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Old 15-02-2007, 09:07 PM
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Professor Resolves Einstein's Twin Paradox

Subhash Kak, Delaune Distinguished Professor of Electrical and Computer Engineering at LSU, recently resolved the twin paradox, known as one of the most enduring puzzles of modern-day physics

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0214220824.htm
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Old 15-02-2007, 09:52 PM
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Well der...
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Old 15-02-2007, 09:55 PM
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Well der...
I thought it was intertesting
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Old 15-02-2007, 09:57 PM
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I was just kidding, Ron.
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Old 15-02-2007, 10:00 PM
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No probs, it's just that when I was at Swinburne we covered this in the topic of star formation and I thought it was cool that the twins would age at a different rate, sort of cheating death as it were which is something I am actively working on
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Old 15-02-2007, 10:02 PM
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Thanks for the link tailwag - very interesting reading.
Initially I thought that Subhash Kak was one of your klingon greetings!!!!
I stand corrected!
Cheers
Doug
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Old 15-02-2007, 10:08 PM
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Initially I thought that Subhash Kak was one of your klingon greetings!!!!
Very clever
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Old 15-02-2007, 10:18 PM
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Very clever
I thank you!!!
Thanks again for the link - I love these cosmological conundrums!
Cheers
Doug
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Old 15-02-2007, 10:30 PM
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I thought I solved it here some time ago
I dont get it from what was said . Do you have a link to what it was that he siad or if the answer is before me on science daily could you explain how he has solved it . He says he solved but did he say how ? How is it solved? In the words of our great never made it leader.."Please explain"
Sorry but please help me here this is one of those things I have a thing about.
alex
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  #10  
Old 15-02-2007, 10:37 PM
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I dont get it from what was said . Do you have a link to what it was that he siad or if the answer is before me on science daily could you explain how he has solved it . He says he solved but did he say how ? How is it solved? In the words of our great never made it leader.."Please explain".
The full answer, will be published soon, see below:

Kak's findings were published online in the International Journal of Theoretical Science, and will appear in the upcoming print version of the publication.


This is a general description of what he did, few people living or dead would be able to fully appreciate the math here

"I solved the paradox by incorporating a new principle within the relativity framework that defines motion not in relation to individual objects, such as the two twins with respect to each other, but in relation to distant stars," said Kak. Using probabilistic relationships, Kak's solution assumes that the universe has the same general properties no matter where one might be within it.
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Old 15-02-2007, 10:47 PM
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Well I put forward an approach that I thought made it impossible for the time dialation thing to occur that it was a myth.

http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...?t=9990&page=3
If you have a spare couple of days get your mind addressing this .
I gave up on it but I recon there is enough there to make the point I was trying to make.
alex
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Old 15-02-2007, 10:55 PM
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Originally Posted by xelasnave View Post
Well I put forward an approach that I thought made it impossible for the time dialation thing to occur that it was a myth.

http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...?t=9990&page=3
If you have a spare couple of days get your mind addressing this .
I gave up on it but I recon there is enough there to make the point I was trying to make.
alex
Have to go now, but will read through the 63 messages on that link tomorrow. Without knowing the content, let me say this, that theoretical physics lives hand in hand with mathematics, therefore if you are having some difficulty understanding certain theory, try thinking like a blackboard - not a human.

Put a little less crudely, when trying to understand non-human theory, its better to check your humanity at the door on the way in and start thinking purely in mathematical terms. Btw, I am a mediocre mathematician but I do understand it has something to do with numbers
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Old 15-02-2007, 11:07 PM
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If ever you will reach for the saying .."tomorow never comes" this will be that time
and I tried using the numbers but not the established theory.
Good night
alex
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Old 16-02-2007, 12:46 AM
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the twin paradox is resolved in general relativity and is no "100 y.o puzzle". the article is bollocks. Essentially the key to the resolution of the paradox is realising that the twins are not equivalent. One twin experiences the G-forces of acceleration to and from near the speed of light, deceleration on turning around after reaching distant destination, the other twin experiences no such forces.
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Old 16-02-2007, 10:29 AM
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Very interesting article Tailwag.
I'll have to read it several more times though to fully grasp.
These sort of articles I find fascinating once it sinks in and I get a grasp of it.

Cheers
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  #16  
Old 16-02-2007, 11:28 AM
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For more info on resolution of the twin paradox, in 1918 by Einstein, see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twin_pa...ral_relativity
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  #17  
Old 16-02-2007, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by janoskiss View Post
the twin paradox is resolved in general relativity and is no "100 y.o puzzle". the article is bollocks.
Perhaps this article will help explain it, there is no math, just all words the paradox is the way the Twins paradox is described, there is no paradox per se, as janoskiss correctly states. The term paradox means, "A statement that contradicts itself; "`I always lie' is a paradox because if it is true it must be false".

I borrowed the following explanation from: http://mentock.home.mindspring.com/twins.htm I hope they don't mind

The Twin Paradox of Einstein is an interesting thought experiment involving two twins (who are nearly exactly the same age), one of whom sets out on a journey into space and back. Because of the time dilation effect of relativity, the twin who left experiences a slowing down of time and will actually be much younger than the twin that stayed behind. The reason that this is considered a paradox is that Special Relativity seems to imply that either one can be considered at rest, with the other moving. It does, and it doesn't.

The confusion arises not because there are two equally valid inertial rest frames, but (here's the tricky part) because there are three. A lot of explanations of the twin paradox have claimed that it is necessary to include a treatment of accelerations, or involve General Relativity. Not so.
The three inertial frames are 1) at-home twin 2) the going-away twin and 3) the coming-back twin. It doesn't make any difference that the last two are physically the same twin--they still define different inertial frames.

OK, let's see: Ann stays at home and Bob rockets away at 3/5 light speed. Time dilation is 80%. Bob lets 4 years pass. Bob returns at 3/5 light speed, again taking 4 years. Ann thinks 10 years have passed, and Ann and Bob agree that Bob is two years younger.

Important question: what is the relative speed of the two Bob frames? On first glance, it would appear that one is going 3/5c in one direction and 3/5c in the other direction, so that the difference between the two frames is 6/5c! Faster than light? No, special relativity does not add speeds this way. The actual difference is only 15/17c, fast but not faster than light. Why is this important? We'll see.

Now, since special relativity lets us use either rest frame, we assume Bob is the at-home twin. Ann speeds away at 3/5c. No problem so far. But after 4 years of waiting, Bob must change his inertial frame. If we allow Ann to return, we've only restated the problem with the names switched. In the first version, Ann stayed in an inertial frame, and she must stay in an inertial frame in this version. Bob zooms off after Ann at 15/17 light speed (now we know why it was important), and of course catches up. It takes him 4 years, and he has seen 8 years since Ann left. Ann has aged 10 years. Same result. No paradox.
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