Real Change or Fake Change - EV business case

[Sunfish (Ray)]

I think that one reason EV have a tax break in European cities is that many of the cities have been allowed to grow so large and resource hungry that without EVs the pollution will suffocate a city like London or Paris.

You can find out the atmospheric pollution level on a German city street corner on their city website and they apply science to analyse their environment openly and act, unlike our secretive state of denial.

Every day millions of commercial vehicles decend on the cities before day break to make deliveries. Without them there would be no fresh produce. Very simple to offer a tax incentive to cut pollution and regulate commercial vehicles. In our hot cities this is a bigger growing warming problem, only deflected by a moderated coastal location.

Charging and PV future is all up in the air today as our regulator tells us our electricity distribution network requires wholesale renewal.

[JA]

Originally Posted by Sunfish

...

You can find out the atmospheric pollution level on a German city street corner on their city website and they apply science to analyse their environment openly and act, unlike our secretive state of denial.

...

Hi Ray,

I'm not sure what data there is near you in NSW, but in Victoria, the EPA monitors, logs and reports pollution data on their website for Melbourne and surrounds.

Best
JA

EDIT: Added for NSW....
https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/aqms/hourlydata.htm

[LewisM]

Nick, let’s keep it real re aircraft too. Small personal aircraft, yes already available EV, but mass transportation at near supersonic speed will NEVER be the domain of EV, at least until cold fusion comes along.

Unless of course we go back to 1930’s London to Sydney in a week in Shorts flying boat speed/style...

[glend (Glen)]

Originally Posted by LewisM

Nick, let’s keep it real re aircraft too. Small personal aircraft, yes already available EV, but mass transportation at near supersonic speed will NEVER be the domain of EV, at least until cold fusion comes along.

Unless of course we go back to 1930’s London to Sydney in a week in Shorts flying boat speed/style...

I wonder how much CO2 Elon's Starship will generate on its supposed 40min suborbital flights from Sydney to London? Burning Methane and O2. How will he offset that?

[LewisM]

Originally Posted by Peter Ward

Yes, I flew planes for a living.

I already have an electric plane. It’s made by Ryobi.

[AstralTraveller (David)]

Originally Posted by LewisM http://www.iceinspace.com.au/vbiis/i...s/viewpost.gif
I already have an electric plane. It’s made by Ryobi..


Smooth as ....

[Sunfish (Ray)]

NSW shows general city information only and has four monitoring stations in the Illawarra area, probably the size of some small European countries. Stuttgart say, has an integrated system of science research which not only constantly , street by street , report pollution and temperature indices, but publishes research on Urban heat , air movement and microclimate particular to the city and development which informs all planning decisions.

In Sydney it seems that one very promising paper was funded by Council but not completed. Development decisions seem to be governed by the biggest casino operator or the quickest method for piling up residents in sub standard buildings. I do envy the victorians altogether more progressive approach to planning and local government , although the vast new apartment blocks with blind walls on the street do seem to be spreading.

Originally Posted by JA

Hi Ray,

I'm not sure what data there is near you in NSW, but in Victoria, the EPA monitors, logs and reports pollution data on their website for Melbourne and surrounds.

Best
JA

EDIT: Added for NSW....
https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/aqms/hourlydata.htm

[peter_4059 (Peter)]

Summarising key takeaways so far:
1. Some people buy EVs because they are fast and others choose their new vehicle based on factors such as purchase price, practicality, size.
2. ROI is a factor when purchasing solar panels and Tesla batteries.
3. Some countries have managed to phase out coal power and some of these have turned to Hydro and Nuclear.
4. Long haul passenger planes use a lot of power to get off the ground. interested to hear how many kW that takes from anyone in the know? Batteries might be possible in the right size plane - how about a 300 seater?
5. People say they had no choice however the reality is they do - the alternative might mean they are worse off though - still a choice.
6. Any change to the status quo is at a price and someone has to foot the bill.

Any others?

ps. missed a couple:

There is an excellent bottle of Scotch available if anyone is interested in betting on:
1. 99.99% of BITRE analysts have never dropped a gearbox and changed a clutch.
or
2. In 5 years time the BITRE forecasts are flawed and proven wrong. (the ROI is a bit long on this one).

[Astronovice (Calvin)]

A single Rolls Royce Trent 800 can develop up to 62,000Kw

[multiweb (Marc)]

Here's a pretty cool video about energy consumption and cost. Subtitled but interesting to see the bigger picture by the numbers and what could make an impact or not. Sometimes you can't help thinking you're padding up stream even with the best of intentions.

Click here to load the video

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[glend (Glen)]

Originally Posted by multiweb

Here's a pretty cool video about energy consumption and cost. Subtitled but interesting to see the bigger picture by the numbers and what could make an impact or not. Sometimes you can't help thinking you're padding up stream even with the best of intentions.

In the case of the individual Pacific Salmon, they are literally paddling upstream, against the flow, to insure the survival of their species. As individuals we have little impact, on either the debate or the solution, but as a species we are powerful and can change the future.

[N1 (Mirko)]

Hi Peter,

Yes, 6.a The cost of maintaining the status quo will increase massively, and someone has to foot the bill.

Originally Posted by peter_4059

Summarising key takeaways so far:
1. Some people buy EVs because they are fast and others choose their new vehicle based on factors such as purchase price, practicality, size.
2. ROI is a factor when purchasing solar panels and Tesla batteries.
3. Some countries have managed to phase out coal power and some of these have turned to Hydro and Nuclear.
4. Long haul passenger planes use a lot of power to get off the ground. interested to hear how many kW that takes from anyone in the know? Batteries might be possible in the right size plane - how about a 300 seater?
5. People say they had no choice however the reality is they do - the alternative might mean they are worse off though - still a choice.
6. Any change to the status quo is at a price and someone has to foot the bill.

Any others?

ps. missed a couple:

There is an excellent bottle of Scotch available if anyone is interested in betting on:
1. 99.99% of BITRE analysts have never dropped a gearbox and changed a clutch.
or
2. In 5 years time the BITRE forecasts are flawed and proven wrong. (the ROI is a bit long on this one).

[peter_4059 (Peter)]

Here's a neat website that summarises energy consumption by country and by product. Not sure if the coal figures are total or thermal however it shows why it is so difficult to reduce global CO2 emissions.

https://www.indexmundi.com/energy/?p...n&display=rank

[xelasnave]

I expect another problem getting rid of coal and replace many of the bi products from a source other than coal. Must look up biproducts of coal ...
Alex

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...ce=sh%2Fx%2Fim

Certainly seems too precious to waste making steam...
Alex

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by glend

As individuals we have little impact, on either the debate or the solution, but as a species we are powerful and can change the future.

I agree 100%. That's what got us into this mess in the first place.