I hear you Aster. It's all good
I drive a Hyundai too. They're not that bad actually. My second car is also a Hyundai (no joke). Maybe I'll redeem myself getting the G11?
" Precision machining and high quality bearings do very little, accept increase the manufactures bank balance" ???!!! Are you serious?
The EQ6 is excellent value for money, but last time I looked it wasn't loaded with:
Centreless ground precision worms,
Fully machined, anodized, brush finished T6 aluminium parts
Precision bearing mounted 1.25" stainless shafts and a servo
(ie stepperless) drive.....you think this comes for free?
G-11's typically return +/-5 arc secs periodic error, G-8's about 9 arc sec.
The multi alignment star pointing routine on the Gemini servo drive will land an object on a KAF0402 sized chip after a 150 degree slew
The small sample of EQ6's I've tested ran at about +/- 50 arc sec....and landing on a chip after a 150 degree slew? ...give me a break....then you spent how much time ripping apart your EQ6, de-burring, re-greasing etc to get adequate performance, but dismiss the time and effort as you handy in the workshop.
I have to say if was a car, I'd be taking it back to the manufacturer.
By the way, I have no problem with Chinese, Mongolian, Slovenian or any other type of mount.....I am simply saying its often a case of the right tool for the job....sure you can buy the plastic RJ11 crimper for $5..but after you've crimped a couple of dozen connectors the $45 metal version starts to look pretty good.
Alex, you got that seriously wrong. Precision engineering is THE difference.
Ive owned an LX90, G11 and PME. Huge difference between them all.
Fred
Used to have a 12.5" F6 mounted on a home made EQ mount. Consisted of 20mm welded steel plates , a couple of self aligning 75mm dia. plumber block bearings in RA. 50mm shaft for DEC. running in self lube bronze bushes with hand control slow motion. Ra was driven by a ala Texerau ribbon sector drive. After 1.5 hours I had to rewind. Deep space photography with exacta slr body, knife edge focuser, electronic control 2 buttons for RA made by a PM linesman. Offaxis guiding with spiderweb eyepiece. Star images after 45 minutes exposure on negative were pinpoints. Developed and printed on 10"x8" kodak paper and star images still pin points.
No stacking, no Photoshop etc. just the original raw image.
The Point I am trying to make is "WHERE IS THE PRECISSION"
I have managed to get very good tracking, lack of backlash etc on both a HEQ5 and EQ6 as they both have belt drives and much beefier stepper motors that eliminate the spur cut gearboxs. I think that these gearboxes are what let them down.
My first mount a HEQ5 had random 'microjumps' that only showed up at long focal lengths ie 1800mm. I replaced the motors and gearboxes with Astromeccanica motors with belt drives. The difference was amazing.
I am Happy with my EQ6 with belt drives and Mel Bartels system (see pic below). But I should have bit the bullet and gone for a 'quality' mount from day one in hindsight.
At least the cheaper mounts give you experience and if you are really still keen just simply upgrade as then you should have some idea of what you need rather than what you want.
Film is a no brainer compared to CCD's that show both I/R and UV aberrations (invisible to film stock) and on the most part have to be enlarged 4x more than film to get a 8x10 print.
I'd like to see some examples of what your system is producing.
Any links?
Cheers
Peter
Last edited by Peter Ward; 10-12-2007 at 06:30 PM.
Reason: spelling!
Used to have a 12.5" F6 mounted on a home made EQ mount. Consisted of 20mm welded steel plates , a couple of self aligning 75mm dia. plumber block bearings in RA. 50mm shaft for DEC. running in self lube bronze bushes with hand control slow motion. Ra was driven by a ala Texerau ribbon sector drive. After 1.5 hours I had to rewind. Deep space photography with exacta slr body, knife edge focuser, electronic control 2 buttons for RA made by a PM linesman. Offaxis guiding with spiderweb eyepiece. Star images after 45 minutes exposure on negative were pinpoints. Developed and printed on 10"x8" kodak paper and star images still pin points.
No stacking, no Photoshop etc. just the original raw image.
The Point I am trying to make is "WHERE IS THE PRECISSION"
ummm, I dont see the term "PE" or even more important,"non periodic error", without them ,your pissing upwind . On the other hand, if you got pin point stars with a SINGLE 45min exposure, 1/ your in the wrong job, you should be making mounts. 2/ if you can make them that good at less than $20K youd be a very rich man in a very short amount of time 3/ I would grovel in the mud, apologising profusely.
I am Happy with my EQ6 with belt drives and Mel Bartels system (see pic below). But I should have bit the bullet and gone for a 'quality' mount from day one in hindsight.
Thanks for your feedback. I'm glad I bit the bullet earlier than later.
I'm sure most of us would love to get high end gear first time around, and avoid the costly exercise of buying budget gear first and eventually spending more to upgrade later on.
But then there's others who simply can't afford to buy the high end gear. An EQ6 might be all they need and for the price, it's not a bad mount.
I carry 50kg on my EQ6 (25kg OTA + 25kg counterweights) and it does the job for long focal length planetary imaging. For deep space stuff, as long as I'm guiding it tracks fine for short focal length stuff.
And for people who aren't even considering putting a camera on the end of their telescope, they certainly wouldn't need to spend more than they need to on a mount that carries their telescope with enough capacity. If that's an HEQ5 or an EQ6, that's a good buy in my opinion.
Me, I'd love to get a high end mount. I just can't afford it so I have to work with what I've got.
Interesting call Peter - I would have guessed the Atlux sits between the old NJP and the much cheaper G11. Out of the box PE is supposed to be +/- 3 arc seconds which seems correct to me. I have heard the Tak's have the best machining for their price range, follwed by the Vixens then the Losmandy gear (again in their price range).
PS peter amazing shot - was it a $10K CCD on a $18K Paramount with a $10K apo or an even more expensive RCOS?
Hi Mike, I totally agree with you but I figured very early in the process that you don't need to mount big diameters or heavy scopes to start with astro-photos. As a matter of fact I was surprised to see most people even favouring smaller refractors and spending more money on mounts and CCD cameras.
I think the thread got lost between "bearing heavy weights and good tracking". I had the choice between a light weight Losmandy GM-8 and a heavier duty EQ6. I chose the Losmandy because tracking was more important to me than bearing heavier scopes. I'd rather compromise in scope diameter and not sacrifice tracking.
Within the same budget something's gotta give so on that point I totally agree with you. But still I'll get the best mount that I can then worry about what I can carry on it later even if I start with a "coke bottle" as my mates say.
It is true, the Vixen site says the PE is +/- 3" but, with PE. Whereas the Tak will do less than 5" with no PE. Actually there is no PE option on any Tak I know of.
None the less the fundamentals of the Atlux seem to be very good.
. On the other hand, if you got pin point stars with a SINGLE 45min exposure, 1/ your in the wrong job, you should be making mounts. 2/ if you can make them that good at less than $20K youd be a very rich man in a very short amount of time 3/ I would grovel in the mud, apologising profusely.
