NSW state-wide speed limit 90km/h?

[Outbackmanyep]

I still think that there should be more overtaking lanes on two lane rural roads, making the speed limit more than 110km/h is not a good idea!

Reducing the limit is not the way to go either......

[glenc (Glen)]

You can select two or more of the above choices.

[mithrandir (Andrew)]

Originally Posted by Outbackmanyep

I still think that there should be more overtaking lanes on two lane rural roads, making the speed limit more than 110km/h is not a good idea!

Reducing the limit is not the way to go either......

Can we have an overtaking lane, or twenty, on the Oxley Hwy between Walcha and Pt Macquarie? Mostly the bit between Yarrowitch and Bago.

[Peter Ward]

Originally Posted by mithrandir

Fatalities per 100,000 population per annum for Western Europe appear to average out at around 6 to 7. The latest figure I can easily find for all of Australia is 8.8. If believe NSW and Vic are lower.

Lies, dammed lies and statistics. It appears not much has changed.

Stats mean little unless a direct causality can be applied.

As has been demonstrated ad nauseum outside of Australia, traveling at speed in well regulated environments can be very safe.

Driving with zero predictability or ignoring the road conditions, pi$$ed, drugged or outside the vehicle limitations has a reasonable probability of being fatal over time.

A good percentage of planet Oz drive like selfish drongos....and because of them those with a modicum of sense are still regulated by dim bubble wrapping bureaucrats and pollies...that only think *speed*...and let's be honest...defacto taxation revenue.

If you think this to be true...don't post a reply here. Write to your local State Member.

Nothing gets their attention more than a few thousand letters (I wish) saying "Maate....you have lost my vote unless...."

[theodog (Jeff)]

Just returned from Wagga Wagga, mostly up the Newell Hwy. They have droped the speed limit from 110 to 100 last month. Two weeks before the school holidays we had a speed blitz with marked, unmarked and cycle cops everywhere.
While travelling down only saw 1 cop, at a T-bone near Forbes (nobody seriously hurt). On return -none.
Seriously tailgated by many truckies though. They complain about pulling in front of them while they are stoping, this doesn't seem to apply if they decide to tailgate, , but thats another thread.
I choose to travel at the speed limit. For most it seems 100km/h really reads 110.

[glenc (Glen)]

I just looked up road crash death rates per 100,000 people.
Australia 9.3, China 19.0, Germany 8.8, NZ 13.7, Sweden 5.7, UK 5.6, USA 15.0.
http://www.who.int/violence_injury_p.../en/index.html

[Louwai (Bryan)]

Originally Posted by theodog

I choose to travel at the speed limit. For most it seems 100km/h really reads 110.

That is true Jeff, But are you sure you ARE travelling at 100klm/hr when the others are tailgating???
My car is a 2007 Honda Legend. I have had the speedometer checked & when travelling at a TRUE 100klm/hr, my speedo actually reads 110klm/hr. So if I sat on 100 as indicated by my speedo, I'd actually be doing about 91klm/hr.

All vehicle manufacturers will not guarrantee their speedo accuracy better than 10%.
So it is quite possible that when you are travelling at 100klm/hr as indicated by your speedo, you could possibly be travelling at an actual speed of say 93klm/hr.
Mind you, it could also be the other way.

99% of drivers on the road don't realise the differences in speedo accuracy. This in turn causes much frustration to those that have an accurate speedo OR those that are aware of their speedo inaccuracy & compensate for it.

[mithrandir (Andrew)]

Originally Posted by Louwai

All vehicle manufacturers will not guarrantee their speedo accuracy better than 10%.
So it is quite possible that when you are travelling at 100klm/hr as indicated by your speedo, you could possibly be travelling at an actual speed of say 93klm/hr.
Mind you, it could also be the other way.

As I've said elsewhere, the speedo in my Prado reads slow. It always has. At 100kph indicated, cruise control on, straight and level road, all three of my GPSs flicker between 102 and 103.

Obviously it wasn't calibrated for the factory standard wheel/tyre combination on the vehicle.

[Manav (Yugant)]

Remove the driver airbags and put a spike on every steering wheel facing the driver. That should fix the problem.

[Lee]

I think 110kmph should only be signed on dual carriage ways with cable/concrete barriers. I routinely drive from Newcastle to Brisbane and tend to sit on 95 most of the way, I watch everyone scream past, only to meet them again at the next town/roadworks......

[mithrandir (Andrew)]

Originally Posted by glenc

I just looked up road crash death rates per 100,000 people.
Australia 9.3, China 19.0, Germany 8.8, NZ 13.7, Sweden 5.7, UK 5.6, USA 15.0.
http://www.who.int/violence_injury_p.../en/index.html

I wouldn't like to accuse you of selective quoting.

Austria 10.1, Belgium 13.9, Denmark 9.5, Ireland 10.1, Italy 12.1, New Zealand 13.7, Portugal 12.1, which you didn't include are higher.

Canada at 9.3 is the same as Australia.

I'll give you that the rest of Western Europe are lower.

I haven't included any 3rd world countries (no matter what some stirrers migh say about NZ).

These figures do not appear to take into account kilometres travelled. It's quite hard to kill anyone other than a pedestrian when you only drive a few km each day on clogged suburban streets. My daughter-in-law is probably in more danger commuting between Picton and Canberra on a multilane divided road.

Originally Posted by Peter Ward

Lies, dammed lies and statistics. It appears not much has changed.

Stats mean little unless a direct causality can be applied.

There are samples and there are censuses. A sample can be a very accurate estimate of the complete population if it is taken the correct way. We have regular censuses which provide the baseline so that sample popupations can be selected to produce good estimates for all sorts of things.

Rates per km travelled is one problem I have with Glenn's figures, for the reasons above. Causality is another, but the WHO report does say what is included.

[theodog (Jeff)]

Originally Posted by mithrandir

As I've said elsewhere, the speedo in my Prado reads slow.

Prado driver as well. My speedo reads 5km to quick against the GPS. So I sit between 100~105.

[Louwai (Bryan)]

Originally Posted by mithrandir

As I've said elsewhere, the speedo in my Prado reads slow. It always has. At 100kph indicated, cruise control on, straight and level road, all three of my GPSs flicker between 102 and 103.

Obviously it wasn't calibrated for the factory standard wheel/tyre combination on the vehicle.

Andrew, only 2 or 3klm/hr out at 100klm/hr. Consider yourself lucky. That's pretty damn accurate & would be considered "bang on" by the manufacturers.
The norm would be 9 to 13klm/hr out @100klm/hr.

[mithrandir (Andrew)]

Originally Posted by Louwai

Andrew, only 2 or 3klm/hr out at 100klm/hr. Consider yourself lucky. That's pretty damn accurate & would be considered "bang on" by the manufacturers.
The norm would be 9 to 13klm/hr out @100klm/hr.

It's probably OK with the NSW police too.

Not with the Victorians from what I've heard.

The norm is for the speedo to read fast, not slow.

[Louwai (Bryan)]

Originally Posted by mithrandir

It's probably OK with the NSW police too.

Not with the Victorians from what I've heard.

The norm is for the speedo to read fast, not slow.

That's probably why my 2007 Honda reads 10klm/hr fast @ 100klm/hr. I bought it in Melbourne when I was living down there.

[mithrandir (Andrew)]

Originally Posted by theodog

Prado driver as well. My speedo reads 5km to quick against the GPS. So I sit between 100~105.

Which wheel package have you got Jeff? I have 265/65 on 17" alloys and run them at around 38psi on the highway.

It handles better, tyres wear better and give better fuel consumption than the Toyota suggested value.

But the pressure probably contributes to the under reporting.

[glenc (Glen)]

Andrew I picked two local countries, two large economies, and a couple of countries with low rates.
Germany was included because its rate is lower than ours despite higher speed limits. The WHO document did not give rates per 100,000 km.

You wrote "My daughter-in-law is probably in more danger commuting between Picton and Canberra on a multilane divided road."
That is not true if she is a careful driver.
The biggest killer on NSW roads is head on collisions where the vehicles are not overtaking. The risk of this is low on multilane roads.

If you take care when you cross the road there is a low risk of you being a dead pedestrian.
If you are a careful driver there is a low risk of your being involved in a single vehicle crash.
The main risk for a careful pedestrian and careful driver is a multi-vehicle crash.

In 2004 in NSW 222 people died in multi-vehicle (2 or more vehicles) crashes including 99 in head on collisions where the vehicles were not overtaking.
The next biggest multi-vehicle killer was right hand turns which killed 38 out of 222 people.
The third biggest multi-vehicle killer was rear end crashes which killed 15 out of 222 people.
Heavy vehicles were involved in 119 (54%) of those 222 deaths.
This is an example of of heavy vehicle head on. http://www.smh.com.au/national/paren...1228-lhbh.html

[mick pinner]

when looking at accidents, especially fatals, take note of the cars and vehicles involved. l work in the repair industry and note the different effects on vehicles depending on what they hit.
very few fatalities happen when two cars of similar design hit each other, it is generally when two vehicles with different designs collide, that being car/truck, small cars/4W.D's or cars designed in different eras.
two cars designed 20 years apart will have vastly different damage after they hit each other with the majority of bodily damage done to the driver/passanger of the older vehicle.
take for example the blanket rule that when travelling behind the car in front we leave x ammount of room for braking, do the powers that be tell anyone take into account what sort of car you are travelling behind?
anyone in a twenty year old vehicle is not going to stop in the same ammount of time or distance as a new car, the discrepency in vehicle design, size and performance all crammed onto the same road is what is killing people not a lazy 10 k's over the speed limit, l see it every day.

[Peter Ward]

Originally Posted by mithrandir

..... Causality is another, but the WHO report does say what is included....

My null hypothesis:

if you only allow Orangutans behind the wheel, and lower the speed limits, the road toll will rise.

Do we now infer lowering the speed limit was a dangerous move?

[mithrandir (Andrew)]

Originally Posted by glenc

This is an example of of heavy vehicle head on. http://www.smh.com.au/national/paren...1228-lhbh.html

Picking that is being sensationalist. No-one yet knows the cause of the accident. Not being a divided road quite probably killed the people in the car. It may not have saved the truckie. It could have been the road, the truck, one or more cars, but might be another reason. Paraphrasing ABC 702 talking to the mayor of one of the South Coast shires this morning:

The Princes Highway (known also as the Princes Goat Track) between Wollongong University and the Victorian border is funded entirely by the NSW government, and for some distance on the Victorian side (to Traralgon IIRC) by the Victorian government.

The cop-out Federal government does not spend a single cent on that 790 Km [my calculation] section. The NSW government cut funding for their section in 2009 by $70M [I think that was the number quoted].

There is no railway south of Bomaderry and it is uneconomic to build one. The only transport available to that 710 Km [my calculation] section is road.

There are sections not up to B-double standard (generally bridges with insufficient load limits) so drivers have to uncouple, run one trailer through, uncouple, go back and pick up the other trailer, uncouple and recouple both trailers.

It will take an estimated $1B to bring it up to highway standard.

Glen, you aren't far from a federally funded highway. The people of Bega, Eden, Sale and the surrounds aren't that lucky.

Andrew