My First Telescope... What to get?

Nils (Nils) · #1 31-10-2015, 10:21 AM

Greetings all,

I've been living in Burketown (far NW QLD) for the last 18 months or so and the night skies out here are nothing short of magnificent. There's very little light pollution and we don't get a much cloud for about 70% of the year. I've always been interested in astronomy, and have been toying with the idea of getting myself a telescope for some time. Christmas is approaching and I'm thinking this would be a good present to buy myself.

The catch: I don't really know what I should be looking for in such a scope, or what I should be paying.

A few points:

I'm going to need something I can get posted/trucked up here
In the absence of any kind of society in the area, I'm going to need something that I can learn to use myself (with a little help from internet forums/youtube and the like)
While there's not a huge amount of light in my backyard, I live in town and I would probably look to get something reasonably portable that I can put in the back of the car and take a few km down the road.
While the idea of astrophotography appeals to me, I'm not going to make that kind of commitment/investment just yet, so that capability (while nice) isn't necessary.
Under $500 would be nice, but I can stretch the budget (again, I'm not sure what a reasonable beginner setup should set me back).
Totally happy with 2nd hand (I've seen the classified forum here, but - again - don't really know what I should be looking for).

Any wisdom that you would care to impart would be massively appreciated. (Links to parts of the forum/other sites which you think make for good 'Stargazing for Dummies' resources are also totally appreciated.)

Thanks in advance,

Nils

Somnium (Aidan) · #2 31-10-2015, 08:20 PM

welcome to the boards !

it sounds like you are after the good old Dobsonian telescope. Pretty much the standard first telescope. get the biggest aperture you can afford. this telescope is easy to use, great for learning the sky and will show up more detail for visual observing than anything else in the price point.

dimithri86 (Dimithri) · #3 31-10-2015, 08:53 PM

Welcome Nils,

10 or 12 inches would be a good place to start looking. When I was looking for mine, I found quite a few between $150 and 500.

A nice 25mm or 30mm 2 inch eye piece, Should be good. Ive had good experience with Guan Sheng adjustable focus CAMERA projection lens http://www.andrewscom.com.au/optical-telescopes

MattT · #4 02-11-2015, 08:44 AM

Hi Nils,

With your dark sky I'd look at 10-12" Dob. 10" is a lot smaller than 12" on the portable front. Good idea not to mix astro photography with visual too.

Skywatcher make collapasable truss dobs that are very portable...I'd look for one of those. If your fit then go for as big as you can move around with relative ease.

Matt

Nils (Nils) · #5 02-11-2015, 03:43 PM

Hi all,

Thanks for the advice; it seems to be a resounding endorsement for something along the lines of a 10" dob.

Does anyone have experience with the Saxon scopes? I note that they are a little cheaper than a few of the other brands kicking around - but I also believe that a number of different brands come off the same production line. Is it worth shelling out the extra for a more premium brand, or will a Saxon do the business?

(I've noticed this one for sale, new, for $765 - which seems reasonable assuming I can't find a decent 2nd hand option - http://www.astropetes.com.au/telesco..._FullTube.html). I am leaning towards new simply because I am going to be purchasing online/sight unseen, and this gives me a bit more consumer protection than a 2nd hand option.

Now a couple of newbie questions about eyepieces:
Assuming whatever I purchase comes with the 25 & 10mm eyepieces, is it worth getting a 40mm as well? (I am interested in looking at deeper objects if I can).

Following that, to what degree are 1.25" Plossl's created equal? (i.e. if I had a Saxon scope, would a SkyWatcher 40mm eyepiece be compatible? Are there some brands that are just not worth spending $ on?)

Thanks again,
Nils

Atmos (Colin) · #6 02-11-2015, 04:09 PM

Saxon and Sky Watcher are identical, same production line

So much so that I believe that Sky Watcher actually owns Saxon but don't quote me on that hehe

knightrider · #7 02-11-2015, 06:15 PM

I believe it's Synta that owns both. It'd be nice if you could actually inspect the scopes before you bought, just to get the idea of size and weight. Consider the 8" dobsonian if the 10" is too cumbersome.

I can vouch for the collapsible tube too. The tube itself can be transported upright in the backseat of a car.

MattT · #8 05-11-2015, 02:27 PM

The best of the cheapest easily avavliable plossls I have used are Vixen NPL.
Get them from Myatsro shop. Scoll down the page.

http://www.myastroshop.com.au/products/vixen-ep.asp

Or if you want to spend more the best Plossl combo I have seen is Tele Vue 32 25 20 and 15 with a 2.5x powermate...covers low to high power without the usual poroblems of short focal length plossls....lack of eye relief.

The NPL's at those fl's are a cheaper but good alternative.

Do you wear glasses?

Matt

ab1963 (Andrew) · #9 05-11-2015, 09:09 PM

I have to second that Matt about the NPL's,I have the 25mm and was surprised how good this ep is,sharp,flat across the fov and no false colour,got it with a scope and will keep it,Liked it better than the tv plossls I had in similar fl's and sold

Nils (Nils) · #10 06-11-2015, 08:28 AM

Thanks for the tip Matt.

I don't wear glasses, although if the rest of my family is anything to go by I can expect the decline of my smugly superior 20/20 vision to fade in the coming years...

Am I correct in my assumption that the Vixen NPLs will slot compatibly in place of any other 1.25" plossl?

Cheers,

Nils

castor · #11 06-11-2015, 10:04 AM

If you are in a very dark-sky area, free of pollution and being in a low latitude zone you have access to a bigger chunk of the northern sky, the best value option is a 6'' Dobsonian.

Alternatively, an 80mm ED refractor as a second scope.

AstralTraveller (David) · #12 06-11-2015, 01:07 PM

Nils,

As someone who has to travel to observe, I can assure you it's a PITA. Of course your 5-10 min drive is better than my 45 minutes each way but packing up and unpacking the car will cost at least 30 minutes each way, probably more if you pack a thermos and snacks. Trust me, you will observe more often of you don't have to travel. If I was in your position I would look seriously at controlling the light in your yard and observe from there; I'm quite sure the sky overhead is quite dark once the local lighting is out of your eyes. If you can do that then scope portability become less of an issue and you can go for a bigger scope and/or a solid tube. A solid tube scope just being moved about the yard won't fall out of collimation too often so that also saves time.

If you do still want to travel at least do some preparatory work at home. I used to go out with my star atlas and red torch and just learn the naked-eye stars. That way my star hopping was much quicker when I was at a dark site. You can even set up the scope and practice finding object from home so you can quickly find them when you travel.

Don't believe anyone who says "x inches is big enough" - nothing is big enough!

I've never heard anyone say "this scope gathers too much light" (OK - except when observing the moon but there are filters for that). Get as much aperture as you can.

MattT · #13 06-11-2015, 01:31 PM

David is on the money size wise...

On the eyepiece front, all 1.25" eyepieces will fit. The vixen 30 25 20 and 15 with a 2.5x barlow and the only one I know for sure that is 2.5x is the expensive TV Powermate at $319 from Bintel...gulp. With help from an eyepiece calculator this is what I get in my 10" f4.8 Newt.

30mm 40x 100x
25mm 48x 120x
20mm 60x 150x
15mm 80x 200x

The first number is the magnification with just the eyepiece, the second is with a 2.5x powemate. No repeated mags and a good spread too, although you might want to go higher in which case....

GSO make a plossl that is also pretty good. A tiny bit behind the Vixens but not a lot in it. Andrews Communications sell them....check out the price

Great value and I used them for a number of years before going with wide fields.
Here is another alternative with GSO plossls (called Super Plossls...probably just the price that makes them super) and a 3x Barlow.

32mm 37x 120x
25mm 48x 144x
20mm 60x 180x
15mm 80x 240x
12mm 100x 300x

The GSO combo can be bought for $250 new. I added the 12mm in to get 100x and avoid jump from 80 to 120.

Look up Andrews http://www.andrewscom.com.au/optical-telescopes

I use this eyepiece calculator. Easy to see what you get out of all sorts of eyepieces.

http://www.davidpaulgreen.com/tec.html

Matt

Edit: There is this for sale, just add the 25mm. http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...d.php?t=139892

Visionary (David) · #14 07-11-2015, 01:41 AM

Nils, I am also a a Newbie, but I am a Newbie with a huge amount of gear, lol. In amoungst all my gear there is a real gem, a 5" Achro an f12 I think, the number had fallen off.
It's a real gem of a scope and it cost all of $50! If you get the chance to get your hands on a well priced Achromatic Scope then you may find yourself with a real gem on your hands.
You MUSTget the best mount you possibly can afford and try to make sure it's a GoTo. One more thing a really good Finder scope, go big the ORION 70mm is excellent and I think at f5.8 delivering and excellent broad sky and... a good red dot finder. Lens they sort of look after themselves.
My last suggestion maybe a little controversial but get at least one good Erect Prism 90* diagonal it makes the business of finding your way in the sky absolutely intuitive.

BJ (Jason) · #15 23-11-2015, 07:55 AM

My advice is try to keep your gear as light as possible. I went down the path of heavy equipment and although it's great once set up, the whole process of breaking down transporting and setting up then repeating once finished is a real onerous chore and over time I have found I just don't bother.
It is a good idea to have your main scope set up for when you are heading to dark skies for a length of time and also having a lesser set up for some easy casual observing - the best of both worlds so to speak.
Some great lightweight setups can be had on the classifieds for a very reasonable cost too.

ColHut (Colin) · #16 04-12-2015, 01:47 AM

Even a 10" scope can be a pain to move. An 8" F6 may be the go. More forgiving on eyepieces too. How much soace do you have in your car?

Bintel and Andews will have something reasonable.

Have fun

Regards

RAJAH235 · #17 04-12-2015, 04:25 AM

A 10" dob is really easy to move.....because it has 2 parts.
The tube & the base.
You don't have to move the telescope in one piece.

When I had my Meade 10" dob, (Got flooded here in 2011 & got a tad water logged), I used to set it up,
let it cool down & was viewing before everyone else had set up their 'scopes.

If you're really pushed for space in the car, or even if you're not... buy either the 10" or 12" collapsible dob.

You'll never look back, just wish that you had more $$ to buy an 18" one.....1st.

&, I'd suggest that you buy at least one eyepiece around 6mm to 9mm.
These may come in handy for those (very infrequent), really clear, calm, dry nights.

I hardly used my Meade 2 x Barlow, coz of the spread of Meade Series 4000 Super Plossl eyepieces I have.
Best of the bunch are the 12mm & not far behind, the 15mm & of course, the UWA 14mm, which is an absolute gem.

Whatever you decide, have fun.

ps. Did anyone suggest buying a Chandler brand, large variety, Planisphere & a red LED torch?

kittenshark (Cheryl-Ann Tan) · #18 04-12-2015, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by knightrider

I believe it's Synta that owns both. It'd be nice if you could actually inspect the scopes before you bought, just to get the idea of size and weight. Consider the 8" dobsonian if the 10" is too cumbersome.

I can vouch for the collapsible tube too. The tube itself can be transported upright in the backseat of a car.

Synta basically makes scopes for any supplier who wants one--so long as it's off patent.

If Orion or Skywatcher designs something patented for Synta to make, other brands would have to wait some years before they can ask them to make that particular product.

Some stuff doesn't even have a Saxon or Skywatcher brand on the equipment itself. For example, the EQ6 is exactly the same. The only difference is one small label on the shipping box. Thinks like the AZ-EQ5s and AZ-EQ6s are patented to Skywatcher only.

If you want more unique stuff and new models, Skywatcher or Orion will get first dibs. Saxon and others will have to wait.

So the collapsable tube from Skywatcher or Saxon is pretty much identical--Skywatcher makes theirs in glitter black (some people like it because it's pretty), and Saxon makes them in white. Saxon is a bit more consistent with their stock levels, but since Skywather has a better marketing program, it is often sold out at the supplier at times.

Most beginners are very happy with an 8". The footprint of the 6", 8", and 10" are pretty much identical though. They just use the same chipboard base for these sizes.

Either way, all these scopes are great beginner scopes and most people will grow in the hobby with them for quite some time.

kittenshark (Cheryl-Ann Tan) · #19 04-12-2015, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RAJAH235

A 10" dob is really easy to move.....because it has 2 parts.
The tube & the base.
You don't have to move the telescope in one piece.

When I had my Meade 10" dob, (Got flooded here in 2011 & got a tad water logged), I used to set it up,
let it cool down & was viewing before everyone else had set up their 'scopes.

If you're really pushed for space in the car, or even if you're not... buy either the 10" or 12" collapsible dob.

You'll never look back, just wish that you had more $$ to buy an 18" one.....1st.

&, I'd suggest that you buy at least one eyepiece around 6mm to 9mm.
These may come in handy for those (very infrequent), really clear, calm, dry nights.

I hardly used my Meade 2 x Barlow, coz of the spread of Meade Series 4000 Super Plossl eyepieces I have.
Best of the bunch are the 12mm & not far behind, the 15mm & of course, the UWA 14mm, which is an absolute gem.

Whatever you decide, have fun.

ps. Did anyone suggest buying a Chandler brand, large variety, Planisphere & a red LED torch?

Oh, the Meade Lightbridges are also a great option. They're a truss dob so they're very light. They come in a few more parts though.

They have a cooling fan too so that can be handy. The nicest part about them, IMO, is that they use proper bearings for the base so it's very smooth and I think they'll be more robust. The optics, I heard, are also superior to most other dobs.

The downside is that they are more expensive than the Skywatcher/Saxon/Orion dobs and you can only get 10", 12", and 16". (Why no 14" I have no idea.)

Meade has just come out with their LightBridge Mini series, which are basically cute little table dobs but I think you'd want something a lot bigger than that. I was hoping they'd come up with a 6" or 8" but oh well...

julianh72 (Julian) · #20 04-12-2015, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kittenshark

Meade has just come out with their LightBridge Mini series, which are basically cute little table dobs but I think you'd want something a lot bigger than that. I was hoping they'd come up with a 6" or 8" but oh well...

The LightBridge Minis (82 mm, 114 mm and 130 mm - see http://www.meade.com/products/telesc...idge-mini.html) would compete against the SkyWatcher Heritage 76 and P130 models (see http://www.skywatcher.com/products.php?cat=6 ). They are great beginner / kid's scopes, and super-portable, and the 130 mm models in particular should start to reveal some nice views, but be warned - you'll soon be lusting for more aperture! (But a 130 mm table-top Dob could still be a "keeper" as a portable grab'n'go scope, when your "big gun" is just not convenient.)