G11 Upgrades?

[Waxing_Gibbous (Peter)]

I'm vascillating between an EQ6 and a G11 as a mount for my soon to be arriving 8" Mak. I'm pretty au-fait with the EQ6 and its capabilities and shortcomings. The market seems to happily acknowledge the latter and there are loads of goodies to pimp your EQ6.
Less so the G11. According to most posts on many forums they are perfect.
Then you go to the user's group....

Despite having owned a G8 about 6 years ago, I'm not really on top of the G11.
I do like its fit and finish. And its lovely smooth mechanicals. But Losmandy electrickery leaves a LOT to be desired.
Gemini is woeful - to be charitable, and my copy wouldn't track at all - despite being aligned by an RN navigation instructor and triple checked twice.
Yes, everything was accounted for and finding the SCP was no problem.

I go into this background to forestall any "You didn't do this right, the mount IS perfect I spent $6000 on it..." posts.

At the time, I can only recall the Argo Navis sytem as being an alternative to Gemini. It's still too rich for a poor farm boy like me.
Are there any other 3rd party go-to modules that will work well with the G11? Under $700ish.
Otherwise, I can ignore the paint-job and go for the '6 + upgrades.
I'm mostly a visual observer, but if I can get decent tracking, would like to dabble in L&PI.

Thanks,
Peter

[Alchemy (Clive)]

As a general rule you get what you pay for, so a 3000 dollar mount should be better than a 1500 dollar one.
Is the g11 perfect..... No otherwise why would anyone spend extra on say a paramount.
It's still pretty good though, once you get up above 1500 mm focal length for long exposures you need to tweak, but as for lunar and planetary imaging at 1/60 th of a second, tracking ain't much of an issue compared to seeing. The load carrying capacity of a g11 is bigger than a eq6.
I use an Argo Navis and despite it's budget I cant fault it, I don't have Gemini and now I don't need it. I just use a one star alignment and I'm away.

I would imagine the 8 inch mak would sit on the eq6 so its up to you.

[casstony]

I might choose between the CGEM (because the Celestron hand control is so nice to use) or G11 with Argo (because the Losmandy clutch system is so nice).

[TrevorW]

The latest G11 with G2 has software issues that are being sorted and may take some time, I suggest you Google to find out current issues, it's a well build mount but for the price I expected it to work straight out of the box like the EQ6

For simplicity and carrying capacity is not an issue then go with the EQ6 IMO it provides most bang for your buck

[mithrandir (Andrew)]

Originally Posted by TrevorW

The latest G11 with G2 has software issues that are being sorted and may take some time, I suggest you Google to find out current issues, it's a well build mount but for the price I expected it to work straight out of the box like the EQ6

For simplicity and carrying capacity is not an issue then go with the EQ6 IMO it provides most bang for your buck

Losmandy did not have any alternative but to release the G2 before the software was finished. There were parts used in the G1 that are no longer available.

Originally Posted by casstony

I might choose between the CGEM (because the Celestron hand control is so nice to use) or G11 with Argo (because the Losmandy clutch system is so nice).

I've done that tradeoff - the simple to use Celestron hand control for the better engineered G11 and steep Gemini learning curve. I think you'd need a CGE Pro to get the same load carrying capacity.

Andrew

[rmcconachy]

Originally Posted by mithrandir

Losmandy did not have any alternative but to release the G2 before the software was finished. There were parts used in the G1 that are no longer available... -- Andrew

Of course Losmandy had other alternatives! Scott Losmandy could have: (1) sold only the non-goto stepper motor version of his mounts until the Gemini II software was reasonably complete, (2) persuaded Rene Gorlich that he needed to start on the Gemini II system much earlier than he did, or (3) switched to a different goto system. The current situation is a result of piss poor planning, not some unforeseeable misfortune. I like the Losmandy mounts (the slip clutches in particular) and I own a GM 8 (non Gemini). However, to say that Scott did not have other alternatives is wrong, he has chosen to sell his mounts with very incomplete software.

[TrevorW]

Andrew of course he had a choice, everyone does, but to release an incomplete product while advertising differently is a bit of a con IMO and would not/ or should not be tolerated if he had been a manufacturer/seller in this country, especially when advertising that the original Gemini is still available as well as the G2, check his website

their are certain commands not working with the G2 that should IMO be working out of the box such as

PEC
Multi star alignment

ok to be fair Rene is working on these issues now, likewise when these issues are sorted it will be a very good mount but I for one would have delayed spending $5k had I known

OK I did a bit of research, asked a few questions on this and other forums about the G11, armed with this and relying on Losmandy's advertising I made my choice.

The mount itself is a fine piece of workmanship

[tlgerdes (Trevor)]

I rate the G11 as I would a current Honda, very well engineered, not the making up its short comings with fancy gadgetry.

You can still tweak it, the Ovision OPW is a case in point.

The G2 is its weak link at the moment. I think from reports it is still 6 months from being ready.

If you can get a G1 I have no issues with mine. Yes, it is like going back to an abacus, but it just works.

[Waxing_Gibbous (Peter)]

It really is a shame that L'mandy didn't sort the software properly.
One would think with all the computer boffins and astro-nerds in southern California, one of them could have done the job.
Some enterprising individual should mate the Synta/Celestron system (which I find very friendly) to the G8/11 mounts and bypass Losmandy's pixie-based electronics entirely.

I'm still a little up-in-the-air.
For purely visual use, either an EQ6 or a G8 would be fine.
However, back of an envelope calculations show an 8" M-C with G'scope and camera to weigh in at about 3kgs under the recommended max. for the EQ6 and I'm not sure that's a big enough margin.

Though I don't plan on diving into a-p with both feet, some L&P imaging, along with the brighter DSOs, would definately be on the cards. But even with shorter exposures, 3 meters a long focal length to steady!
So someone out there get busy and sort-out an alternative to Gemini!
I'll be in my office.

[marki]

Originally Posted by Waxing_Gibbous

Some enterprising individual should mate the Synta/Celestron system (which I find very friendly) to the G8/11 mounts and bypass Losmandy's pixie-based electronics entirely.

.

Funny you should say that. It is possible to mate the celestron controller to the vixen atlux which has about the same carrying capacity as the G11 with much better tracking. I am in the process of setting this system up on my SXD.

Mark

[tlgerdes (Trevor)]

Skywalker is another alternative for the Gemini on a G11

[wasyoungonce (Brendan)]

My G11 is still working fine....

Although I think I have a sticky Dec- key

[tlgerdes (Trevor)]

Originally Posted by wasyoungonce

Although I think I have a sticky Dec- key

Too much coffee spilt maybe? Or not sticky, just a disconnected junction between the optic nerve and fine motor control skills.

[wasyoungonce (Brendan)]

Its dark at night...I cannot see..my fingers work faster than my brain

[allan gould]

My GII is over 15 yr old. Same motors etc and it tracks perfectly.
Wouldnt trade it at all. Gemini is old but faithful.

[mithrandir (Andrew)]

Here is one version of an accessory for anyone who wants east heavy without moving any counterweights. I don't think you have to belong to Y! to get that image.

The design could probably be used for other mounts too, but most have a smaller shaft diameter so you'd need a heavier weight.

Andrew