Base load power

[AstralTraveller (David)]

Originally Posted by TrevorW

you get fresh vegetables that taste like vegetables as well, although some farmers might not appreciate it

also instead of using a dryer hang a clothes line under the patio and hang out the big items

if it's cold don't turn the heater up just put on a jumper

make sure no electrical item is left in standby mode

change all you light globes to fluro

don't turn lights on during the day open the blinds and let the sunlight in

re-cycle grey water

have a house with a tin roof, vented and insulated will be 5-10% cooler in the summer

Solar hot water with a backup, preferably gas. Why is that not mandatory on all houses? My backup doesn't get used for 8 months a year. Simple, cheap, reliable and proven.

Walk to work or bus or train or bicycle.

I don't own a clothes drier or dishwasher and don't miss them. When the heater is on doors are shut, particularly the toilet and bathroom.

[TrevorW]

Peter don't know if you posted this thread on thorium reactors being developed by India

http://large.stanford.edu/courses/20...hattacharyya1/

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by TrevorW

Peter don't know if you posted this thread on thorium reactors being developed by India

http://large.stanford.edu/courses/20...hattacharyya1/

That's great. Hopefully the pollies here take the hint and get their a$$ in gear I hear we have plenty of the stuff too.

...The success of this project in India, as well as in other countries such as France, may encourage greater worldwide pursuit of nuclear energy as an alternative to fossil fuels...

[marki]

Originally Posted by Peter Ward

For high wattage appliances low voltage means high current, hence higher distribution losses. You have to use very thick wire to minimize this...in short it's not practical.

As an example, the power (i.e wall) cable on 110V steam irons in the USA are noticably warmer than the 240V versions we run at home.

.....the heat in the power cable is wasted energy.

Ah but Peter you are assuming the energy can only be transferred in the form of electrons flowing through a wire from a far off distribution point. What if we used the reduced gas as the energy carrier instead passing it through fuel cells that are much closer to the area of need? Just a thought mind.

Mark

[KenGee (Kenith Gee)]

LOL " Solar and wind are inherently unpredictable" gee so we're not sure whether the sun will come up tomorrow.

I'm a firm believer in using safe nuke power. We have safe access to a very large nuke source.

[Peter Ward]

Originally Posted by KenGee

LOL " Solar and wind are inherently unpredictable" gee so we're not sure whether the sun will come up tomorrow.

The sun will stay (relatively) in the same place.
The earth will spin.
Sydney's current rain and associated cloud...will block the sunlight, moonlight, starlight and make my (not inexpensive) astronomical telescopes plus PV panels somewhat useless...not that I've giving up either any time soon.

Those scared of "nukes" could watch this in the interim.

[Hagar (Doug)]

There are a few methods of storing wind and solar power for later use but none have been the true answer. Most rely on changing the generated electricity into a storable medium such as compressed air, Battery storage, heat or capacitive storage. Most of these mediums require expensive secondary equipment and are to say the least very inneficient in their operation. The requirement to store these either at site or off site carries it's own problems either way. Voltage control of any network spanning hundreds of kilometers of cable requires very high voltages and very complex control equipment which even with todays technology struggles to react quick enough to provide a stable supply to the load bases in and around our capital cities. Outer areas suffer even worse from these voltage supply issues.
Rotating mass is by far the best way to stablise electricity supply thus one big rotating generator is much more stable than wind farms with many small generators feeding into the grid.

Bearing these facts in mind the alternatives for base load are significantly reduced until technology can find an answer and catch up. Wind and solar are primarily just a stop gap at the moment.

The answer seems to be for each of us to become self sufficient to some degree and reduce our need, at least during the day for coal fired generation. I cannot see Governments following this line. NSW for example has just tried to reduce funding for domestic solar generation and introduced a sceptisism in the community that will take years to repair. NSW quoted cost as the reason for the attempted change. Party politics asside Governments have to make some honest direction for us all to follow, be consistant, treat everyone equally and legislate change rather than applying another impost which requires the first year or two's income to sell it.

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by Peter Ward

Those scared of "nukes" could watch this in the interim.

LOL - This is funny but so true. Just basic common sense really. There's one thing to remember: nuclear is clean. Hard to believe but it has the less impact and the best return. We just need to step out of this 'nuclear is bad and dangerous' thinking. It's going to take a while and few generations.

[renormalised (Carl)]

...Governments have to make some honest direction for us all to follow, be consistant, treat everyone equally...

Ultimately, the responsibility to create the change that's needed is in the hands of the public, not the Governments. It's a malaise of society pretty much everywhere to abrogate the responsibility for the running of society to elected representatives and let them deal with the problems. Giving power over to these people was and is a mistake as can be seen all too well not only in the present but throughout history. Exceptionally few of these people have had the ethical, moral, social/personal maturity and merit to the hold the positions they have managed to con their way into. They are supposedly representatives of the people, not their overlords and masters. But that is they way things have turned out....they tell us what to do, not the other way around.

If we want things to change, then it's up to the people to tell the politicians what we want and that they're to implement those changes. Otherwise, we replace them and get someone in their positions who will listen and do their job...properly.

That's the only way we'll get any movement on power supply and generation...or anything else for that matter.

[Omaroo (Chris Malikoff)]

Originally Posted by renormalised

Giving power over to these people was and is a mistake as can be seen all too well not only in the present but throughout history. Exceptionally few of these people have had the ethical, moral, social/personal maturity and merit to the hold the positions they have managed to con their way into. They are supposedly representatives of the people, not their overlords and masters. But that is they way things have turned out....they tell us what to do, not the other way around.

No modern Australian government has been "in power" - they've merely held office. I, too, think they've missed this point in recent times. The media are constantly referring to the current government "in power", and it's wrong. A dictatorship or sovereignty is usually "in power".

[renormalised (Carl)]

Originally Posted by Omaroo

No modern Australian government has been "in power" - they've merely held office. I, too, think they've missed this point in recent times. The media are constantly referring to the current government "in power", and it's wrong.

You wouldn't know that they only "held power" by their attitude toward everything they say and do. Like everything else, you give them an inch and they take a mile. Things need to be shaken up, I feel.

[strongmanmike (Michael)]

Well, we can't hold an election everytime there is disagreement on a policy.. as there'd be quite a few...let's see ummm? how about Australia's involvement in Afganistan and more particularly Iraq!!!! or annexing parts of Australia as just two examples, all far more worthy and serious decissions to be put before such a clearly well informed public () as us, than a basic simple price on bleeding carbon! An election for a simple price on carbon..??..bah, makes me laugh and question the inteligence of those proposing it . Juuuust need to lump it until the next election... then vote, like the rest of us did in 07 to reinstate some workers hard earned rights in this country (another far more worthy reason to have held an unscheduled election), it's that simple

Mike

[supernova1965 (Warren)]

How short our memory is if we as a nation have forgotten the Howard years I won't be specific on details you all know what I am talking about

This opposition as yet have produced no policies no plan to lead the nation only a promise to stop a tax what will they do after they are elected going by previous statements on mandates they won't have a mandate for anything else but stopping the tax while running the country will be unmandated show us a plan to run the country so far they only show an aptitude to spread fear and division not to bring a country together.

Mr Abbott declared that ''such political future as I have got rests entirely on beating this tax, so that's the whole purpose of what's left of my political life''.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/environment/cl...#ixzz1Sbut2DGi

I will take the opposition on what they say they will do and I see no evidence that they care more for getting elected instead of governing. I don't really care which party does it but I want to see our nation brought together not driven apart the old saying still holds true

United we stand Devided we fall.

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by strongmanmike

Well, we can't hold an election everytime there is disagreement on a policy..

Yup - it's called a referundum.

Originally Posted by strongmanmike

and question the inteligence of those proposing it .

You mean lack of?

[Barrykgerdes]

This thread is getting of the topic and too politically biased. I assumed it was to discuss alternate forms of energy for future use.

Barry

[supernova1965 (Warren)]

Originally Posted by Barrykgerdes

This thread is getting of the topic and too politically biased. I assumed it was to discuss alternate forms of energy for future use.

Barry

Yes I appologise for being off topic but I believe my post was anything but Biased and I felt what I said about bringing the country together was a point that needed to be said. It is hard to discuss future forms of energy when it seems the need to do it is in question to begin with you can't get agreement on what to do if most people don't agree that there is a problem to solve.

[strongmanmike (Michael)]

Yup - it's called a referundum.

Hey!, why not a show of hands

You mean lack of?

Got me, slight ambiguity there huh?..I'll leave it to you to work out what I meant

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by strongmanmike

Hey!, why not a show of hands

Beat you to it.

Originally Posted by strongmanmike

Got me, slight ambiguity there huh?..I'll leave it to you to work out what I meant

Touche! Spoken like a true MP. Mate it's rubbing off

[strongmanmike (Michael)]

Originally Posted by supernova1965

Yes I appologise for being off topic but I believe my post was anything but Biased and I felt what I said about bringing the country together was a point that needed to be said. It is hard to discuss future forms of energy when it seems the need to do it is in question to begin with you can't get agreement on what to do if most people don't agree that there is a problem to solve.

It really is a bizzar situation mate .

[strongmanmike (Michael)]

Originally Posted by Barrykgerdes

This thread is getting of the topic and too politically biased. I assumed it was to discuss alternate forms of energy for future use.

Barry

You are partly right Bazza but if you check back over the thread quite a number of the alternative energy posts in this thread have had thinly or not so thinly deguised political party bashing attached, all directed toward the current government, so since the distain some feel toward the current governemnt is behind so many of the opinions regarding alternative energy anyway, a litte more political banter isn't really that far off topic, in fact it could be argued it is more on topic than not.

As long as people keep it in perspective (with a smile), are civil and refrain from using vitriol or flaming or openly wishing death upon those that have different political persuations ... I see no harm



Mike