Banks in general suck

[TrevorW]

I thought I'd get a PL to do some home improvements.

Well my bank has a rate of 12.99% on PL's so I thought I'd shop around I came up with a few that where 1-2% cheaper.

So I being honest, loyal and naive thinking as a AAA rated customer of 20 odd years that my bank could match those rates or maybe even do better.

No they wouldn't/couldn't and didn't care less if I took my banking elsewhere.

However they suggested that I apply for a mortgage top up loan where I'd only be charged interest at my mortgage rate and I could split this so I'd be able to repay it just like a PL in 3 years

Well being a customer for 20 odd years having 3 previous PL's with the same bank you'd think it would be straight forward wanting a measly $15k and having over 80% equity in my home as well as a mortgage that does have a $20000 redraw facility which unfortunately I can't access due to my mortgage rate being fixed at the moment.

No such luck I still have to go through the same checking/valuation procedure as if I was a new customer. So a simple process that IMO should only take a day or two stretches out to weeks and a load of paperwork.

Logic, reason and common sense are not in their vocabulary even when you present them a case. I'm surprised they didn't want my pound of flesh as well.

All I can say thank goodness for their oligarchy as a lot would be out of business if competition was as rife as in other commercial sectors.

[blink138 (Pat)]

i would see them in hell rather than giving them extra business!
pat

[Kevnool (Kev)]

Gotta keep the shareholders happy thats why they suk

[Jeffkop (Jeff)]

Yep ... Banks dont hand out any kudos for long term partnerships ... Ya have to jump thru the hoops like an 18 year old with no assets or runs on the board mate ... lest they be missing out on all the fees to provide a loan ... I mean how could they charge you 500 bux to set a loan up IF all they had to do was get you to sign one document and transfer it .. AYE .. HANG ON !!

[cventer]

who do you Bank with Trevor ?

[Bassnut (Fred)]

You woulnt happen to be a share holder would you Trevor?, either direct or through a super fund.

[issdaol (Phil)]

I swapped banks for the same reason a while back.

My new bank refinanced everything for a much cheaper home loan based rate under a line-of-credit setup.

Now I just re-use those lines-of-credit at the home loan rate to fund personal loans or other items as long as I don't go beyond the lines-of-credit limits I can just keep re-using the funds.

If I need to do something larger I just need to extend one of the lines-of-credit.

Might be worthwhile if you can find a bank that will do this for you

[TrevorW]

Through a super fund

rather not say which bank and its not that which bank

[FlashDrive (Poppy)]

Banks want nothing more but to ' enslave ' you into long term debt ... send you applications in the mail for more ' credit cards ' ... try and sell you ' their ' life insurance ... and so on and so on.

They are like a pack of ' wild dogs ' ( most of them ) seeking whom they can devour .. they will tell you how you need them and how they can help you ..... but in reality ...if your not careful ... you slide into an ever increasing hole of debt.

I heard this one day and have never forgotten it :... if you have dug yourself into a financial hole .... then STOP DIGGING.

Do what ever you can to get out of it ... and STAY OUT.

Having a mortgage is necessary and bad enough to handle...!!!
Going to work and having to hand over your ' hard earned cash ' to finance companies EVERY PAYDAY .... is no way to live at all..... you only turn into a slave for them.

Sadly ... some of us who have a ' beer ' income ... cripple ourselves with ' champagne ' taste .. and buy beyond our means.

Be the ' MASTER ' of your own finances ....it's your money ... !!!!

Flash

[cventer]

I am going to bite my toungue and try stay out of any detail in here for 2 reasons.

1. Based on this last post I can foresee a whole bunch of ignorant and uninformed posts following

2. I work for one of these demon banks who will enslave you for life

Leave you with one thought. If our banks were making the sort of profits our european counterparts are making where would our country be right now ?

Our strong financial institutions are a big reason our country avoided the GFC and financial melt downs occurring all over the world.

[casstony]

Originally Posted by cventer

Our strong financial institutions are a big reason our country avoided the GFC and financial melt downs occurring all over the world.

More to do with good luck than good management; our banks would have behaved just as badly as the rest had they not been constrained by different regulations. They may yet fall in a heap via heavy exposure to several years of falling real estate prices combined with rising unemployment.

While people are distracted by interest rate movements, the great crime committed by banks (in cahoots with politicians) was the propagation of the housing bubble fooling Australians into taking on far greater levels of debt than they should have.

[TrevorW]

Our banks are in debt to overseas banks to the tune of $357 billion, go figure

[FlashDrive (Poppy)]

Originally Posted by cventer

I am going to bite my toungue and try stay out of any detail in here for 2 reasons.

1. Based on this last post I can foresee a whole bunch of ignorant and uninformed posts following

2. I work for one of these demon banks who will enslave you for life

Leave you with one thought. If our banks were making the sort of profits our european counterparts are making where would our country be right now ?

Our strong financial institutions are a big reason our country avoided the GFC and financial melt downs occurring all over the world.

Fair go .. The Banks are only in their ' so called ' good position because of the ever increasing fees and charges AT THE EXPENSE of the average worker.... look what their doing now .... going against the reserve banks recommendations to keep interest rates on hold.... look at the public back lash this is generating.

The Banks didn't make themselves like this ..... they got it ( the money ) from the people ...

I doubt the families who have ' struggled ' to meet their obligations ... and then have the banks rip their efforts from underneath them by forcing a ' foreclosure ' would give any ' praise ' at all.

I've seen banks neglect their ' duty of care ' in helping their client to keep their 'assets ' by way of negotiation ... they have just shut the door in their face.

BTW ....CB announced tonight on TV ... 1.6 Billion profit .. for the latest quarter..... yet they ' jacked ' up rates recently.

I had to laugh when ANZ said they are going to axe 1000 jobs from their staff pool..... I wonder what the ex staff will think of that.
Less Staff ... smaller payroll bill ....MORE PROFIT.... less customer service..... and more STRESS on the remaining staff ( tellers ) to ' flog ' their products to the customers at the counter.

I know this for a fact ... they do this to me every-time I go to the counter .... have even tried to convince me to change my mortgage over to them.

I'm convinced a day of reckoning is coming for these banks .... people will leave them in droves.

I not against Banks making a profit ( that's business ) .... but it is unforgivable to cause ' hardship ' in the name of profit making.

Nothing ignorant or uninformed about this ...!!!1

Flash.

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by cventer

Our strong financial institutions are a big reason our country avoided the GFC and financial melt downs occurring all over the world.

Weren't Westpac & St George bailed out by Australian tax payers a couple of years ago when all their bad US investments went South? That's the only two I've heard of.

[OICURMT]

Originally Posted by cventer

Our strong financial institutions are a big reason our country avoided the GFC and financial melt downs occurring all over the world.

I seriously have to think this statement over... and would appreciate data to support your claim.

OIC!

[brian nordstrom (As avatar)]

I hear you Flash , I have been with the same bank for 35 years , way back before it was what it calls its self today ,
I have never had a credit card , eftpos card , loan , or any thing , my wages go in and I do a one of $250 withdrawl in person every thursday lunch time for my spending money for the week , all my bills are direct debt, no fees , and they hate that !!! .
Those credit card/ insurance things they post on a regular basis are straight in the recycle bin .
If I want anything I save for it , and like the DOGS they are , DONT encourage them!!!!
Brian.

Originally Posted by FlashDrive

Banks want nothing more but to ' enslave ' you into long term debt ... send you applications in the mail for more ' credit cards ' ... try and sell you ' their ' life insurance ... and so on and so on.

They are like a pack of ' wild dogs ' ( most of them ) seeking whom they can devour .. they will tell you how you need them and how they can help you ..... but in reality ...if your not careful ... you slide into an ever increasing hole of debt.

I heard this one day and have never forgotten it :... if you have dug yourself into a financial hole .... then STOP DIGGING.

Do what ever you can to get out of it ... and STAY OUT.

Having a mortgage is necessary and bad enough to handle...!!!
Going to work and having to hand over your ' hard earned cash ' to finance companies EVERY PAYDAY .... is no way to live at all..... you only turn into a slave for them.

Sadly ... some of us who have a ' beer ' income ... cripple ourselves with ' champagne ' taste .. and buy beyond our means.

Be the ' MASTER ' of your own finances ....it's your money ... !!!!

Flash

[brian nordstrom (As avatar)]

Yes they did , and now they make 4 billion profit PA , there is something seriously wrong with our system , not just here , but its world wide .
Look at whats going on in Greece , Syria , Spain , France the USA and lots more countries world wide , people have had enough!!! of the greed of these a$$h0les .
Bring it on I say.
I was earning more money 15 years ago when the cost of living was 1/4 of what is is today , Thats WRONG !!! I feel for my children and grand children what sort of life are they going to have?.
Brian.

Originally Posted by multiweb

Weren't Westpac & St George bailed out by Australian tax payers a couple of years ago when all their bad US investments went South? That's the only two I've heard of.

[cventer]

And now the armchair economists all come out of hiding.

There were two periods during the crisis when our credit rating was on negative watch related to these loans from USA. This was a dangerous time for our financial stability.

If Australia dropped out of the AA status, then the cost of funds and our access to funds internationally would have been severely altered.

This in turn impacts banks ability ability to support the economy. ie staying open for business and being predictable for customers

If AA status is lost banks would freeze balance sheet growth. this means they now cant lend money to businesses and customers. This slows economic growth and you end up in a recession downward cycle.

You may argue you do not want excessive profits form your banking system, it is good for everyone to have a strong banking system that supports economic growth which means businesses can still get loans, households can still safely deposit money and get loans to buy houses, and debit and credit cards still work.

People see banks lift rates while reserve bank does not. What you dont understand is that banks get the money they lend people from 2 main sources. 1. Deposits from public and business. 2. Wholesale money markets.

Deposits are down right now and cost of deposits ie interst Banks are paying to attract deposits is higher than its been for a while.

This means a very large portion of the money they lend the public is from the wholesale market. ie oversease. Unless you have been asleep you might have noticed whats happening to european and american banking system. The cost of wholesale funds have increased significantly while reserve reccomended bank margins have stayed the same. This impacts margins and bank profitability. (If we were not AA rated then this cost of funding would be even higher to reflect the greater risk meaning even lower margins). So eventualy banks need to react. If they had reacted sooner then you would not see 1000's of jobs being shed across financial institutions. In fact the banks should have actualy raised interest rates by 10 - 15 basis points instead of the 6 - 10 they did. I would not rule out another rise.

Sure banks make a lot of money. But not relative to their cost/asset base. The total assets base of our big four banks is $1,170 billion. Most Banks are only makign around 1-1.5% actual profit. Fact that 1.5% is off a Billion dollar cost base is often ignored.

The profit performance of our major banks is equivalent to earning $1.40 profit return on $100 in assets. If banks earn $6.40 worth of income from the $100 worth of assets, they pay out $5 in expenses before delivering the $1.40 in profit.

You want to see a real crooks then look at our Celestron agents in Australia. Not to mention our own government who are very quiet about the fact that since they guaranteed deposits they have earned well over $3.1 Billion in fees from the Banks.

Banks pay over $5 billion year in Australian company tax - more than any other industry - which helps provide schools, hospitals, roads and social security benefits. This amounts to 17 percent of the total amount of company tax paid in Australia.More than $400 million is paid in state and local government taxes, rates and levies.

Over $8million Australians own Bank Shares. The Banks owe it to these $8m to make profits. By law, Banking directors are required to give primary concern to the interests of the company (shareholders) above all others, including their own personal interest. Of the 50 most profitable companies on the ASX, only two are banks.

So this leads me to the job cuts. Despite what you think Banks dont fire people for fun. At the same time being responsible to shareholders mean you are not a charity either. if roles are not needed then you can only hold these for so long before it does not make good business sense to do so. This downsizing is related to 2 main things.

1. Economic slowdown means there are less deposits, less investments, less mortgages. This translates into less calls to call centers, less people needed back office to process loans, open accounts, answer enquiries etc....

2. Technology. Advances in technology and systems mean you can do more with less people. Workflow and automation systems, mobile banking, the internet etc.. means self service allows people to do things themsleves you used to need back office banking staff to do.


So there you have it. Well done if you bothered to read all of this. And no doubt this will inspire the analytics that lurk in all of us to pull it apart. Just saying there are 2 sides to every story.

[FlashDrive (Poppy)]

Just had a phone call from my daughter Rebbecca ... she recently returned from London after teaching in one of the High Schools.

She just scored a permanent job at a ' Private ' High School at the Northern end of the Gold Coast .... now get this :

The banks won't lend her $25K to purchase a new car because her Husband who is also a teacher .. hasn't found himself a job yet.... he's looking for a teaching job also.

Rebbecca is on a pretty good 'wicket' pay wise ( private school ) ... yet they would gladly give her a loan of $400K to purchase a house.... but not the car....????????????????.

How ' bent ' is that .... let's nail this young lady down with a debt she does not even want ... !!!

The Banks are so out of touch today.

BTW .... she walked away shaking her head .. ( her words )

Flash

[brian nordstrom (As avatar)]

Who cares , it IS NOT there MONEY ! and all the do is speculate with it anyway , to squeeze every last drop of profit out of something that aint there's to begin with in the first place !!!! At our expence now we as a people are at their mercy as Flash said , AA ratings is a smoke screen , like the burble Politicion's speel ( smoke screens, mate).. Some of us have a memory , there, Ceventer.
I work hard for my money and resent greed using it for their own gains and give me some crumbs eg 1.4% ?.. I still remember my last pay packet that held MY MONEY!!! before we were forced to have it direct deposited , that was not my call ,it was forced on us by greedy bankers , so bugger them!!.. Down hill since then.
Brian.

Originally Posted by cventer

And now the armchair economists all come out of hiding.

There were two periods during the crisis when our credit rating was on negative watch related to these loans from USA. This was a dangerous time for our financial stability.

If Australia dropped out of the AA status, then the cost of funds and our access to funds internationally would have been severely altered.

This in turn impacts banks ability ability to support the economy. ie staying open for business and being predictable for customers

If AA status is lost banks would freeze balance sheet growth. this means they now cant lend money to businesses and customers. This slows economic growth and you end up in a recession downward cycle.

You may argue you do not want excessive procfits form your banking system, it is good for everyone to have a strong banking system that supports economic growth which means businesses can still get loans, households can still safely deposit money and get loans to buy houses, and debit and credit cards still work.

People see banks lift rates while reserve bank does not. What you dont understand is that banks get the money they lend people from 2 main sources. 1. Deposits from public and business. 2. Wholesale money markets.

Deposits are down right now and cost of deposits ie interst Banks are paying to attract deposits is higher than its been for a while.

This means a very large portion of the money they lend the public is from the wholesale market. ie oversease. Unless you have been asleep you might have noticed whats happening to european and american banking system. The cost of wholesale funds have increased significantly while reserve reccomended bank margins have stayed the same. This impacts margins and bank profitability. So eventualy banks need to react. If they had reacted sooner then you would not see 1000's of jobs being shed across financial institutions. In fact the banks shoudl have actualy raised interest rates by 10 - 15 babis points instead of the 6 - 10 they did. I would not rule out another rise.

Sure banks make a lot of money. But not relative to their cost/asset base. The total assets base of our big four banks is $1,170 billion. Most Banks are only makign around 1-1.5% actual profit. Fact that 1.5% is off a Billion dollar cost base is often ignored.

The profit performance of our major banks is equivalent to earning $1.40 profit return on $100 in assets. If banks earn $6.40 worth of income from the $100 worth of assets, they pay out $5 in expenses before delivering the $1.40 in profit.

You want to see a real crooks then look at our Celestron agents in Australia.

Banks pay over $5 billion year in Australian company tax - more than any other industry - which helps provide schools, hospitals, roads and social security benefits. This amounts to 17 percent of the total amount of company tax paid in Australia.More than $400 million is paid in state and local government taxes, rates and levies.

Over $8million Australians own Bank Shares. The Banks owe it to these $8m to make profits. By law, Banking directors are required to give primary concern to the interests of the company (shareholders) above all others, including their own personal interest. Of the 50 most profitable companies on the ASX, only two are banks.

So this leads me to the job cuts. Despite what you think Banks dont fire people for fun. At the same time being responsible to shareholders mean you are not a charity either. if roles are not needed then you can only hold these for so long before it does not make good business sense to do so. This downsizing is related to 2 main things.

1. Economic slowdown means there are less deposits, less investments, less mortgagese. This translates into less calls to call centers, less people needed back office to process loans etc....

2. Technology. Advances in technology and systems mean you can do more with less people. Workflow and automation systems, mobile banking, the internet etc.. means self service allows people to do things themsleves you used to need back office bankign staff to do.


So there you have it. Well done if you bothered to read all of this. An no doubt this will inspire the analytics that lurk in all of us to pull it apart. Just saying there are 2 sides to every story.