Beware of the Sun

[casstony]

Originally Posted by Morepower

But all you young'ens, don't worry about how the opposite sex is going to see you just because you are nicely tanned. It won't be worth it.

I don't think they'll listen - I wouldn't at that age - peer pressure is too strong. The only cure for young and dumb is to acquire the wisdom of later years.

Although it seems there has been some positive shift in the teenage groupthink due to the slip/slop/slap campaigns.

[CraigS]

Originally Posted by casstony

I don't think they'll listen - I wouldn't at that age - peer pressure is too strong. The only cure for young and dumb is to acquire the wisdom of later years.

Although it seems there has been some positive shift in the teenage groupthink due to the slip/slop/slap campaigns.

Well .. y'know Tony, when some young kids, (6 - 12 yrs old), see what their parents have to endure, and hear the cause and effect story, I think over time, it will change.

Glad to hear you pulled up OK, Ric. (So far, so have I)

One can now ponder whether the size of the 'chunk' your doctor took, had any other basis in justification, other than statistical 'risk' factors, based largely upon segments of the community, which you may, or may not, fit into.

In retrospect, clearly the chunk he took was not justified.
(Which is all too easy to say in arrears, however).

Cheers

[casstony]

Originally Posted by CraigS

Well .. y'know Tony, when some young kids, (6 - 12 yrs old), see what their parents have to endure, and hear the cause and effect story, I think over time, it will change.
Cheers

..... except that the kids are likely to be in their 20's or 30's before they see the consequences in their parents - the damage is already done.

As you say though, hopefully over time changing community attitudes are having a positive impact on teenagers. But I wouldn't hold my breath .

[erick (Eric)]

Dr took samples of some skin lesions last year for checking - benign. Just before Christmas I noticed another lesion develop - right in the V on my chest under the neck where the sun shines brightly on the skin. Alarm bells! From nowhere to quite a lump in a month - so I saw the Dr at first opportunity. Sampled and again tested benign - whew! My parents had many BCCs removed in the later years of their life. I'm now 55. I keep a close eye on them and ask Dr to do the same.

[CraigS]

Originally Posted by casstony

..... except that the kids are likely to be in their 20's or 30's before they see the consequences in their parents - the damage is already done.

Parents should be closer to say, Hugh Hefner's age then !!
(Eeeeewww … uggghh !!! )

No there's a shocking image !

Cheers

[Jen]

Originally Posted by Ric

I got my stitches out yesterday as well as the pathology report.

The report showed that the lump was cancer free so I didn't have to have any more taken out.

That made me a very relieved and happy chappy.

Cheers

great stuff Ric

[Ric]

Cheers Jen

Treated myself to a nice wide brim Arkubra today. I need more protection now I'm a bit thinner on top.

[jjjnettie (Jeanette)]

Glad you got the all clear Ric.

[jjjnettie (Jeanette)]

When excising cancer, it's normal to give a 2cm clearance all round.
Sure, you can bully your doctor into giving you different treatment (farrah fawset did) but your doctor deals with this on a day to day basis. I'd rather live (emphasis on the word LIVE) with the disfigurement personally.

[Starman73]

Hi there All,

I am a Registered Nurse, working in a very busy Sydney public hospital. Just like all members of the human race there are good ones and bad ones, not just doctors. Younger doctors are more approachable than older ones, passing all of their exams and being able to call themselves a specialist can be the turning point. I have seen many doctors change once they become a "boss".

This is also part of the doctor culture. All doctors will tell you how bad and dangerous things are when they are forced to work 36hrs or more without sleep. The problem is that nothing will ever be done about it because the older doctors believe that they had to go though the long hours ect, so the younger dr's need to as well.

There is also the culture of "thats not my job" call my intern, he will do it. Things have changed over the years, but its going to take a very long time.

In the past, when a person has gone to the doctors it was always, "Doctor do what you think is best". People are starting to want to have a greater say in their health care. I once heard a surgeon talking to another doctor about 10yrs ago expressing his distaste for the internet because it was making people question his judgement. He was very unimpressed by a particular patient who had the audacity to have researched their condition before they went to the doctors. Luckily we are finding more doctors these days who are welcoming patients inputs into their health care.

About the point of taking too much from around a lesion. I am sure you could talk to your doctor about not taking too much, but I am sure you would be advised that it is better to take more now, then less, then discover that all of the lesion has not been taken and having to go back to take more. By going back to take more they would probably have to take even more tissue then they would have originally because they don't have the original lesion as a reference point. You should always however, be able to ask your doctor questions and have him/her explain things to you, as this is all part of giving an informed consent. Always remember, same as going to a mechanic, you can always get a referal to another doctor if you are having problems with the one you are seeing. Also, if a doctor is confident about their diagnosis, they should be very happy to refer you to someone for a second oppinion. If you are not happy with the way they will carry out a procedure, there is no reason why you can't see another doctor and see if they will be willing to do it differently.

As with the other people, prevention is better than cure. Slip, slop and slap and as they say in the TV add hopefully you won't find yourself in the operating theatre getting any lesion removed.

Regards
Paul

[CraigS]

Originally Posted by jjjnettie

When excising cancer, it's normal to give a 2cm clearance all round.
Sure, you can bully your doctor into giving you different treatment (farrah fawset did) but your doctor deals with this on a day to day basis. I'd rather live (emphasis on the word LIVE) with the disfigurement personally.

Hi jjj;

I presume the 2cms clearance is entirely dependent on the outcome of the biopsy ? For melanomas maybe .. for SCCs and BCCs .. the margin would then depend on a number of variables (and maybe as small as a couple of millimetres clearance). Where the lesion is located, how long its been there, etc, also comes into play … a multivariable issue, it seems. Where multivariables are involved, there are always 'safety margins'. I find these 'safety margins' are very much related to statistical analyses, which include other peoples' cases/issues and thus, may not relate to my specific case. The needs of the community are separable from the needs of the individual, and yet, I've found this concept is extremely difficult for GPs (& specialists) to visualise. (Try it on a GP/Specialist sometime .. and you'll see what I mean).

Biopsy 'samples' do not need a 3 cm cut and 6 stitches, for example.

'Bullying' is not an approach that I'd endorse, either.

It seems that the only person taking the position of minimising the impact of overly cautious treatments thesedays, is the patient. Management of the entire process thesedays comes down to being informed, from whatever information may exist. Such is modern life. I am very concerned for the non-internet literate generation (ie: our parents). They are the most vulnerable although, I've found that I also need to be firing on all cylinders, whenever the stakes are high, for issues concerning my own well being.

It all requires great discipline, which is not always easy, especially if one is not feeling 100%.

Cheers, Rgds (and I appreciate your views).

[CraigS]

Hi Starman;
I really appreciate your sharing of your experiences and I 'resonate' closely with the examples and your thoughts on each of them. Thank you.


Some comments follow:

On internet research & wrangling with doctors ..

Originally Posted by Starman73

Luckily we are finding more doctors these days who are welcoming patients inputs into their health care.

I find this highly encouraging .. I wish I could find these types .. so far, I haven't had much luck.

Originally Posted by Starman73

About the point of taking too much from around a lesion. ... then discover that all of the lesion has not been taken and having to go back to take more. By going back to take more they would probably have to take even more tissue then they would have originally because they don't have the original lesion as a reference point.

Surely this issue can be overcome with technology, by taking accurate 'before' measurements/details, recording and marking the margins prior ! I find this argument, (whilst very common amongst surgeons), in this day and age, to be like using the ol' sledge hammer to crack a peanut !

Originally Posted by Starman73

If you are not happy with the way they will carry out a procedure, there is no reason why you can't see another doctor and see if they will be willing to do it differently.

Once again, I find the characteristic of GPs/Specialists, of being reluctant to separate the needs of the community, from the needs of the individual to be very strong, regardless of which doctor one approaches (see my previous response to jjj). Better to hammer it out with one, than keep running to find someone with a more agreeable personality ! Great value can come from intense, gritty discussions. Trying to find one who will engage in such, is extremely difficult, and can waste valuable time .. better off spending the time before the stakes become higher.

Originally Posted by Starman73

As with the other people, prevention is better than cure. Slip, slop and slap and as they say in the TV add hopefully you won't find yourself in the operating theatre getting any lesion removed.

I whole-heartedly agree … with a corollary reason though …
If one removes the basis of suspicion of past 'misbehaviour', one is on firmer ground to manage the process.


Cheers & Rgds (and I appreciate your views).

[mill (Martin)]

I had a lesion removed from my nose on Thursday that had been there for more than 25 years.
It only had to be removed because i have to wear reading glasses and it was becoming an annoance.
They only took a tiny bit away from around the lesion so it will heal quick.
The nurse who did the first examination said straight away that it was cancer and i told her to get a specialist first before making such a judgement.
The specialist took a look and asked how long it was there and then said it was benign.
Monday i'm going back to get the stitches removed

Ric i wish you good luck and hope everything goes well

[Starman73]

Hello Craig,

I am happy you found my comments valuable. I have had about 15yr experience working with doctors. Working with them from intern to specialist makes for interesting psychological and sociological examination.

Nahh really, they are nice people on the whole. There are a few that think they are God. Some people will be like that no matter what.

Other thing to remember is that doctors are only human as well. I have seen plenty of them who become over cautious because of bad experieces, near misses. They are only trying to prevent bad stuff from happening again. Once again, doctors are humans as well, and humans make mistakes.

Well I wish you all the best.

If there is anything more I can help you with or anything, please drop me a message.

Regards
Paul

[Ric]

Thanks everyone for the well wishes. I appreciate them all.

I see that there is discussion as to how much should be removed from around a growth and are they taking to much?

In my opinion and from my one and hopefully only experience I am happy that my doctor took a large piece and if there is a future occourance I would probably encourage him to do the same again.

I see the ads on telly where they miss a bit and it gets into the blood stream, that's scary.

If you have a choice between life or disfigurement and scars, it's not really a contest in my books.

Cheers