Save The Wales

[Argonavis (William)]

Originally Posted by Ric

Ghandhi was a very wise man.

As a species co-habitating this planet there is still a great amount we have to learn about existing in harmony with nature and other species, I believe our own survival depends upon it.

right from the beginnng of our species, we have depended on eating other animals. our survival depends on it.

it also seems to be what other animals do, too. they kill and eat other animals. is this living in harmony?

[Ric]

From the beginning our species was a vegetarian one.

Yes animals do eat other animals and yes this is living in harmony because it is a natural balance of nature and biodiversity.

A lion will kill a Wildebeast and eat its fill, what is left is then eaten by scavengers such as Hyenas and Vultures after that the insects move in clean up what is left.

The main point is that animals do not overkill another species to the point of extinction or beyond.

[danielsun]

I'm sure that if we stop whaling the human race won't starve to death and be wiped out.

[Argonavis (William)]

Originally Posted by Ric

From the beginning our species was a vegetarian one.

.

I don't know where you got that one. All ape species (including hominids) are currently believed to have a common ancestor 6 to 10 million year ago. The diet of this ancestor is unknown, but all hominids have been hunters. Omnivors actually, who eat just about anything. This explains the success of our species - if you are prepared to eat anything you tend to survive and reproduce.

Most people I know are happy meat eaters. If our species or its predecesors were ever exclusively vegetarian I don't know when they all swapped over.

I was once on an observing trip with my observing buddy and we passed a cattle truck. I expressed some sympathy for the animals. He agreed, but added that they taste good, but.

[Argonavis (William)]

Originally Posted by danielsun

I'm sure that if we stop whaling the human race won't starve to death and be wiped out.

I return my point - who are you to tell people what they can and cannot eat?
Whilst no-one will starve, why should anyone be denied their traditional food? Inuit still kill and eat whales.

Anyhow, what makes whales so special, any more than any other mammal that is hunted and fished and sent to the abottair?

Traditional Japanese restraunts in Japan serve whale. It is traditional crusine, and whale meat prevented Japan from starving in the post war period, when food and protein were scarce. Many parts of the world eat dog or rat. I cannot see why anyone should be prevented from a modest catch of whale. Whilst some species of whale are on the endangered list, others are not. Dugong are endangered, but they are still hunted in this country.

[Karls48 (Karl)]

The cow is a sacred animal in India. What would you say if India send us petition with 20 million signatures asking us to stop slaughtering cattle? Up yours, most likely. What do you think the Japanese will do with all those petitions? It offends some people here that some nations eat horses, dogs or whales. It never comes to their minds that some other nationalities can be offended by what we eat.

[danielsun]

You ask what makes whales so special?
I think the reason why whales stand out is because the general consensus to the public is the concern of the threat of the species becoming extinct whereas dogs, cats, rats, horses and cows may be sacred to some but not under threat of possible extinction. After having a quick google on whales it seems that that is also the message.
Wikipedia class the fin whale as EN; high risk of extinction and the humpback and the sperm whales as VU;vulnerable considered facing high risk of extinction in the wild. the minki was classed as NT; near threatened close to qualifying as or is likely to qualify for threatened category in the near future.
Other sites said similar things but the only site which was pro whaling stating that whale numbers were sufficient was the Japanese whaling association. (funny enough).

[Dennis]

Originally Posted by Karls48

The cow is a sacred animal in India. What would you say if India send us petition with 20 million signatures asking us to stop slaughtering cattle? Up yours, most likely. What do you think the Japanese will do with all those petitions? It offends some people here that some nations eat horses, dogs or whales. It never comes to their minds that some other nationalities can be offended by what we eat.

Although you can never be sure until it happens, I suspect that a weighty, 20 million signature petition arriving on my doorstep would cause me to at least pause and reflect on the issues that provoked it?

Regards

Dennis

[Karls48 (Karl)]

Dennis, without being sarcastic in any way, I think you would be one of very few. We discussed this subject in work sometime ago. Not in context of whales but generally about the meat that people in different countries eat. And consensus was “I like my steak, chops and so on and no one will tell me what to eat”. I raised this question to two Indian gentlemen and they assured me that thought most of Indian disagrees with killing the cattle, they are too polite to tell people in other country what to eat.

[Dennis]

Originally Posted by Karls48

Dennis, without being sarcastic in any way, I think you would be one of very few. We discussed this subject in work sometime ago. Not in context of whales but generally about the meat that people in different countries eat. And consensus was “I like my steak, chops and so on and no one will tell me what to eat”. I raised this question to two Indian gentlemen and they assured me that thought most of Indian disagrees with killing the cattle, they are too polite to tell people in other country what to eat.

Hi Karl

Don’t worry, I don’t see your response as sarcastic, but thanks for the heads up!

I’ve had similar conversations with similar outcomes so I am not surprised, offended or even shocked. I guess how we choose to lead our own lives is just that, a personal choice. Over the years, I have come to see that it can be very challenging to understand what drives other people, especially when I haven’t walked a mile in their shoes.

I don’t mind being part of the few. I make my views known because from where I am now, my life has brought me much personal happiness and tremendous fulfilment. To others, it may seem empty, dull or just plain daft! But that’s just me and my experiences! One of the many Earthlings – thanks for the previous link Beren!

Regards

Dennis

PS – You might just ask those same men at what age did they "freely" choose to eat the food they now eat? Who influenced them? Was it their parents, their culture, local traditions, etc? Did they really choose "freely", or are they simply on auto pilot? Much like the Indian Gentlemen - their parents, culture, etc. compelled them to follow their particular diet.

I suspect that the Japanese people that do so, are also simply following their tradition. Their parents, culture, etc. may have “brainwashed” them to kill whales and eat them? I wonder if they can truly say that they are doing it as a free, fully informed individual?

Food for thought eh?

[casstony]

Though I eat meat and have killed animals to eat, I do struggle with the idea of killing animals. I wonder how many less meat eaters there would be among us if all had to personally experience killing the animal rather than picking up some pre-packaged food from the supermarket.