Extremely dark skies

[gary]

Originally Posted by ngcles

Re the SQM readings from overseas, see:

http://www.unihedron.com/projects/da...tatistics=true

There are several readings in the high 22s and even up to mid 23s that I am a little suspicious of ...

I wonder if these people were standing in the shade of a tree or maybe have fudged things ... just a wee bit ?

Hi Les,

Indeed.

What is always missing in these readings is any standard deviation.
For example, when someone reports that the reading was 22.00, that is
plus or minus what? Hopefully this appears in a spec somewhere and
would be interesting to know.

You only have to see some of the locales cited in those statistics to see something
is amiss.

Take Cherry Springs Pennsylvania. No doubt, by Pennslyvannia standards it might
well be dark. But for a location only 200km from Buffalo and the Great Lakes,
250km from Pittsburgh and 300km from New York city, it would hardly
be the first location that comes to mind for the world's darkest locations.
And yet, it reported as having some of the best SQM readings.

As many are aware, Coonabarabran is some 460km from Sydney but the
light dome from Sydney has become a problem for the professionals at the AAT.

Having been to New York city and Pittsburgh, these places are ablaze with light.
In fact, having flown from New York to San Francisco via Pittsburgh on a red eye
flight, there is one thing that startles me about the United States, which is that
Bill Gates could have been the richest man. When you look down from the plane,
you would reckon the guy that sold them all those orange street lights must
surely be the richest man in America. There are countless millions of them,
coast to coast across the continental U.S.

So having also been to places like Brendan has reported in the Northern Territory,
including flying over the interior of Australia at night, there is absolutely no
comparison.

Perhaps the organic material on the ground at the cattle stations in the Northern Territory
might be also used to describe these results?

The night up at Mudgee last weekend (only 1 clear night) was up there with the best few I've seen from there. Haven't observed from Kaputar yet -- one day, it sounds a wonderful spot!

With regards Kaputar, talk to the ranger in Narrabri with regards the key to
the track that goes to the helicopter/quarry area. This location has been cleared of trees.
Book one of the excellent value cabins.

[glenc (Glen)]

It is not dark here: http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2008/...189769741.html

[robgreaves]

I built myself a large Tesla coil in the UK. I was generating a MegaVolt though with 30" long streamers. Awesome bit of kit.

Darkest skies I have seen was on an untra transparent, dark, new moon night out at Ayers Rock. The milky way cast a gentle shadown on the desert floor when you held your hand 12" above it.

Penrith night sky here though is just orange. Horrid.

Regards,
Rob

[Wavytone]

I've experienced a few class 2 nights at Mt Kaputar during the early 1980's, once in the Nullarbor when observing Halleys Comet in 1986, and on one night earlier this year a site in the hills behind Bright, in the Victorian high country.

On the occasions at Kaputar there were quite a few experienced observers and to the naked eye most were easily seeing mag 7 - 7.5. The Milky Way in these conditions is just gorgeous, like tiny diamonds poured across a velvety deep blue sky. It is even more weird when you're FULLY dark adapted as you can see people and scopes and stuff on the ground - with no moon.

As you can camp on the top IMHO all serious stargrgazers should go to Kaputar at least once, even if only to have the chance to see how good the night sky can be.

I doubt there is anywhere in mainland Oz capable of being darker than Siding Spring mountain and Mt Kaputar. When the AAO site survey was done Kaputar finished second - it was similar for seeing and darkness and the only thing against it was more frequent cloud due to closer proximity to the coast.

PS -re the helicopter area in the forest on top of Kaputar - that area is about 100m along the Barraba fire trail and its the top of a lava field - it wasn't "cleared" - trees can't grow there as its harder than solid concrete !!

[Paddy (Patrick)]

Hmmm.... I'm planning a trip with scope to the Warrumbungles next year. Might have to go little further and visit Mt Kaputar by the sounds of it!

[PeterM]

Howdy,
I just posted a new thread under general discussion with a pic of participants taken at Kaputar in 86 or 87. In the 2 years I attended I saw some wonderful dark skies, some incredible storms and met some very keen amateurs.
PeterM

[glenc (Glen)]

I did some observing from Mt Surprise and Undara airports in Qld this year. Both places are very dark and have altitude too.
I also observed from Kaputar in 1986 and have observed from the Warrumbungles. In 1991 I observed from about 50km north of Meekatharra in WA, it was also very dark.

[Terry B]

I've been to Kaputar many times but never at night with a scope. It is high and very dark up there but lots of trees. The roos are very friendly. They try to steal stuff off the BBQ and you have to chase them away.

[pepperstone (Daniel)]

I was in Kitgum (near the border of Sudan and Uganda) earlier this year and that was pretty incredible. Of coure, I didn't have a telescope on me though. Amazing all the same.

[gary]

Originally Posted by pepperstone

I was in Kitgum (near the border of Sudan and Uganda) earlier this year and that was pretty incredible. Of coure, I didn't have a telescope on me though. Amazing all the same.

Hi Daniel,

Thanks for the post.

I know exactly what you mean.

Mai and I have driven up through the desert just east of there, on the Kenyan side
close to the Sudan and Ethiopian frontiers in the Lake Turkana region.

It may well be the cradle of mankind and our collective ancestors probably spent
the first couple of million years there until we finally figured out the trick indeed was to
"bang the rocks together". It is pretty clear we didn't stick around there long enough to
invent the light bulb.

For example, you come across lone Turkana tribesmen standing naked in what, by any
definition, is the middle of nowhere in the desert, often carrying long spears or bows
and arrows.

The threat of marauding parties of Sudanese shifta in four wheel means that one
has to remain continually vigilant, so unfortunately an ideal picnic observing spot
it is not.

However, it may very well be the part of the world where we looked up
and for the first time, really contemplated the Moon and the stars.

Best Regards

Gary

[Zuts]

I spent a year 30 km from Eungella in QLD. It is roughly 100 km west of Mackay and about 1000 m elevation. On a moonless cloudy night it was basically pitch black. As black as with your eyes shut.

On a fine night the sky was absolutely amazing

Cheers
Paul

[gary]

Originally Posted by Zuts

I spent a year 30 km from Eungella in QLD. It is roughly 100 km west of Mackay and about 1000 m elevation. On a moonless cloudy night it was basically pitch black. As black as with your eyes shut.

On a fine night the sky was absolutely amazing

Cheers
Paul

Hi Paul,

You possibly mean around the highlands in the Broken River NP area, or maybe
west of there?

At lower elevations it is prone to fog and I have seen it get foggy all the way to the
top there at Broken River. I would imagine once you get a little further west
of there it appears to change from rain forest to drier open forest and would make for
a nice observing locale.

If you are in the rain forest down at Finch Haton at night and it is raining,
I can testify it is indeed dark.

However when it is clear it is very nice and I remember Andrew Murrell taking
some nice snaps of the night sky with the Nikon just hand held.

Best Regards

Gary

[hector (Andrew)]

I have been to many Dark Sky sites in both Australia and the US. Mt Kaputar is a second darkest sky for me. The slight altitude helps seperate some of the dust from the atmosphere, so you are under a slightly more transparent sky. To prove to myself this is the case I had observed down at the Mt base then driven up to the top and again observed after letting myself dark adapt and it was better at the summit.
The darkest skies where from the middle of bumblef*** in South Australia near Glendambo. Gary, Mai, my wife and I were there to watch the Solar Eclipse and decided to camp the night just off the road near the rail line. I distinctly remember that the sky was DARK and Transparent. It had rained there only a few days before and the dust had been washed out of the sky.
The Sky at Ilford is good but Coona is much better. The TSP is held at one of the darkest spots in the US and even there the sky is in my opinion is no better than Ilford.
Andrew

[gary]

Originally Posted by Terry B

I've been to Kaputar many times but never at night with a scope. It is high and very dark up there but lots of trees. The roos are very friendly.

Or as the Hitchhikers Guide would quote, "Mostly Harmless".

Andrew Murrell once had to transport a friend of ours back down the mountain
to the hospital in Narrabri for some stitches from a kangaroo that scratched her.

Apparently she had crouched down close to the animal to photograph it, which
she later realised was her mistake. When she went to stand back up, the roo
mistook her action as a threat and struck out at her, I believe slashing right through
her denim jeans into her leg, but Andrew would know all the gory details.

These days the road up and down the mountain is vastly improved compared
to the dusty, rough and dangerous track it was then. I certainly would
never like to have cause to go down it in a hurry.

Both patient and roo were fine, but it re-enforced the old actor's axiom to
avoid ever working with animals or young children.

Best Regards

Gary

[gary]

Originally Posted by hector

The darkest skies where from the middle of bumblef*** in South Australia near Glendambo. Gary, Mai, my wife and I were there to watch the Solar Eclipse and decided to camp the night just off the road near the rail line. I distinctly remember that the sky was DARK and Transparent. It had rained there only a few days before and the dust had been washed out of the sky.

Very memorable indeed and the best part of all was that we had all those
telescopes there, including your 20" Hector. We were very lucky with the
transparency and the rain that had threatened observing the eclipse earlier
assisted greatly.

It was about an hour's drive north of Woomera and about 2 and a half hours drive south
of Coober Pedy. With Adelaide 600km away there is absolutely zero light pollution.
I remember as we drove north of Port Augusta the cloud dissipated the further
inland we went until it was absolutely blue sky from horizon to horizon so we
had more luck than those who had committed themselves to Ceduna.

Some pictures of Hector set up there the day after the eclipse 4th Dec 2002 attached.

Best Regards

Gary

[Zuts]

Originally Posted by gary

Hi Paul,

You possibly mean around the highlands in the Broken River NP area, or maybe
west of there?

At lower elevations it is prone to fog and I have seen it get foggy all the way to the
top there at Broken River. I would imagine once you get a little further west
of there it appears to change from rain forest to drier open forest and would make for
a nice observing locale.

If you are in the rain forest down at Finch Haton at night and it is raining,
I can testify it is indeed dark.

However when it is clear it is very nice and I remember Andrew Murrell taking
some nice snaps of the night sky with the Nikon just hand held.

Best Regards

Gary

Hi Gary,

I was in a little farmhouse on the Crediton Loop, about a km or two from the Crediton Hall.

[gary]

Originally Posted by Zuts

Hi Gary,

I was in a little farmhouse on the Crediton Loop, about a km or two from the Crediton Hall.

Hi Paul,

OK! I think I know approximately where you mean, possibly on the way out to the
dam there. Nice part of the world!

Best Regards

Gary