diffuse vs specular reflections), the phase angle (angle between sun, satellite & observer) and whether the satellite is rotating or non rotating.
Additionally, this page has some interesting pictures.

Regards,
Eric

Last edited by citivolus; 19-12-2007 at 10:33 PM.
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Old 19-12-2007, 10:47 PM
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Inmykombi (Geoff)
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I agree with Eric (CITIVOLUS.)

A few years ago, I too saw a similar thing, both from my home near Gosford, and from a dark sky site in NSW. The flash interval was in my case , approx.15 seconds from memory . Appearing "almost" stationary in the sky while the stars kept moving due to earths rotation.
At the time, I called the Sydney observatory and got an answer machine with no reply afterward.
I then called a member of the Astronomical Society of NSW who was at their Observatory near Kurrajong NSW, who saw the flashing at the same interval, but at a different point in time ( due to a diff. observation location ).
From this we decided it was indeed a satellite spinning and reflecting sun-light back from itself.
I then also called the observatory at Buckety ( west of Gosford ) and spoke to a very helpful and interested person who actually plotted the path of this satellite over many hours, and who also phoned me the next day to say it was a satellite called KIKU 6.
A Japanese satellite launched in the early 1990's, that had failed to enter its Geosynchronous orbit as its last engine or stabilising rocket did not fire correctly.
It is now spinning out of control between 8000 Klm's and 18000 Klm's from earth on a very interesting egg shaped orbit.

I have witnessed this many times over the years in the Northern sky.

It would be very possible that there could be more such failed satellites up there also reflecting light toward us on earth.

Hope this helps.

Last edited by Inmykombi; 22-12-2007 at 12:20 AM.
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Old 19-12-2007, 11:57 PM
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astroron (Ron)
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Venessa and as Geoff says in his post it is most proberbly what is classed as space junkI have seen what I call flashers many times in my observing lifetime.
You sound as if you and hubby have found an idilic place to settle down
Cheers Ron
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Old 20-12-2007, 12:29 PM
Venessa
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Exclamation Flashing light anomalies

Wow, thanks for your help everyone!!
We were up last night from 2.30 - 4.30 am and were treated to a great show of the Geminid meteorite shower, sometimes as many as 3 per minute.
Us and our flashing lights - we have another type of unusual sightings - these ones move and are quite bright, but the flash is irregular. We had one directly above us at about 3.30am - it had a bright flash followed almost immediately by a very faint one approx 5-10 second intervals and was visible for only about 5 flashes (less than a minute) whilst moving about 2 "fists" east.
Second sighting was about 4.10am in the WNW, alt 55 deg - nice strong flashes, less than 5 secs heading north - at mid viewing we could see it as a steady light (as a "normal" satellite) in between flashes - then it went back to being just a flashing light before losing visibility. We tracked it for about 4-5 "fists" (all of these are naked eye sightings).
They were not aeroplanes (not unless they are some of Mr Bush's high altitude spy planes!!!!)
Any ideas - just plain old space junk? (would much rather have a more exotic explaination!!)
cheers from the flashers
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Old 20-12-2007, 12:56 PM
Venessa
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Thanks Eric - your link was very helpful, it really sounds like a good explaination for our 'flashes' - perhaps I would not have posted my anomaly query if I had read this link first!!
Cheers
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  #10  
Old 20-12-2007, 01:05 PM
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iceman (Mike)
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Hi Vanessa, and to IceInSpace!

Do you do all of your observing with naked eye, or do you own any telescopes too?

Nice to have you here, we hope you enjoy your stay and come back often!
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  #11  
Old 20-12-2007, 08:20 PM
Venessa
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Naked eye observation

Do you do all of your observing with naked eye, or do you own any telescopes too?


Dear Iceman
At this time we are only observing with the naked eye - mind you I have put the idea out there for a telescope, but I don't think Father Christmas has quite caught on!
Cheers
Venessa
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  #12  
Old 21-12-2007, 12:45 AM
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astroron (Ron)
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Venessa, Binoculars are cheapand you can see lots more than the naked eye, you will also see that your flashers flash more than the bright one s you see with the naked eye
Ron
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  #13  
Old 21-12-2007, 02:09 AM
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Gargoyle_Steve (Steve)
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Vanessa it may interest you to know that AstroRon and I were away at a weekend astronomy camp that same weekend, and at one point during the evening Ron spotted a "bright flasher" in what I recall to be pretty much the same area at least of the sky, somewhere between Taurus and Orion. We observed it flashing at about the same rate, and it was bright enough that when Ron drew my attention to it my first thought was that it was an aircraft with it's navigation lights still flashing.

This thought was rejected immediately as impossible - it was too high / moving way too slow for an aircraft, and an aircraft at that height doesn't use it flashers.

As observed through my 20x80 binoculars it was moving very slowly east. I could just see it (barely!) between flashes in the bino's. I'm pretty sure we observed this on the Saturday night as well, ie the 8th, (and not on the Friday night), although I can't be certain of what time of night we observed it.
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  #14  
Old 07-01-2008, 04:59 PM
colmaybury
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http://www.n2yo.com/?s=30323

http://web.mit.edu/stgs/pdfs/Forden%...iGlobSec31.pdf

Hi Vanessa et al. We found this same satellite. It is a Geosynchronous Chinese satellite called BeiDou 1D, we believe. You can track it on the n2yo site. The other site from MIT describes the reason and usage?????

I have written to the Chinese Embassy here in Aus will let you know if there is any reply. I have also asked n2yo for info.

The BeiDou 1D should be at an elevation between 45 and 55 degrees varying across the equator from above Woleai Is down to central PNG. It should pass beside Mu Tauri at 10:50 tonight. Regards, Col.

Have any of you seen it at any other times or positions in the starry sky?
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