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  #21  
Old 14-05-2007, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocket Boy View Post
Andrew you might like to read Paul's equipment list in his signature.
Please keep this thread on topic !
Sorry.

I'd had a bad day and felt the need to type something humorous. My money would be on an SBIG purely because of all the good things I read about them from other users.
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  #22  
Old 15-05-2007, 12:36 PM
jase (Jason)
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Back onto the photometry thread, similar to what I mentioned previously about SCT corrector plates being next to useless for UV measurements, the spectral response actually applies to all components in your optical train not just the correct plate. Don't get me wrong, you can still use a SCT, but you'd need a way of cross checking the accuracy of the measurements. Perhaps using some offset data from other well known sources.

I know you're still learning to crawl before you walk, but considering you're testing CCD and CMOS chips that would be suitable for photometry, I thought I'd also provide more info on the spectral response.

Typically a CCD or CMOS chip chamber is covered using a type of glass (called a window). I recommend during your testing of cameras that you investigate the glass type the manufacture is using. Normally Schott BK7 is used. It has a reasonable reponse to UV wavelengths, but not the best. You should try to obtain a camera that uses MgF2 (Magnesium Fluroide) as this glass allows wavelengths all the way down to 120nm - well below the start of the visual wavelengths. This is not a major issue as typical U filter only starts at 300nm, but you want to make sure the camera is still sensitive lower than 300nm so no cut-off is experienced. Most glasses will transmit all the way up to 1200nm - IR (700-1200nm) wavelengths. UV is probably the most critical and hardest to reach depending on telescope design.

Obviously, having a camera that allows you to go low into the wavelength spectrum wont make a difference if there is poor spectral response in other areas of the optical train. Hence the reason why I indicated you need to look at the big picture, not just the camera.

This in turn will send you on a quest to determine what is the most optimal design/telescope for photometry. I haven't found this yet - but if you do come across it, please let me know. Generally, you can use most types though I read that well corrected refractors are good. Many are corrected down to 360nm. I have not looked into mirror based designs to make any comment.

Finally, the speed of the optical system is not really a big issue with the UBVRI filters as they are not really that narrow. Compared to a 3nm or 6nm Halpha filter they are quite broad. Using a fast instrument such F/2.8 or F/4 camera lens, the light cone that hits a narrowband filter can actually shift the spectral response. So instead of the Ha filter being centered at 656.3nm, it shifts. This results in missing the critical narrow light path of the filter and delivers a poor Ha image. This is the reason why if you have a fast optical system, its best to stay away from really narrowband filters. Its best to go for 10nm or higher so when the shift occurs, the filter will still transmit at wavelength. Alas, you don't have to worry about this with the UBVRI filters.

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  #23  
Old 15-05-2007, 03:52 PM
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Terry B
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jase View Post
Yes, I've used drift scan imaging to make some astrometry measurements of Teegardens star - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teegarden's_star
I actually never thought it would be possible to measure the movement with amateur equipment - I was wrong. I wouldn't bother using drift scans for "pretty" pictures - long exposures are best for these.
I have used my camera to take photos of proxima centaurus over the last 7 years using just 20 sec exposures (not drift scan) and have plotted the propper motion and some parallax shift. This is using very amateur equipment in my backyard. It is certainly possible.
My CCD camera is a home built one using a KAF0401E chip (NABG). I have borrowed our clubs old sbig ST7 with ABG version of the same chip. It is nowhere near as sensitive as my camera. I didn't realise that htere would be much difference but there is.
I have attached a plot of the movement.
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  #24  
Old 31-05-2007, 04:05 PM
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[1ponders] (Paul)
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Just revisiting this thread.

I'm seriously considering the ST-7XME (free CFW8 atm, class 1 chip and pelican case) with internal guide chip or the ST-7XEI with Class 2 chip and discount on the remote guide head (considerably cheaper than the XME package).

I thought about the ST-9 range but to image at 2 arc/pix I'd need to image at f/10 with my current 8"

I had a look at some of the Apogee cameras, particularly the Accent A1 camera (the A2 would be nice but just a bit too much) but even at the lower price feel the SBIG is a better deal. They use the same chip. Would need a guider with this one as well.

Any thoughts. Comments on the Apogee range? Anyone like to suggest any other cameras to muddy the water
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  #25  
Old 31-05-2007, 04:31 PM
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Just remember that these ST-7's are quite heavy and if the optical train is not up to it there will be flexing. For my money (~$AUD2500) the SBIG 402ME would be the best option with class 1 chip and internal filter wheel with filters. Lot smaller in size but same chip dimensions
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  #26  
Old 31-05-2007, 04:45 PM
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[1ponders] (Paul)
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I looked at the 402ME with the class 1 upgrade. Apart from the weight, what would differentiate it from the 7?
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  #27  
Old 31-05-2007, 04:47 PM
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[1ponders] (Paul)
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BTW the imaging train at this stage will either be an 8" LX200 OTA or a 12" LX200R OTA on G11 (W/- JMI-CM focuser and 6.3 or 3.3 FR), or an Orion ED80 with Williams Optics 10:1 focuser upgrade.

Depending on what I decide on, if I need a guidescope it will either be the ED80 or a Celestron 102 achro refractor.
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  #28  
Old 01-06-2007, 02:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [1ponders] View Post
Here is a question for you black belters out there.

There are a lot of CCDs getting around these days and alot of budding astroimagers interested in them. If you only had $3500 Aus to spend (not necessarily in Australia and don't include delivery) on a CCD camera what would you choose and why.

Caveats.
No DSLRs, must be a mono CCD and NABG camera.
To be used with scopes of 400mm FL (f/5) to 1260mm FL (f/6.3) for astrometry and photometry.
Good dynamic range, QE, (you know the usual )
Doesn't have to be selfguiding.
Cooling - min 30 deg below ambient.

I look forward to the replies
Hi,

Take also a look at

http://www.qsimaging.com
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  #29  
Old 01-06-2007, 03:53 AM
Dennis
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Hi Paul

I have the older ST7E with a parallel cable and it is an excellent workhorse, but the relatively small chip size of 765 x 510 pixels may be an issue for you when imaging at F10 for the 8" and 12" OTA's. It is likely that old favourites like M83 and NGC253 would not fit on the chip, so you would need to take mosaics.

So, if the pockets are deep enough, I would try to get a larger chip if you plan on taking pretty deep sky images.

My ST7E has the smaller internal guide chip whereas the newer ST7’s have the larger chip, making it easier to find a decent guide star. I personally prefer to auto guide with the ST7E guide chip whenever possible – the simplicity of a single ‘scope, one computer and one set of cables compared to a separate guide scope etc.

However, a separate guide scope with its large FOV and ability to be adjusted by the guide rings has a lot going for it.

Cheers

Dennis
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  #30  
Old 01-06-2007, 07:21 AM
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[1ponders] (Paul)
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Thanks Rainer and Dennis.

Dennis, I wouldn't be f/10ing if very often. There would be one of the focal reducers inline most of the time.
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