Colour Perception

[venus (Lydia)]

Maybe it's just that astronomer are more observant of changes in their eyes due to the fact that they give them extensive use when viewing?
I know I have noticed my vision changing in the last few years and friends who arn't astronomers haven't complained like I have either.
I was really suprised to see the brilliant light blue in the ghost through Andrew's scope at IISAC last Saturday night, Andrew was a wealth of info on astronomy on the night sky and a very nice person as was everyone I met at the camp.

[fringe_dweller]

Originally Posted by barees63

maybe those other bozos are imagining it? looked at too many Hubble pictures so brain colours it in for them?

Com'n guys! you all having me on arent you??
There are lots of colourful images of neb's and other objects from hubble yet M42 is the only one I see colour in like that (other than blue/green PN's) - and its quite different colour scheme to a hubble shot - mostly I see M42 as a degree or sometimes more long giant eerie luminous purple vampire with wings/arms partly extended - a bit like the barcardi bat - with the wings fading into the night at near it feet take that the visually challenged! you cant buy what i got
I love that new acronym B(lessed). O)(ptical). Z(one). O(perators). of S(copes).
by the way (nice show of balanced unbiased moderating again there or is it as kangaroo court system?)
And as for the twilight theory - why doesnt that work for the other big nebs and other objects, ie why wouldnt that turn the LMC green/blue?!!?
Guys's, the floaters are the biggest nuisance (there is usually only one really bad one in my right eye) on planets I find, looking like odd moon shadow transits hehe - but i have learnt to train my eye into tricking it/them into moving out of way - a bit like a flea circus ringmaster!
I have always felt a pang of pity when I hear the story that people are going to get into AA when they retire - i am very very glad and grateful I started when i was 30 - at least I will know what i am missing when i am run into those problems in the future although one of my best observing buddies is colour blind and that doesnt seem to impinge on his enjoyment too much at all.
I guess thats why imaging is so popular?

[barees63]

nice show of balanced unbiased moderating again there

of course I was only kidding! I'm just jealous..

[ausastronomer (John Bambury)]

Originally Posted by fringe_dweller

And as for the twilight theory - why doesnt that work for the other big nebs and other objects, ie why wouldnt that turn the LMC green/blue?!!?

Absolutely nfi, but I know what myself and a dozen either people at Lostock IISAC saw. Andrew Murrell predicted it, so I suggest you send him a PM and ask him. If you can wait a bit I will be talking on the phone with him within the next few days and I can ask him as I am also curious.

CS-John B

[fringe_dweller]

Bruce, I knew it was just a good natured ribbing between observers but in writing, can be percieved many ways as others have mentioned before.
Perception is a subjective thing as you all know, for instance try and tell people the sky really isnt blue - its in the eye of the beholder - it actually should be more violet /indigo but we arent supposedly as receptive to this part of the spectrum.
I totally agree Venus - we are pushing beyond the limits of normal use of eye's and are more sensitive to changes - well worth mentioning.
Another one of my favourite astro trivia facts (have a lot stored) is the oft mentioned one that if the Tarantula was in the same spot as the Great Nebula of Orion it would fill as much as 80% of the night sky - and at night cast a purple shadow across the earth how cool is that!
There was a very, very interesting thread from Laurie on this subject -
http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...ht=rajah+cones

[astro_south (Andrew)]

Was out at my society's dark sky site over the weekend and easily saw colour in Orion in a range of scopes. I was lucky to have intermitent use of a 30" and a 22" F5.7 (almost all of Saturday night was devoted to the 22"). I spent a fair bit of time showing the owner of the 22" scope the Horsehead and how to identify it. Naturally in the area I visted the Flame Nebula a few times which was amazing in this scope. Now after a while staring at it I am sure I noticed a dirty orange colour to the nebula. I haven't found any other evidence of this in my limited searches, and the guy I was with said he saw it aswell, but he might just have been convinced of it via my observation. I am not sure if my eyes were playing tricks and my imagination was getting in the way. I would have thought the nebula is so dim that it would never show colour, but then again I have read of people seeing colour in the North American Nebula - so I guess it is possible. The seeing would barely rate a 5-6 that night, but the transparency was great.

In Orion in my 12.5" dob I see the bright core and the 'wings' as mostly a grey-green, but I see the nebula inside the brighter wing arches as a distictive ruddy pink. The key to noticing the colour is to concentrate on the dark area that leads into the trapezium. The pink in the nebula really contrasts well against the dark lane and this may help in seeing the subtle colour. I have also seen colour in the Trifid nebula in a 16" scope on a good night.

[barees63]

The weird thing for me is I looked back thru my log book and the second time I took the scope out I had written "M42 some blue/green color?".. My (probably specious) theory is, since the two people I showed M42 who had never looked thru a scope before instantly saw color and I apparently saw it the second time out but never since, is that as my eyes have become better at dark adapting I am losing the use of some color receptors in favor of night-vision rods..

[fringe_dweller]

Bruce maybe you should flash youself in the eyes with a torch just before taking a look at M42 Its a thought!
I was thinking about other easy colourful sights outside of M42, PN's and planets (and stars of course - and golden GC members)
I forgot about comets :-) they can have blue/green heads and can have blue or green ion tails of course! and in dusty ones the golds and yellows of reflected sunlight, naturally.
My favourite colour yet in a smallish comet, was in early may 2004 on C/2001 Q4 NEAT from a very dark site, I very easily saw with my 8x56 bino's the broad curved ~1º long, exotic dark and dirty weird green of the CO2 type III tail - pretty damn rare i believe :-)) My rarest colour in the collection :-)))
Andrew - I believe too with enough aperture like you guys have, and trained experienced eye's in very dark skies, hints and suggestions of colours must abound in the universe!

[RAJAH235]

fwiw, your eyes become 'dark adapted' 1/2 hr to a 1hr after zero exposure to white light. Fine. This varies with age. ie; increases...
But, when you view an object that is faint ie; neb or the like where colour is known to be seen by others, just take your time at the E/Pc & let your eyes become 'dark adapted' to the new 'darker'? scene. You'd be surprised how the details & colours can be discerned after a few mins viewing.
Not really a matter of 'training your eyes' imho. If your eyes cannot 'see' colour, (sorry Slice & others), because of lack of cones or genetics etc, then you never will 'see it' in the fainter objects.. Just not enough 'light' to activate them..etc etc...
L.

flash yourself in the eyes with a torch just before taking a look at M42

ps. Fringey, only if it's got a red or green LED in it....

[barees63]

just take your time at the E/Pc

There may be a bit of that, since I got the AN going I have tended to flit from one thing to another, maybe I need to slow down a bit ;-)

[RAJAH235]

Yep, take it a little slower. After all, the Universe ain't going anywhere in a hurry! or is it??? L.

[slice of heaven]

Originally Posted by RAJAH235

If your eyes cannot 'see' colour, (sorry Slice & others), because of lack of cones or genetics etc, then you never will 'see it' in the fainter objects.. Just not enough 'light' to activate them..etc etc...

I gotta get a 30"

[RAJAH235]

Lets face facts here Geoff, you're just not suited to Astronomy! L.
ps. The 30" might help a tiny bit, but.......