Electronic Cigarettes

[Renato1 (Renato)]

For the poor long suffering smokers out there - and there are certainly a few at my club - having a carton a week habit now costs around $8000 a year to maintain. That's a nice big Takahashi up in smoke every year.

But depending on which State one lives in, one can replace the filthy habit with nicotine electronic cigarettes, which give the same amount of nicotine and puffs for a total cost of around $60 a year.

One can't sell nicotine liquid for the electronic cigarettes anywhere in Australia, but the Federal Government allows one to import a reasonable amount for personal use (i.e. about 3 months supply).

The actual electronic cigarettes can be bought legally in all States except WA, where a recent court decision banned them.

In Victoria, use/ownership of nicotine e-liquid is banned out right, but there is no problem using e-cigarettes with Zero milligram e-liquid , which is available in lots of shops.

Anyhow, electronic nicotine cigarettes are legal in lots of places around the world - UK, USA, Italy etc - and are having a huge impact on people switching from regular cigarettes, despite their prices not being anywhere as high as here.

But astronomy wise, the main advantage of electronic cigarettes is that they don't affect your night vision, like when you light up a normal cigarette. Nor does the second hand smoke drift across someone else's pristine optics at a club viewing night.

Health wise, if one watches the Euronews article on Youtube about them, you'll see that the health risks associated with electronic cigarettes are akin to those of pesticides in vegetables and too much salt in food i.e. orders of magnitude less than for the smoking real cigarettes.
Regards,
Renato

[xelasnave]

What if you smoke a pipe.
Very informative post thanks.

[GrahamL]

Both can still put you in A&E :/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/ar...e-grenade.html

[RAJAH235]

I tried one a few years ago but ended up with severe headaches.

Went back to my pipe.

A total waste of over $120.00 because of their "no refund after use" policy.

No thanks.


All I salvaged were the aluminium cylinders & single cell Li-Pos.
I junked the rest.

[Renato1 (Renato)]

Originally Posted by xelasnave

What if you smoke a pipe.
Very informative post thanks.

They sell electronic pipes - but they cost three or four times the price of a base grade e-cigarette. Cost of e-liquid is obviously the same.
Regards,
Renato

[Renato1 (Renato)]

Originally Posted by GrahamL

Both can still put you in A&E :/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/ar...e-grenade.html

Rechargeable Lithium batteries blowing up from dodgy chargers isn't confined to e-cigarettes. A chap involved with firefighting was telling me some people got killed or severely injured by their laptops due to dodgy chargers.
Regards,
Renato

[Renato1 (Renato)]

Originally Posted by RAJAH235

I tried one a few years ago but ended up with severe headaches.

Went back to my pipe.

A total waste of over $120.00 because of their "no refund after use" policy.

No thanks.


All I salvaged were the aluminium cylinders & single cell Li-Pos.
I junked the rest.

Cheap and good e-cigarettes are $28 from tobacconists in Australia, and around $8 from China for the same thing.

The big problem is knowing what sort of nicotine level suits you, else your head may well spin or hurt.
That used to be easy because for health reasons the Government made tobacco companies put it on their packets.
But then, possibly because people were using the information to make it easier to switch to cheaper brands, the government forced that information off the packets.

I once spent a very frustrating time trying to Google the nicotine content of local brands.
Regards,
Renato

[chiaroscuro (Luke)]

While the vapour from e-cigarettes is certainly less toxic than tobacco smoke, there's still a few problems with them. Firstly, the public health perspective is that it would "re-normalise" smoking, which has slowly become more and more socially unacceptable in most situations, leading people to want to quit.

And secondly, nicotine is still bad for you - its the ingredient that damages blood vessels including the tiny retinal blood vessels in our eyes, that we rely on for astronomy.
So my advice as a former smoker who had a lot of trouble giving up - if you're going to use the e-cigarettes to help you quit the nicotine habit - then all the best, but if you're going to use them long term, they'll still cause coronary artery disease, eye disease, kidney disease etc, so just use them as a tool to quit the nicotine habit altogether. Good luck.

[Renato1 (Renato)]

Originally Posted by chiaroscuro

While the vapour from e-cigarettes is certainly less toxic than tobacco smoke, there's still a few problems with them. Firstly, the public health perspective is that it would "re-normalise" smoking, which has slowly become more and more socially unacceptable in most situations, leading people to want to quit.

And secondly, nicotine is still bad for you - its the ingredient that damages blood vessels including the tiny retinal blood vessels in our eyes, that we rely on for astronomy.
So my advice as a former smoker who had a lot of trouble giving up - if you're going to use the e-cigarettes to help you quit the nicotine habit - then all the best, but if you're going to use them long term, they'll still cause coronary artery disease, eye disease, kidney disease etc, so just use them as a tool to quit the nicotine habit altogether. Good luck.

That's not the proposition that 100 French Doctors put their names too, when saying that e-cigarettes shouldn't be regulated. They plainly wouldn't have done so if the health effects had been as bad as you suggest.

Certainly though, one should Google the subject and see what comes up.
Regards,
Renato

[Bassnut (Fred)]

Originally Posted by chiaroscuro

And secondly, nicotine is still bad for you .

OK, so what about ecigarettes with no nicotine.

[Solitarian]

Originally Posted by Renato1

That's not the proposition that 100 French Doctors put their names too, when saying that e-cigarettes shouldn't be regulated. They plainly wouldn't have done so if the health effects had been as bad as you suggest.
Renato

French breast implants by PIP are just as safe too, they told us so.


Maybe the french are making electronic lungs to go with the electronic gaspers

EDIT: that was insensitive of me, so many people wrongfully suffered due to those implants , I apologize for making light of their situation, that wasn't my intention

[chiaroscuro (Luke)]

Originally Posted by Renato1

That's not the proposition that 100 French Doctors put their names too, when saying that e-cigarettes shouldn't be regulated. They plainly wouldn't have done so if the health effects had been as bad as you suggest.

Certainly though, one should Google the subject and see what comes up.
Regards,
Renato

I don't know about these 100 French Doctors, but here is what the Cleveland Clinic says:
http://health.clevelandclinic.org/20...ll-be-at-risk/

And another medical paper:
https://www.sciencenews.org/article/...arettes-emerge

All I'm saying is that there is emerging evidence that e-cigarettes are not safe. Its early days - it took decades before the evidence for tobacco harm emerged, and it would be either naive or foolish to dismiss the evidence so far.

As for e-cigarettes without nicotine, read the second paper which discusses the problems with inhaling a heated vapour. Lungs do not like having small organic molecules inhaled into them.

It took me 3 attempts to give up smoking. Its a wickedly difficult habit to break, and I know that one of the rationalisations used is to tell yourself what your doing is not likely to cause you a problem. But in the end, why risk your health and life for the chance to inhale small organic molecules that damage every organ in your body? That the question I kept asking myself to motivate me to quit.

[Renato1 (Renato)]

Originally Posted by chiaroscuro

I don't know about these 100 French Doctors, but here is what the Cleveland Clinic says:
http://health.clevelandclinic.org/20...ll-be-at-risk/

And another medical paper:
https://www.sciencenews.org/article/...arettes-emerge

All I'm saying is that there is emerging evidence that e-cigarettes are not safe. Its early days - it took decades before the evidence for tobacco harm emerged, and it would be either naive or foolish to dismiss the evidence so far.

As for e-cigarettes without nicotine, read the second paper which discusses the problems with inhaling a heated vapour. Lungs do not like having small organic molecules inhaled into them.

It took me 3 attempts to give up smoking. Its a wickedly difficult habit to break, and I know that one of the rationalisations used is to tell yourself what your doing is not likely to cause you a problem. But in the end, why risk your health and life for the chance to inhale small organic molecules that damage every organ in your body? That the question I kept asking myself to motivate me to quit.

The first article seems to have a lot of maybes in it. The second article seems to be more worried about the higher powered variable voltage e- cigarettes. Might be wise to keep the voltage on low. Thanks for the information.

Anyhow, I found the Euronews article from 9 months ago.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKQ0RCsilPo

Take your pick of what to worry about.
Cheers,
Renato

[Renato1 (Renato)]

Originally Posted by Solitarian

French breast implants by PIP are just as safe too, they told us so.


Maybe the french are making electronic lungs to go with the electronic gaspers

EDIT: that was insensitive of me, so many people wrongfully suffered due to those implants , I apologize for making light of their situation, that wasn't my intention

Yes, there were some botch ups with breast implants.
But the silicone breast implant hysteria was pretty much akin to the RSI hysteria - human psychology put to bad use by lawyers, which made their clients miserable and fearful, and themselves rich.
Regards,
Renato

[Solitarian]

Originally Posted by Renato1

Yes, there were some botch ups with breast implants.
But the silicone breast implant hysteria was pretty much akin to the RSI hysteria - human psychology put to bad use by lawyers, which made their clients miserable and fearful, and themselves rich.
Regards,
Renato

Seriously???????

You've been smoking something a lot worse than e-cigarettes

[Renato1 (Renato)]

Originally Posted by Solitarian

Seriously???????

You've been smoking something a lot worse than e-cigarettes

When in doubt, read the Wikipedia article.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breast_implant

Good luck finding the medical horror that you are implying.
Particularly read the "Criticism" part down the bottom.

Regards,
Renato

[kinetic (Steve)]

Dude,

you don't mind if I call you dude?

As thoughtful, balanced advice doesn't seem to be your thing, how about this health resort:
http://www.theatlantic.com/national/...e-west/274056/
Seems legit.
Maybe your whole approach is wrong. Go figure.....

Originally Posted by Renato1

The first article seems to have a lot of maybes in it. The second article seems to be more worried about the higher powered variable voltage e- cigarettes. Might be wise to keep the voltage on low. Thanks for the information.

Anyhow, I found the Euronews article from 9 months ago.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKQ0RCsilPo

Take your pick of what to worry about.
Cheers,
Renato

Originally Posted by Renato1

Yes, there were some botch ups with breast implants.
But the silicone breast implant hysteria was pretty much akin to the RSI hysteria - human psychology put to bad use by lawyers, which made their clients miserable and fearful, and themselves rich.
Regards,
Renato

[DJT (David)]

hmm..I quit smoking 3 years ago after one of those bizarre lightbulb moments whilst in a traffic jam. Listening to the radio, I suddenly found that the idea of arguing the toss with the poor gal at Coles about wanting the "drab olive green packaged B&H, next to the equally drab JPS specials also in olive green..no, no no, the drab olive green ones in the row above...blah blah blah" really didn't appeal.

This weekend I tipped the $19800 mark re money not spent on fags but on astro crap instead and am planning the $20K party. ( and as a side note its also a mere 8 years 31 weeks till the AP 130GT fast bugger arrives..)

This was after 30 years of trying to quit. Go figure.

Sadly I am still in the hole by $8k and that does not include the obsy build costs but I get away with that because there is a spot for the loved ones garden trowel.

However..the point is that eCigs had just arrived at that time but in my jaundiced wall eyed view, they are just replacing one form of addiction with another..the need to have an eCig. The health issues are also a concern. Would love to know which industry sponsors are pushing eCigs..

[Renato1 (Renato)]

Originally Posted by kinetic

Dude,

you don't mind if I call you dude?

As thoughtful, balanced advice doesn't seem to be your thing, how about this health resort:
http://www.theatlantic.com/national/...e-west/274056/
Seems legit.
Maybe your whole approach is wrong. Go figure.....

Well, actually I do mind.

What exactly that article you've linked to has to do with anything under discussion here, appears to lie in some tortuous link buried in the back of your brain.

Feel free to try bring it out in the open, when you become cognizant of what it is.
Regards,
Renato

[kinetic (Steve)]

Originally Posted by Renato1

Well, actually I do mind.

What exactly that article you've linked to has to do with anything under discussion here, appears to lie in some tortuous link buried in the back of your brain.

Feel free to try bring it out in the open, when you become cognizant of what it is.
Regards,
Renato

Facepalm