I have just started using a monochrome ccd camera and the files are saved as FITS format fies which I have tried tried in MaximDL and CCDstack (demo) for aligning and stacking and then combining - ok so far. Now the final image as a FITS file, if I then convert it to a TIFF it loses a lot of info as it looks quite different in CCDstack and if then opened in Photoshop, it looks dramatically worse. Images attached showing the screen capture of the FITS in CCDstack, then the TIFF, then the TIFF in photoshop, then the TIFF stretched in PS. (No Darks or Flats as yet). Can anyone suggest a different process for getting these successfully into PS somehow? Thx for any help
I don't have CCD stack. I have MaximDL and met a similar issue - exported TIFFs looked horrible in photoshop. I think it was the default stretching option. What I did was do a manual stretch from the "save as" screen, which ended up getting the same image into PS as I had stretched in MaximDL. Does that make sense?
Hi Peter. Before I started using PixInsight, I used to stack and calibrate in Maxim, then save the file as a Tiff for processing in PS. I ran into similar problems first. I found if I made sure I saved the Tiff as a 16 Bit Integer in Maxim, it would open fine in PS, and I didn't notice much loss of quality.
Now however I just load the FITS into PI, process there, and then again save as a 16 Bit Tiff for PS processing.
Thx Eric and Jon; I opened it in Maxim and saved it as TIFF 16bit integer and Manual. Initially did not seem to work but did some processing in Maxim and then tried again and presto, it looked normal in PS. Quick play attached. Now to get the Flats, etc. and get into this properly. Thx again
If you stack instead in DSS, you can save as either TIFF or FITS, with various setting (depth etc).
MaxIM is so NON-INTUITIVE. Does some things well, does most things awkwardly. I have had more FITS corruption and improper debayering in MaxIM than anything else, to the point of NOT using it for any processing at all beyond image capture.
That's great Peter, I'm glad it worked. Nice image!
Quote:
Originally Posted by LewisM
I have had more FITS corruption and improper debayering in MaxIM than anything else, to the point of NOT using it for any processing at all beyond image capture.
I agree Lewis, all I find Maxim good for is capturing and guiding.
I do not recommend to save stacked data with
16-Bit Integer format. This automatically creates data loss because
of rounding the 32-Bit small numbers down to only 16 Bit.
A stacked image needs to be saved in 32-Bit Floating Point
Format to ensure no data loss.
If you do all stacking and processing
with one Programm which allows full 32/64-Bit processing and
saving like for example PixInsight, you dont have to convert results
and do not get into the troubles of loosing faint details.
Never ever save stacked data in 16 Bit integer Format!
I don't use FITS files ( yet ! ) but FITSWORK will open, process and\or convert them very easily. It handles 250 meg TIF files no problem but pays to have some processing power as it holds each iteration of processing unless you close earlier image versions.
Free as well ...
I go from DSS on SONY ARW > FITSWORK > PixBuilder no problem
Hi Gerald; Your point is well taken but unfortunately Maxim DL and CCDStack do not give options of saving a TIFF in 32 Bit format to take to Photoshop (is there such a thing as 32 Bit TIFF and if so, is this possible in PixInsight)?
Also I have been wondering which software to use (I have Maxim and trying the demo version of CCDStack) and have seen several Pros discussed for PI but also some suggestion that it has a steep learning curve, is this correct? Do you avoid using Photoshop altogether (as you must import in TIFF not FITS format so at some stage converting to 16 Bit if you use Photoshop)? Pardon my ignorance and thx for your input.
Regards
Peter
Quote:
Originally Posted by mostschaedel
I do not recommend to save stacked data with
16-Bit Integer format. This automatically creates data loss because
of rounding the 32-Bit small numbers down to only 16 Bit.
A stacked image needs to be saved in 32-Bit Floating Point
Format to ensure no data loss.
If you do all stacking and processing
with one Programm which allows full 32/64-Bit processing and
saving like for example PixInsight, you dont have to convert results
and do not get into the troubles of loosing faint details.
Never ever save stacked data in 16 Bit integer Format!
Have you tried AstroArt V5????
I use it for aquision, (sometimes guiding) and processing for all my ATiK 16/16ic/314L, Lodestar, QHY5 cameras and DSLR's
Hi Peter!
Yes, Photoshop is not needed for Astro Image processing.
I handle the whole process from calibration, register,
stacking, Background neutralization, Gradient removal,
Color Calibration, LRGB Combine in linear mode in PixInsight,
than Stretch the masked Image, increase contrast, Stretch the
Saturation and also do the final tweaks including
automatic Annotation from the different vizier catalogues
with PixInsight. PS has not a single function for astrophoptography
and if it cannot Import 32 Bit files you already loose
important data in converting from 32 Bit-fits to 16 Bit TiFF.
You should remove any software which does not Support
32-point Floating Point from you Image processing process
because 16-Bit Format kills your faint Details in your
stacked Images.
I think the most steap learning curve is in Photoshop
if you want to use it properly. Most People only use
curves and Histogramm Stretch in PS - those who produce
excellent Images with photoshop have many years experience
with PS.
The big issue with PS is also that you are supported
to paint your Image in the way you think it should look like.
With dedicated programs like PI you process the data
and dont overpaint...
I have seen many top imagers using the paint functions
in PS.
Have you tried AstroArt V5????
I use it for aquision, (sometimes guiding) and processing for all my ATiK 16/16ic/314L, Lodestar, QHY5 cameras and DSLR's
Hi Ken!
Astroart is one of the tools i personally also can recommend because
it allows working in linear mode, allows 32 Bit and is an
astronomacal Image processing tool and not a painting tool.
It was growing over the years and Version 5 is very fine too.
It has one Advantage over PI it also has a perfect Image
exposure and collecting part built in, which is not
in PI included.
I personally prefer PI because ist growing faster with ist
astronomical Image processing Tools as it has an open Standard
and many users provide tools and scripts for free. For exposures i use
in my case the software given with the CCD Hardware.
In your case i would recommend Astroart in combination with PI, than
you have everything and dont need painting programs for Image processing.
I've been trying PI but I find the learning curve difficult and the processes not very intuitive. I must give it another go but my current process is yeilding good results with DSS 3.3.3 beta 51 as the starter and I understand the processes I am using so seems counter productive to reinvent the wheel so to speak.
Since when can Photoshop not handle 32 bit tiffs??????!!!!!! I use them all the time in Photoshop (and yes, you can completely avoid the HDR conversion by handling in Lightroom first, which PS then does NOT want to HDR convert).
DSS also exports as 32 bit rational or integer tiffs, so saying it does not is again wrong.
Pixinsight is good, but EXTREMELLY non-intuitive, with VERY little help regarding what each function does. Not as poor as MaxIM though.
I am not seeing the benefits of Pixinsight yet. Everything with few exceptions can be run through Photoshop, especially if you use the multitude of Photoshop plugins (like gradient removal, White Balancer, Green removal, star masking, DPP, etc). It's ALL there for Photoshop, you just have to look.
Personally, I find the Australian made Startools stand-alone software superior to Pixinsight (expecially intuitively and with help/documentation/instant drop down guidance), though Startools could do with a little updating. And it is also a quarter the cost of Pixinsight.
Thank you all for your input. Pardon my ignorance Lewis about 32 Bit TIFF in PS. However my problem started with processing monochrome images to create colour images and what I have used so far for monochrome does not seem to give the option of exporting anything more than 16 Bit files and so I am on the search for a better processing option. CCDStack, PI and now AstroArt have been suggested so I will try out demos of those I can get. A longer learning curve does not bother me too much as long as it serves my purpose long term. Thank you all again.
