Higher magnification eyepieces

syousef · #1 07-07-2012, 01:31 PM

I'm finally tired of looking through pinholes (6.3mm, 10mm plossl) for higher magnification eyepieces and am looking for a reasonably inexpensive (<$100) 4-7mm eyepiece and similar in 8-11mm. I'm just not prepared to lift weights in the dark or mortgage my house for an 80+ degree view. I am happy viewing both planets and deep sky. I would like something comfortable to be able to show frienda and family as well without them losing interest. I'm less interested in eye relief than in exit pupil and lack of blackouts.

Can anyone comment on these eyepieces?
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/wide-angl...item20c36a1577

Are they an Expanse/Knight Owl knock off? A different eyepiece? Or am I looking at pure junk here? The price is right if they're not going to be worse than my no-name plossl.

I could of course just buy the original $80 expanse from Bintel (if they have stock).

The other thing I was looking at based on what other people are saying are the TMB Planetarys so I've emailed Highpoint Scientific and Astronomics for shipping prices. But I worry about quality control because people mention having to take them apart to tighten them, and the reviews vary wildly as to how sharp these are. Also suppose to be notorious for blackouts?

Can anyone suggest anything else? As I said I've ruled out Naglers/Ethos, and probably even Radians. I saw the Andrews 5mm wide $149 dual 1.25/2" yesterday but reviews are mixed and it's just a little more than I want to pay (and I don't want to play balance the dob with counterweights in the dark).

Background:
Though I've been in this hobby over a decade and done an Astronomy degree "for fun" (ie with no intention of making it my career), I'd describe myself as a casual astronomer. I have a 10" f/5 GSO dob and an 8" f/6 York Optical dob, another 8" reflector on a mount that is quite simply garbage, Explorer as well as a couple of cheap refractors. But I will sometimes go months without pulling them out due to work and family commitments as well as other hobbies. I'm able to locate objects well enough, at least in the brighter constellations but frankly I'm still learning the night sky.

I am quite satisified with my inexpensive 2" and 1.25" plossyls ranging from 15mm (a wonderful wide angle 4 element plossyl - my favourite), through 25 and 26mm, 32mm, and 50mm. Some of these came with the scopes but they all give reasonable views. I also have an awful 2x camera barlow and a better 2x non-camera barlow. Even my 10mm Celestron? isn't bad, though the 6.3mm is pushing it. 6.3mm looks like the one below.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Celestron...item3cc86cb16a

Mrkex (Mark) · #2 07-07-2012, 04:49 PM

I had the same issue with my 6mm plossl, tiny hole. I bought an Explore scientific 6.7mm and found it easy to use. I find the wider angle good on high mag eyepieces, as the object stays in the eyepiece longer. Have a look at http://www.optcorp.com/ProductList.a...-718-1511-1512

Mark

pgc hunter · #3 07-07-2012, 06:29 PM

The BO/TMB planetary eyepieces are supposed to be pretty good. I haven't used them but that's what I've read. They pop up for sale on icetrade every now and again usually for around 50 bucks, infact a 6mm just sold last week.

dannat (Daniel) · #4 07-07-2012, 06:40 PM

Those ep's in the eBay Ad are the synta ultra wide long er or expanse, the 6 & 9 mm are pretty good for the money, the 15&20mm less so
They will be fine at f6 , bit of edge aberration at f5 but usually you have to pay a lot more to be nice & clean at f5

syousef · #5 07-07-2012, 08:12 PM

Went to Bintel today. Bought a 2 inch ED barlow and discussed my requirements with Don Whiteman who I have a lot of respect for. He directed me away from the Orion Expanse (he didn't think much of them) and towards the Orion Edge On Planetary, which I was able to take a look at. More coin and also not as wide, but good quality eyepieces from what I could tell in the shop. Not what I'm looking for, so I passed for now. If I did buy I'd be more tempted by the 9mm than the 5. They're suppose to have similar eye relief etc. but I just found the 9mm easier to look through against a bright light.

Put my name down to get a call when they get their next shipment of dobs. Their price is more competitive than it use to be. Last time it was a choice of spending a lot more or going with the GSO from Andrews. This time the 12" just $50 more than Andrews with more features. Not sure about the quality of the optics but mechanical quality looked good. My scopes are about 10 and 12 years old and it's getting time to think about resilvering the mirrors. I'd rather sell them and make that someone else's problem, and best to do so before they are in dire need.

So though I spent just $79 on a 2" ED 2x barlow it might be a more expensive trip than I'd planned on ;-)

syousef · #6 07-07-2012, 09:14 PM

After reading this review

http://www.iceinspace.com.au/42-286-0-0-1-0.html

I think I'm going to reluctantly stay away from the Ebay lenses.

First of all, the 6mm and 9mm are barlowed...I'm guessing 2x...anyway I don't think I'd trade the wide field and easier viewing for internal reflections and distortions, and my current 10mm is usable as I said. With a barlow I get 5mm...or I could use the 6.3mm as is.

syousef · #7 07-07-2012, 09:35 PM

The eyepiece I looked at in Andrews yesterday looks like it might be the 5mm from the second group on this page:

http://www.barsta.com/show_hdr.php?x...PFOR71&xpos=10

I've never heard of Barsta eyepieces before.

MattT · #8 08-07-2012, 10:00 AM

As far as I know the Orion Planetary eyepieces are the same as the cheaper long eye relief (LER)ones. Long Pern have the same eyepiece too at Andrews. I have the LER Orion in 6 and 12.5mm and they are very nice, plossl FOV but lots of eye relief easy to look through or better still the ES 82 deg series at $99 on sale are fab but the postage is a bit of a downer.
Matt

pgc hunter · #9 08-07-2012, 11:28 AM

I'd also recommend avoiding Orion's Epic ED-2 eyepieces and Celestron's X-cel. General opinions on these seem to be unfavourable.

brian nordstrom (As avatar) · #10 08-07-2012, 11:43 AM

Hi Syousef , dont forget to have a look at Andrews Communations , their Long Perng planetry eyeyieces , I have the 3mm , for my short refractors and its an amazing eyepiece , large field , 20mm eye relief and very well made . And only $99 .
I cant see the rest , the 5mm to 18mm being any differant .

a nice eyepiece and if I did not have a set of Vixen LV's I would have the full set of these .
Give them a look at as I am sure these are the same as WO planetary line up , LP makes lots of good gear for many suppliers

.
Brian.

doug mc · #11 08-07-2012, 05:11 PM

I have used the long perng planetarys 3mm&5mm they showed cromatic aberation on the moon, so i sold the 5. I have been using 4,5,and 6mm tmb planetarys for several months now. A recent buy was a 12mm smart astronomy solar system long eyerelief eyepiece. These eyepieces must be an update on the long perng le eyepieces. This eyepiece has no CA and has better internal light baffleing than the tmbs. In fact i got cleaner views on the moon using it with a 2x barlow than using the 6mm tmb on its own. I am now looking to replace my tmbs with more of the smart astronomy long eyerelief solar system eyepieces.

syousef · #12 08-07-2012, 11:47 PM

Ok I had quite a long observing session this morning and again tonight getting to know the 3 new lenses I bought - a 2x 2" ED Barlow from Bintel, a 32mm Superview camera projection eyepiece and 26mm 2" from Andrews. Very happy with all 3. Imaging anything but the moon is a lost cause through a dob of course but I do like taking the occasional picture of the moon and it's a nice to have. My pictures this morning were horrible though. Clouds broke a couple of times but it was well and truly morning, there was due on my equipment or I'd packed up or the moon had gotten to low to get a clear pic with the Dob. I'll have to try again another time.

Back to my point. I found my eyepiece for the time being. I double barlowed my 15mm GSO Superview (2" 2x Bintel ED, 2x good quality 1.25" barlow - unsure of brand). While the seeing was good, the views I got from the 15mm Superview were a lot better than some of the descriptions of the dedicated eyepieces I've read. I could see the Casini division to my suprise but no surface detail, and the view was a lot better than through my cheap 10mm plossyls. Viewing was much more comfortable too.

The dedicated eyepieces might be better. I wouldn't know without trying. But for a little while I can live with this setup for planetary and small object deep sky. I never thought for a second I'd be settling for a double barlow solution, but there you have it...

I even think my 3 year old managed to see Saturn through this setup. My wife liked the view enough to ask if I could image it, and I had to try through the 32mm projection and a DSLR, and also with a point and shoot held against the 15mm SV. I knew the results would be awful. (Not worth sharing pics).

Then I turned the 2" eyepieces on M6 and M7 as the dew and clouds rolled in. Not the best conditions but good enough to know I'm glad I now have a complete 2" set and that I'm happy with all 4 items (26, 35, 50 and 2x barlow).

syousef · #13 08-07-2012, 11:48 PM

Thank you to everyone who's commented so far. If there are any more comments still happy to read, but didn't want this thread to die without saying thanks for the info.

Ian Flowes · #14 09-07-2012, 01:19 PM

This is a crap ep.
Suggest you get a 6mm TMB Planetary, if your budget is tight.
They are frequently advertise for around $55 to $65 and they do perform well.

AstralTraveller (David) · #15 09-07-2012, 04:12 PM

If your after a good planetary eyepiece don't forget the good old orthoscopic. Probably more comfortable than an equivalent plossl, certainly less ghosting and with only 4 elements they have the potential to have better contrast. I love my University Optics 7mmHD. It has a tiny eye lens and short eye relief but it is still strangely comfortable to use (and doesn't kidney bean). It betters my 7.5mm Celestron 'silver top' plossl and my 9mm T6 Nagler. In my 15cm f/8 Synta refractor surface detail on Saturn is obvious. I couldn't be happier with it. I also have the 5mm but I find that nights when I can use the magnification are rare and the eye relief is perhaps too short - you tend to touch the glass. I generally try it then go back to the 7mm. I also have a Carl Zeiss Jena 10mm ortho and it is great despite only having basic coatings. It eats the 9mm Nagler for on axis brightness and contrast so I use it at times on smaller objects (eg many planetaries, small galaxies) but of course it can't give the immersive experience of the Nagler nor accommodate most DSOs.

Wavytone · #16 09-07-2012, 10:59 PM

http://www.cloudynights.com/item.php?item_id=1934

Confused you even more, right ?

As I said before, if you find an eyepiece that you like in your scope, use it.

There is no such thing as a one-model-is-best-for-everybody, there are too many other variables involved. Starting with what are your criteria for "good" ? And which is more important ?

Someone who's opinion might be relevant to you should be using a similar scope to yours, for a start - for example, I would not be paying much attention to the opinions of users of f/4.5 dobs when my main scope is an f/15 Mak - and ideally with similar observing habits as you.

Such rivetingly helpful comments such as "that is a crap ep" display a breathtaking lack of imagination both about this subject, and the english language.

mikemasey (Mike) · #17 12-07-2012, 09:38 PM

Hi all,
not so sure that this is the right place for this but it is to do with new EP's.
Get a good EP they all said, so I have a 12.5mm WO and its really really good.
I have been lent an 8mm TV. First use in my Lunt was fantastic(so I thought) then after a bit of trial and error I finaly got it going using my 8" Dob. Well how stuned was I, a lot I can tell you. All of Omegea Cent in the eye piece at once at such hi mag.
I know that not everyone likes the wide angle but the new 'Ethos'' 100' Ep is well named as a 'Space walk'.
Looks like I will be doing some overtime just to purchase one for myself.
I am not an expert or anything, just like to have a look around a bit and I cant wait for the next moon.
As already said earlier the choice of EP's is as big as space itself and somthing for everyone.
I know the TV's are expensive but hey I like it and will not be buying anything else for a while.

syousef · #18 18-07-2012, 11:58 PM

New circumstances plus a look at the bank account balance plus the existing performance of what I have means for the time being I'm sticking with 2x 2" GSO barlow + 2x 1.25" barlow (brand unknown) + 15mm GSO "superview". Also means I won't be upgrading to a 12" Dob for a while. In th medium to long term a planetary eyepiece (probably a TMB) and a new Dob are definitely what I want...we'll see if life allows.