A billion degrees - is HOT

DobDobDob (Ron) · #1 28-03-2007, 08:42 PM

The temperatures attained by a detonating white dwarf star makes the 10,000-degree surface of the sun seem like a cold winter day in Chicago by comparison. “In nuclear explosions, you deal with temperatures on the order of a billion degrees,” Full story:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/03/070327124048.htm

Astroman (Andrew Wall) · #2 28-03-2007, 09:16 PM

Brrrrrrrrrr!!!!

DobDobDob (Ron) · #3 28-03-2007, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Astroman

Brrrrrrrrrr!!!!

You should have said, "La Brrrrrrrrrr!!!!"

xelasnave · #4 28-03-2007, 11:46 PM

Why would they explode this way how interesting? They will be spining fast the material at the equator spinning the fastest and would think that be where she would rip. Like planetary neb how they must have blown apart to form that patten how it suggest splitting like a wall nut. But the bubble as it tries to get to the surface must heat it so the heat can move that way. Thanks Ron that was so interesting that gives me a lot to think about.
alex

xelasnave · #5 28-03-2007, 11:52 PM

It is absolutely hot and yet the hotest wants to get out to the absolute coldest.
If the xplosion happens this way the bulk of material must be blow awy from where it came to the surface
alex

DobDobDob (Ron) · #6 29-03-2007, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xelasnave

It is absolutely hot and yet the hotest wants to get out to the absolute coldest.
If the xplosion happens this way the bulk of material must be blow awy from where it came to the surface
alex

I think that when humans think of hot that we miss what is really going on, because hot to us is only a temperature thing. I believe it's better to think of 'Hot' in terms of speed, how agitated the particles are.

Given this, as things (electrons) speed up, they get hotter, thus the faster the speed the hotter. So given the speed limits imposed by our physics, there is an absolute top limit to the speed that can be reached (or temperature if you like).

This does not account for the ignition mechanism, it is just my farthing's worth so that it is easier to understand the theoretical aspects of this natural phenomena.

xelasnave · #7 29-03-2007, 03:20 PM

Yes Ron would you care to speculate exactly which "bits" are going faster for the girls and boys at home.
I for one am very interested in what you have brought to the table so lets share it around ...I want to learn something.
alex

xelasnave · #8 29-03-2007, 03:31 PM

mmm in the pushing Universe it has to be pushed to the surface or they wont have it... and like temp being almost a misrepresentation of what is really going on ....using the word bubble may give the old human grey matter a little different view as to what they may think is going on.. I could build pictures of a watermellon busting from that one. So it seems a case of matter within moving more rapidly in a given area, opps a 2d imagery in a 3d application (or 4?) lets say region, than within the rest of the object, hence the perhaps misleading illusion of bubble being suggested, and once this matter starts moving it moves to one end, presumably as this escape route offers less resistence ... to escape... but blasting all to bits in the escape attempt..er escape finally is right cause the result could not be called a mere attempt.
So what bits are moving so fast and why do they want to escape...I wonder are they being pushed..just kidding I think

.
alex

DobDobDob (Ron) · #9 29-03-2007, 04:51 PM

The electron (see my post below) speed up. The electron is an elementary particle with a unit electrical charge and a mass 1/1837 of the proton. Electrons surround the atom's positively charged nucleus and determine the atom's chemical properties.

As I understand it (going back 8 years now), that the energy level (we used to call them shells), consisted of electrons, and the speed with which these electrons moved (they called it agitation then), determined how 'Hot' it got.

So Electrons are the 'bits' that move

(I suppose)...

xelasnave · #10 29-03-2007, 05:05 PM

Thanks Ron any idea how fast an electron travels in first gear (low temp) and how fast it speeds up to when it is in overdrive (hot temp)
I hope you are not trying to kid me with the think once a day thing.
When I think about this stuff I wonder how fast the electrons in my brain are travelling...does one think faster when hot headed for example..
So if you can help how fast is the absolute cold and how fast is the absolute hot and a fair speed that the "bIts"TRAVELL AT.
ALEX

DobDobDob (Ron) · #11 29-03-2007, 05:12 PM

Well the slowest is easy, that is absolute zero Kelvin. The hottest is a matter of speculation, if you believe that a particle can move faster than the speed of light, then the answer is (very fast)

, if the answer is no, it cannot move faster than the speed of light, then the hottest temp would be that attained when the electrons are travelling at or very close to the speed of light

This is simple stuff Alex, why are you having such a struggle with it

xelasnave · #12 29-03-2007, 05:43 PM

I dont know really I had no trouble with chemistry in fifth class but the "atomic side" did not enter my thinking really. I was just a kid with some high school books ... and certainly when at that time I ïnvented "the electric motor" because of ignorance that they were already here.. Such a simple mistake coming from such a simple understanding of the world that I did not realise they were already on this planet left my feeling stupid and gave me a view of myself I did not know much at all,. I could not then see how everything in the Universe worked nor did I enquire past the areas of my childhood interests which became high school routine... but then Sputnik had not been put up either.. and so it was that I was not noticed or was noticed and the system became suspicious of my attention to detail and a propensity to ask questions that could not be answered so I could offer an answer for consideration... and then somehow getting through high school, learning no more than the original books they showed me, I turned to studying the laws of men not the laws of nature leaving me today wondering when I read anything at all on any matter ...whose laws are being written and obeyed here?? and I find that often the laws said to be those of nature are still indeed the laws of man..somehow in his eagerness to explain something and support a favoured direction somehow missing the orginal point he sought to resolve.... so it is that observation I feel takes me closest to answering your question... and yes I do really struggle with some things but why I dont know.. I guess some stuff if it sounds "funny" I become suspicious and feel learning about it other than to know what is being said is a waste of time... but you have a clear head and your thought I find helpful.
alex
alex

DobDobDob (Ron) · #13 29-03-2007, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xelasnave

... but you have a clear head

alex

By clear do you mean 'empty'

xelasnave · #14 29-03-2007, 06:17 PM

Certainly not Ron empty is one of those words that implies a condition humans "feel" exists so seeking to describe it they invent the word..empty needs to have something that was there and then removed a condition a human could not survive let alone survive with dignity. Further empty is a close associate of nothing and I say there is no part of the Universe or outside of it which can not be..that exists to answer the descrption..nothing. At the risk of using a double negative
..there is no nothing.
I could go deeper but I have other matters that will take my personal time most of tonight but it is interesting and will help someone so in that context is useful.
How could I not respect a man who can change from a man to a dog with such ease where I come from they would proclaim you a God and put you on a chain and hold you in the dog state of existence.
alex

DobDobDob (Ron) · #15 29-03-2007, 06:21 PM

Thank you, I smiled when I read your post, you have enriched my day, what can compare with that?

xelasnave · #16 29-03-2007, 06:32 PM

Hard cash in the hand sufficient to pay for your next immediate desire.
Have a good one
alex

xelasnave · #17 29-03-2007, 10:23 PM

The blast will appear on the end closest to the other body I suspect blowing the material away for the most part from the other object. The blast will point to a spot a little behind the other body (where it was in orbit moments before the blast. I am not going to offer the reasons why. But if you think pushing it will be very clear but as no one but me sees the Universe that way you can appreciate why I tire of explaining specific sequences. The last explaination of the unaccounted energy surrounding the Sun will be explained by other who "know" so I will leave it at that..
I have not looked up the data but thats what I predict as it is so very clear the sequence of events that can not happen any other way.
I am tired as I have just finished my Universe and content that it is working the way I expected. Having discharged my duty on gravity rain elsewhere I now plan to rest for I am at peace as they say I have told what I see and if they want others can look I doubt they will but my duty is done.
alex

DobDobDob (Ron) · #18 29-03-2007, 10:32 PM

You wrote three paragraphs, somewhere amidst it all, there is something resembling a meaningful idea, the job of most sane persons is to try and decode what it is exactly that you meant.

Put another way, what you write and what you mean are poles apart, thus not only do you present an interesting point to challenge ones ideas, but you hide it and make it almost impossible to find. Cryptic logic at it's best

xelasnave · #19 30-03-2007, 08:27 AM

I developed the style from reading the Bible and leave it for others to think they have it worked out and let them build upon the little input of tangible evidence made.. however this method simply lets people read into a text anything they want..
They can therefore put me in whatever box tthey wish this then leaves them feeling comfortable and superior and take or reject any proposition that does not suit.
One can only do it the way one suspects may in time win more minds than the approach will lose. I would like to think I eliminate all who will judge a book by its cover, all who want the bottom line and nothing else, all who tire on long expression, all who tire if grammar and spelling are loose, all who think popular ideas are the correct ideas.
So the logic I employ is simply the more difficult you make something for someone to own is a sure way to have them want it and make them pay a very high price to take it home.. otherwise they can simply look upon it and wonder if it works as well as the producer has suggested.
I like your play on poles apart considering the item of review and like better that when you use the word impossible you qualify it with the only adjective that it deserves..almost... make sure you always qualify it so.
alex

DobDobDob (Ron) · #20 30-03-2007, 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xelasnave

I would like to think I eliminate all who will judge a book by its cover, all who want the bottom line and nothing else, all who tire on long expression, all who tire if grammar and spelling are loose, all who think popular ideas are the correct ideas.

I guess that just leaves me to read your stuff