Arg-o-nut?

[rider]

Can anyone tell me about Argo Navis.

It sounds like it might suit my purposes, but the web site is less than forth coming about details of operation.

Here is what we have and what I am after:

Wife and I have 2 scopes, an 8 inch Kat, and a smaller Newtonian, both on motor driven polar mounts.

We would like to share an attachment that nominates the star / system that we have the telescope pointed at.
This is for conformational purposes, - Brisvegas has skies that are so light-drenched that it is sometimes very hard to use “dead reckoning” style navigation, and we are often not sure what we have found, especially if Stellarium is showing several formations in the same area.
(I don’t want Go-to navigation control, as I think they tend to minimise the learning process for newbies.)

So: does A-N provide what I think it does, and can it easily be swapped from scope to scope, or are there bits that aren’t shown in the web site: (photo shows unit plus mounting cage)

Secondly, does it have USB connections for upgrades, as my laptop doesn’t have the antique connection systems used by some skybound devices?

Any help appreciated.
Regards Rider.

[GazzMeister]

Although I don't know anything about argo-navis, I've never heard a bad word about it. I've had success playing around with my skyscout piggybacked on the back of my ED100. Of course with the ED100 on the (goto) eq6 it was just to see if it worked and I was surprised how well it identified objects (if it's a dim object next to a bright object there's a list of things, based on magnitude, that appear in the skyscout's field of view). There's also the Meade thing (can't think of the name ATM) which is pretty much the same deal as the skyscout. These are cheaper options, but argo-navis is reportedly one cool piece of kit that will do alot more than these two point and shoot gadgets.

[wavelandscott (Scott)]

Originally Posted by rider

Can anyone tell me about Argo Navis.

It sounds like it might suit my purposes, but the web site is less than forth coming about details of operation.

Here is what we have and what I am after:

Wife and I have 2 scopes, an 8 inch Kat, and a smaller Newtonian, both on motor driven polar mounts.

We would like to share an attachment that nominates the star / system that we have the telescope pointed at.
This is for conformational purposes, - Brisvegas has skies that are so light-drenched that it is sometimes very hard to use “dead reckoning” style navigation, and we are often not sure what we have found, especially if Stellarium is showing several formations in the same area.
(I don’t want Go-to navigation control, as I think they tend to minimise the learning process for newbies.)

So: does A-N provide what I think it does, and can it easily be swapped from scope to scope, or are there bits that aren’t shown in the web site: (photo shows unit plus mounting cage)

Secondly, does it have USB connections for upgrades, as my laptop doesn’t have the antique connection systems used by some skybound devices?

Any help appreciated.
Regards Rider.

I don't know the answer to your question...

I would encourage you to write via e-mail to Wild Card Innovation directly. I have found Gary to be very responsive to this style of communication...alternatively you could call them.

[programmer]

Originally Posted by rider

Can anyone tell me about Argo Navis.

It sounds like it might suit my purposes, but the web site is less than forth coming about details of operation.

Here is what we have and what I am after:

Wife and I have 2 scopes, an 8 inch Kat, and a smaller Newtonian, both on motor driven polar mounts.

We would like to share an attachment that nominates the star / system that we have the telescope pointed at.
This is for conformational purposes, - Brisvegas has skies that are so light-drenched that it is sometimes very hard to use “dead reckoning” style navigation, and we are often not sure what we have found, especially if Stellarium is showing several formations in the same area.
(I don’t want Go-to navigation control, as I think they tend to minimise the learning process for newbies.)

So: does A-N provide what I think it does, and can it easily be swapped from scope to scope, or are there bits that aren’t shown in the web site: (photo shows unit plus mounting cage)

Secondly, does it have USB connections for upgrades, as my laptop doesn’t have the antique connection systems used by some skybound devices?

Any help appreciated.
Regards Rider.

I have an Argo Navis on my Dobsonian. You would ideally want 2 sets of encoders, one mounted on each telescope, then you could theoretically share a hand unit (the purple box on their home page). I'm sure Gary from Wildcard Innovations will be along shortly to answer in more detail

As far as information goes, the entire manual is online if you delve into the menu a little.

It does not use USB.. you need a USB/serial adapter.

HTH

[DJVege]

Hi rider,

yes, the Argo will do what you want. The actual DTC unit connects to a special set of encoders. So, in your case, you would buy a set of encoders for each of your mounts, and one DTC to share, as programmer has said.

Note: Seeing as you'll want to go back and forth using the argo on 2 mounts, you'll need to align each scope in the argo each time you swap over. If I'm wrong, Gary from Wildcard will let you know.

Knowing him, he'll reply here shortly, but I can also assure you you will get quality customer service if you email wild card directly.

[Jeff]

As per the other comments below, the "IDENTIFY" mode of the Argo Navis does exactly as you want, but will require an alignment (less 2 minutes) every time you want to swap scopes.

See page 61 in the manual for details on MODE IDENTIFY ... covers auto idenfication of Stars, Clusters, Nebulas, Galaxies, Planets, Asteroids etc.

Hope this helps.

[rider]

Thanks for the replys, everyone.

The Navis sounds like its “too many bits to add” to me. It obviously does a good job, but I’m after something I can can just clip onto the scopes as a single unit.

The Celestron Skyscout has only 3 potential problems, or I would go that way.
the problems are:
1/ it’s got a much smaller data base than the A.N.
2/ it’s got an really annoying American know-it-all computerised voiced system,
3/ it’s built for the American market, so probably most of the database is Northern hemisphere.
(after-all, the world ends at Florida keys)

what do Skyscout users think of them?

rider

[gary]

Hi Rider,

Gary Kopff here from Wildcard Innovations in Sydney, designers and
manufacturers of the Argo Navis Digital Telescope Computer.

Thanks for the post and for considering an Argo Navis.

I highly recommend you either give us a telephone call on 02 9457 9049 or
drop an email to us at sales@wildcard-innovations.com.au for obligation free
advice.

We have considerable expertise in telescope pointing systems and can explain
in full what is required.

You are not alone in living in a light polluted environment where identifying objects
is then made all the more challenging. In fact, you are among the majority of our
customers worldwide.

Apart from the Argo Navis, you require a pair of devices known as optical encoders
which are installed on each of the two axes of the mount. We can supply the encoders
along with installation kits for a large variety of commercial mounts. Just let
us know your mount type. Installing the encoders is a one-time process that on
most commercial mounts takes typically less than 30 minutes and does not
require any special tools or skills.

The optical encoders are electromechanical devices that emit electrical pulses
as they rotate. Typical installations use optical encoders that provide 10,000 pulses
per 360 degree resolution of the associated axis of the scope. That corresponds
to an approximate resolution of 2.1 arc minutes a step, where an arc minute
is one-sixtieth of one degree - a tiny angle.

Argo Navis has menus that allows it to operate in various ways. For example, you
can dial up an object by name and Argo Navis will display guiding information
that will allow you to zero-in on it. Conversely, you can point to an object and
Argo Navis will assist you in identifying it. As part of the identification process,
you can add filtering criteria, such as limiting the magnitude, class of object,
constellation or limit the search to a particular segment of the sky. Argo Navis
also has a powerful Tour feature, where it will field requests such as "Take me
on a tour of all galaxies in Fornax of magnitude 13 or brighter", or "Take me on
a tour of all Messier objects within 30 degrees of here", etc. etc. These features
are all accessible within seconds via a powerful user interface that can
be operated with a single thumb whilst wearing a mitten.

Though the Skyscout and similar devices provide great novelty appeal, especially
for the kids to encourage them to look at the night sky, they are not a good choice for
a telescope pointing device since their resolution is so low. The units have an
inbuilt GPS receiver but the problem with GPS is that for a stationary observer
it does not provide a compass bearing. The units are therefore fitted with a magnetic
compass and this is the primary mechanism by which they determine a bearing.
Due to the Earth's magnetic declination, which are the magnetic field lines
meandering over the surface of the Earth which shift year by year, and due to other
local magnetic disturbances, including the iron, nickel or cobalt components of
just about every telescope or mount that is made of metal, combined with the
inherent current technological limitations of electronic compassing technologies,
such devices have a resolution of approximately half a degree at best and usually
much worse up to degrees. Since the field of view of typical eyepieces on typical
amateur scopes is smaller than this, these devices make for disappointing object
location devices on telescopes.

The much higher resolution of encoders is definitely the way to go and Argo Navis
provides a host of other important features that can make the world of difference
on scopes such as yours when it comes to the locating device delivering some
stated pointing goal, in your case, reliably locating and identifying objects.

The unit can also be interfaced to your USB port on your laptop and can be
used in conjunction with every known planetarium and astroplanning
application available - including on Windows, Mac OS X and Linux.

Like many things in life, you can save a lot of money by buying the right tool for the job.

By the way, Argo Navis is designed and manufactured in Australia and is in use
around the world.

Thanks again for the post.

Best Regards

Gary Kopff
Managing Director
Wildcard Innovations Pty. Ltd.
20 Kilmory Place
Mount Kuring-Gai NSW 2080
Australia
Phone +61-2-9457-9049
Fax +61-2-9457-9593
sales@wildcard-innovations.com.au
http://www.wildcard-innovations.com.au

[gary]

Originally Posted by rider

Can anyone tell me about Argo Navis.

It sounds like it might suit my purposes, but the web site is less than forth coming about details of operation.

Hi Rider,

One other thing ...

Don't forget that the Argo Navis User's Manual is available for free download
from our web site here - http://www.wildcard-innovations.com....mentation.html

It is one of the most thorough pieces of documentation for any astronomical
product on the market today and we encourage you to browse it as Argo Navis is
packed with features.

Additionally, this page on our web site contains a list of the commercial mounts
for which we have encoder installation kits available.
See http://www.wildcard-innovations.com...._describe.html
By following the links, you can find descriptions and even installation instructions for
the kits.

As mentioned, this is is then backed up with pre and post sales support along
with participation on various forums including on the Argo Navis User's Group.
See http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/argo_navis_dtc
Now and then you can even meet us at star parties, such as the IceInSpace
Astrocamp which we have sponsored in the past by donating Argo Navis units
as lucky door prizes.

In any case, we are only a phone call or an email away and we talk to enthusiasts
such as yourself every day.

Best Regards

Gary Kopff
Managing Director
Wildcard Innovations Pty. Ltd.
20 Kilmory Place
Mount Kuring-Gai NSW 2080
Australia
Phone +61-2-9457-9049
Fax +61-2-9457-9593
sales@wildcard-innovations.com.au
http://www.wildcard-innovations.com.au

[wavelandscott (Scott)]

Originally Posted by rider

The Celestron Skyscout has only 3 potential problems, or I would go that way.
the problems are:
1/ it’s got a much smaller data base than the A.N.
2/ it’s got an really annoying American know-it-all computerised voiced system,
3/ it’s built for the American market, so probably most of the database is Northern hemisphere.
(after-all, the world ends at Florida keys)

what do Skyscout users think of them?

rider

I like my SkyScout but I am not certain that it will serve your "pointing" purpose...While it works well hand held, I do have problems with mine when it is next to metal...I get a warning when I hold it in my hand with my big metal watch. I am not certain how it will behave next to a metal scope or mount.

It is fun and accurate to use to find/identify naked eye things (stars/planets and general big name things LMC/SMC etc.)...I am not certain that the pointing accuracy at high magnification mounted next to a scope (assuming that it can be safely mounted) would be sufficient.

Don't misunderstand me, I am a big fan of the SkyScout and my two young boys have gotten lots of use from it...I have also found it helpful to identify the odd star or two (to help me better align my Argo Navis). My two cents worth..

Good Luck!