I'm hoping someone can give me a pointer about a network problem I'm having.
I have a home network that includes a hard-wired Win10 PC, a hard-wired XP PC, and a wifi Win 10 laptop. Also connected are a hard-wired network printer and a NAS, both of which are connected directly to the same 4-port hub as the two hard-wired computers.
Up til a fortnight ago, all the PCs could see each other as well as print and backup to the NAS.
Now a fault seems to have developed whereby all the PCs can still print to the network printer and see the NAS, but no PC can see any other PC regardless of whether they're wired or wireless and regardless of OS.
Each PC only sees certain network components and not others. It's a major mystery to me as it seems to have stopped working virtually overnight
All affected computers are fine individually and as far as I know we haven't changed anything.
I've tried having Windows Firewall off and on to no avail, but I don't know what to do next.
Try power cycling your ADSL router and any Ethernet switches you have.
Sometimes if a DHCP server in a router comes off the rails it might
be issuing the same IP addresses to more than one device resulting in
a conflict. This can then manifest itself in the PC's not being able to
see each other.
Sometimes you might need to go even further and shut everything.
Bring up the router first, then the switches and then each PC.
Try power cycling your ADSL router and any Ethernet switches you have.
Sometimes if a DHCP server in a router comes off the rails it might
be issuing the same IP addresses to more than one device resulting in
a conflict. This can then manifest itself in the PC's not being able to
see each other.
Sometimes you might need to go even further and shut everything.
Bring up the router first, then the switches and then each PC.
Hi Gary,
Thanks very much for that suggestion.
I did already power all of it off, including the NBN router and the PCs though not in the regimented order you suggest.
I had some success, namely that each Win10 device can see the other Win10 device.
But neither of them can see my XP PC, nor can it see either of the Win10 machines.
I'll do as you suggest though. I have had the duplicate IP addresses many times before, but I don't think that's the case this time.
Also, I can ping successfully between offending machines.
Ok, let me try your suggestion and see how it goes. Thanks so much for taking the time to reply
I gather you checked that on the Win 10 machines Settings->Ethernet->
Change advanced sharing options->Turn on network discovery is still
checked as is "Turn on file and printer sharing"?
I gather you checked that on the Win 10 machines Settings->Ethernet->
Change advanced sharing options->Turn on network discovery is still
checked as is "Turn on file and printer sharing"?
Are they all in the same WORKGROUP?
Hi Gary,
Yes, I checked those things and they're all set correctly, thanks.
The machine which boots up first becomes the master browser in Windows' NetBIOS protocol, i.e. the protocol responsible for discovery.
Since your issue happened over night without any human trigger, a power outage combined with an IP-address conflict of the then current master Browser might have been the cause.
Could you try this, please?
1. Shut down everything - modem, router, NAS, printer and computers.
2. start modem, then router.
3. start WinXP machine and wait until it's fully started and you can for example open a web page successfully. Now the WinXP machine should be the master browser of your workgroup.
4. start a WIn10 machine and wait till it's fully started and you can open a web page.
5. wait for another 15 minutes or so. it takes a while to propagate NetBIOS information.
6. check the discovery in the network. If you sneaked a glance before waiting a while make sure you refresh the explorer window.
7. if this did not show the WinXp and the Win10 in each other's network view,
shutdown the Win10 and afterwards the WInXP computer.
8. start one Win10 computer, wait till it's fully booted up etc.
9. start WinXP, wait a while and check the network view.
I should think one of these boot sequences will have had success.
Afterwards you can boot the printer and the NAS and the second Win10 machine
If not: check for the following updates on the WIn10 computers:
Update KB3140743 and KB3139907 released on March 1st 2016 - fixing a discovery problem in wired Win10 computers.
If you had IP address conflicts before, make sure these don't happen anymore by extending the DHCP range in your router.
Have you tried linking them via homegroup? Try to get the xp machine to join...it may help.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCH
Hi Dom,
thanks for taking the time to respond.
The thing is, before you can even try to join a group regardless of what version of windows etc, you have to be able to see the PCs on the network.
And therein lies the problem for me - the Win10 and the XP are invisible to each other!
Hi Paul,
It is important to appreciate that the protocols underpinning
Workgroups is different to Homegroups.
Since Homegroups were only introduced at Windows 7, I suggest you
use Workgroups rather than Homegroups.
You need to have the same Workgroup name on all machines.
You can do that by simply sitting in front of each computer.
They do not need to be visible to each other yet.
In Windows XP the default Workgroup name was MSHOME.
In later versions of Windows, it was WORKGROUP.
To check the XP machine, right-click on My Computer and click
on Properties. When the dialog appears, select Computer Name and
change the Workgroup name to, say, WORKGROUP.
On the Win 10 machines, right-click the Start button, Control Panel,
System and Security, System, Advanced system settings, Computer Name
tab, "To rename this computer or change its domain or workgroup, click Change"
select "Member of Workgroup", change name to WORKGROUP.
Ok, I think I'm getting somewhere though not solved yet.
On the XP machine if I go to Control Panel > Network Connections, the LAN icon at the top of the screen is showing as 'firewalled'.
I went to the C: drive in Windows Explorer and removed file sharing, then re-added it to try and re-establish the connections.
Then I re-booted the PC and went back into Control Panel > Netowrk Connections. To my delight the LAN now showed as connected. Perfect.
But after just a few seconds, the dreaded 'firewalled' showed up.
So now I'm reasonably sure that the connection problems emanate from the XP machine. That said, I'm still unsure as to how exactly I can free up the LAN from the grip of the firewall.
The fw is just the regular Windows FW which has worked fine since Adam was a lad.
And in Windows Explorer under C > Properties > Sharing, it says the fw is configured to allow this folder to be shared with other users on the network.
But I know it's lying, lol.
Edit: whoops, false alarm. I disabled the fw and observed that the LAN status of 'firewalled' disappeared, but still can't see the LAN across the network.
Go into Local Area Connection applet "Properties" > "Internet Protocol Version 4 (TCP/IP) > "Properties" > "Advanced" > "WINS" and set the radio button to what is "NetBIOS over LAN" as shown in the attached image.
Have found that this setting (though deemed to be "insecure" but you're in the home environment and your router firewall should be adequate) has resolved many times for me the very phenomenon you are experiencing.
Of course ensure that all PCs are on the same workgroup plus the network location is either "Home" or "Private" and NOT "Public"
Go into Local Area Connection applet "Properties" > "Internet Protocol Version 4 (TCP/IP) > "Properties" > "Advanced" > "WINS" and set the radio button to what is "NetBIOS over LAN" as shown in the attached image.
Have found that this setting (though deemed to be "insecure" but you're in the home environment and your router firewall should be adequate) has resolved many times for me the very phenomenon you are experiencing.
Of course ensure that all PCs are on the same workgroup plus the network location is either "Home" or "Private" and NOT "Public"
Bill
Hi Bill,
thank you for taking the time to reply.
I believe I have it working now thank you.
Whether I had the Windows FW enabled or not, clicking on my networks in Windows Explorer always produced the same error - namely, lack of permissions to access this folder.
In the end (should have tried this MUCH earlier!) I used the network wizard on the XP machine to create a new workgroup name and then changed the active workgroup on the other PCs to the same workgroup name.
Hey presto, it all bounced into life. The XP machine could see the Win10's and vice versa.
To my surprise it kept working when I turned the Windows FW back on too!
So all in all a time consuming fix, but the various help mechanisms provided by users in this thread have been noted for future reference.
My grateful thanks to all who offered their helpful thoughts.
