Making/upgrading a website

[Blue Skies (Jacquie)]

Hello all, hope this is appropriate to this forum...

I'm wanting to upgrade my website but I'm looking for something to do it with. I used the old Netscape page maker when I first put things together and it was pretty basic html stuff. I don't really want to have to splash out on Dreamweaver ($800 ) I'm currently playing with a freeware program WebDwarf but I feel there must be more I can do.

I've looked at using a CMS like Wordpress or Silverstripe but I've found that my current ISP doesn't support MySQL databases (well, not at my cheap subdomain level that I hoped to keep). So I feel like I'm going around in circles here at the moment.

What do other people here use to make and maintain their websites?

[renormalised (Carl)]

Well, I do have Dreamweaver and a few others but one of my favourites is EVRsoft's 1st Page.... http://www.evrsoft.com/

Here's a couple more reasonably good ones....

http://www.coffeecup.com/

http://www.trellian.com/webpage/

and if you want one just as powerful as Dreamweaver, go here....

http://www.netobjects.com/html/essentials.html

[Blue Skies (Jacquie)]

Thanks for the links. I tried Coffeecup but didn't like it. I'm not adverse to paying some money for a good program, but the amount for a new copy of Dreamweaver was just a bit much!

[sheeny (Al)]

Originally Posted by Blue Skies

What do other people here use to make and maintain their websites?

I used to do all mine in Notepad because I didn't like a lot of what I tried. I persevered for a while with Adobe Pagemill, and my most recent attempts have been with MS Frontpage... but I've been very slack with my web page since I've been on IIS!

Al.

[Ian Robinson]

Just do in it MS Word.

Had one for while, more bother than it was worth.

[renormalised (Carl)]

Originally Posted by Blue Skies

Thanks for the links. I tried Coffeecup but didn't like it. I'm not adverse to paying some money for a good program, but the amount for a new copy of Dreamweaver was just a bit much!

You can pickup the latest version of Netobjects Fusion for about $200-$250.

It all really depends on your skill level. If you've done a fair bit of scripting and such in the past and know HTML/CSS/XML and such, you can get by using a text based editor. Or if you like working with graphics and such and don't want to get your hands too dirty, you can use a WYSIWYG editor. Or you can get a hybrid of both.

[Solanum]

I use Quanta+, which is great (though not quite WYSIWG). It's Linux software, but I know that some kde stuff is ported to Windows, so you might be able to get it. It's open source, so totally free, no nagging and no trying to push you towards 'partner' software.

[Solanum]

Sorry, doesn't look like there is a windows port: http://quanta.kdewebdev.org/

If you've got access to an OSX apple it will almost certainly be available though.

[rogerg (Roger)]

I'll throw my 2c worth in, for what it's worth

For www.astrophotography.com.au I use MS Frontpage 97 together with notepad, Interdev, and photshop for the graphics. So all done very much "the old way" using basic HTML etc and technology from 5+ years ago. It works so I keep doing it that way.

For www.rogergroom.com I use a Content Management System the company I work for has developed and sells. It's quite unique and custom, and if I wasn't getting it free, not suitable for an amateur due to pricing (it's aimed at small to mid level businesses, and is very well suited to that, but not to the average amateur astronomer who prefers to spend that kind of money on equipment).

For my other sites that are under construction they are custom Java/J2EE applications being developed in Eclipse for running on Websphere App Server. So no suitable suggestion from there either.

I don't have any easy solution. I haven't kept up to date with the free stuff out there, as using Frontpage and my own custom stuff has always worked for me.

Perhaps search for free CMS (Content Management System) options, I know there are a few constructed in PHP. Not that I'm typically a supporter of PHP. I'm not sure how good or worthwhile they are. It probably depends what level of sophistication you're after. If you're just wanting information displayed on pages, like your old site but more modern looking with more pages or whatever, programs like Frontpage are fine. But if you're wanting blog with ability for users to submit comments, and other "web 2" type features then you'll need something more advanced like the CMS offerings.

If you stick with your current provider (who I don't think provides support for PHP) you will be quite limited in what you can run, possibly to the extent of it having to be plain HTML, Javascript & images, in which case Frontpage or other similar "straight forward page editor" is probably what you're after. I'd just go with MS Frontpage.

If you get a new domain with new hosting on a new provider, you might find they can setup an account with some kind of CMS pre-configured. For example see hosting plans on GoDaddy where they include bloggs, MySQL support and other things by way of intalling for you Community Server 2.0.

Roger.

[iceman (Mike)]

What type of site do you want? googlepages do free hosting and free websites if you just want to display your images.

Or perhaps a free blog site on wordpress or the many other blog sites. They let you have a gallery amongst other things.

Building and maintaining your own website is a lot of work unless you a real passion for it.

[DaveO (David)]

Jacquie

As Mike has said, first step is to define what you want to achieve. Tools come second. If you are not careful, you end up with a solution looking for a problem! Write your requirements down (or even post them here), and then you have something against which to assess the tools.

There are plenty of great hosting firms, and if yours doesn't support MySQL/PHP, don't be afraid to change. You might be surprised how cheaply you can get hosting. FlexiHostings.net.au have some great deals (they even provide free hosting for NFP organisations).

I am in the (long) process of completely redeveloping the AAQ website using Joomla!, which is a CMS. But it needs PHP/MySQL, and my be overkill.

Hope that this has helped.

[Kirkus (Kirk)]

Echoing what Mike and David just said, it depends a lot on what you want to do. If you want a place to display photos there are several nice sites out there that will allow you to do so inexpensively, or even free. Pbase and Webshots comes to mind. If you're looking for something a little more rounded (photos, text, etc.) then my first goal would be to find a web host that will offer you php/mysql. Just remember, you get what you pay for, so don't expect to get a great web host without paying a little money.

The CMSs (Joomla, for instance) are great, once you get passed the learning curve. I used Joomla for quite a while on one of my commercial sites and it was superb... once I learned how to use it. I only moved away from it when I switched forum software.

As mentioned earlier, creating and maintaining a website completely from scratch and on your own can be a real undertaking. I'd be tempted to decide what I really want to offer my visitors, then find a site that's dedicated to kind of content. (i.e., Blog = Blogger.com, Photos = Pbase.com or Webshots.com ). Maybe get your feet wet that way first.

[RB (Andrew)]

Originally Posted by rogerg

For www.astrophotogrpahy.com.au I use MS Frontpage 97 ...... It works so I keep doing it that way.

LOL Roger, no it doesn't, you've spelt the URL wrong.

I use Frontpage, like Roger, I only want a very basic site so it suites me and it came with "Office 2000-and something".
I'm still working on it too, only adding a page at a time for now so it's quite basic.

[rogerg (Roger)]

Originally Posted by RB

LOL Roger, no it doesn't, you've spelt the URL wrong.

Added security... give people the false URL so less hackers find it

[Blue Skies (Jacquie)]

Thanks again for the replies, there is certainly a lot to think about. Roger, thanks for replying again even though I've already tried to pick your brains in person!

This is what I would like to do:
1. Keep and update old pages on constellation starlore
2. Present some pages on astro activities I do eg ATM stuff, maybe a little astrophotography
3. highlight things/places/events in Western Australia
4. Start a blog
5. Maybe start a new project idea presenting themed info, if I get through the above!

The more I think about it the better the idea of a blog becomes, because it could encompass 2. and 3. nicely but the starlore pages really need their own domain space. So would the project in 5. I was hoping to keep most of it together but if two new domains and a blog are the way to go I'll try that. I'm not that interested in having comments enabled on the blog (I'm happy just to be talking to myself ) The blog would be a once a week thing, definitely not every day. I am amazed at those people who do blog every day, and how much they have to say!

Blog stuff: I've already had a look at free CMS's on the go from here http://www.opensourcecms.com/ and I saw Joomla! on there but I was shown Silverstripe as a demo from the person who put me on to the site and I thought I'd give it a go as it looked pretty simple but ran into a coding problem trying to get it to run that I couldn't understand how to get around even though I looked at the FAQs and help forums. Anyway, the long shot from this is that while my current ISP provided php it doesn't provide a MySQL database unless I'm paying big bucks for a business site, so I can't run other easier CMS's like Wordpress.

So from what the rest of you have said I really need to look elsewhere for a domain host, one that will also offer MySQL as well as php.

Any further comments following on from this from you helpful folk?

[DaveO (David)]

Jacquie

When looking at hosting companies, check whether they provide cPanel & Fantasico - they allow you to control your site, and also provide out of the box installs for many free packages, including blogs, galleries and CMS systems like Joomla! etc. That way you only need one domain that contains everything. Try http://www.flexihostings.net.au/ - for $4.50 /mth you can get all that plus a domain name. There will be other options similar, but I have used they guys and am happy. Will leave it to others to recommend their favourite hosting vendor.

[DJDD]

Originally Posted by DaveO

Jacquie

When looking at hosting companies, check whether they provide cPanel & Fantasico - they allow you to control your site, and also provide out of the box installs for many free packages, including blogs, galleries and CMS systems like Joomla! etc.

It can be problematic, with possible loss of data, when you install then upgrade software using Fantastico. Not saying it is impossible just a little risky at times. In fact, most members of CMS forums suggest not using Fantastico at all but rather full installs, which are often fairly straightforward.

I have used Joomla and it is pretty good.

YKMV. <-- gone metric.

cheers,
adrian

[Blue Skies (Jacquie)]

I had a look at Flexihostings last night and seems a good deal.

One question though, for those who already use them - do I need an existing domain name or can I register a new one with them when I sign up? It wasn't clear to me when I looked.

[DaveO (David)]

Jacquie, either applies, although it has to be a full domain (not a sub-domain).

[rogerg (Roger)]

Just to explain the lingo in case ...

Full domain is: www.rogergroom.com

Sub domain is: example.rogergroom.com

(where "example" is some text).

Another example of a sub-domain is rog1.iinet.net.au

Roger.