Takahashi TSA 120 released late September

[anj026]

Takahashi have announced a new refractor model. The TSA 120 will be released in Japan later this month and the rest of the world later in the year. It will be f7.5, 900mm focal length, triplet apo. The weight will be approximately 70 -75% of the TOA130 and the cost also around 70 -75%. It is listed at 399,000 yen but I think that is the bare ota without clamshell. It looks similar to the TSA 102 with similar back focus arrangements.

http://www.takahashijapan.com/news.html

The website is Japanese naturally enough, at least there is a picture and some info. You can do a google translate.

I'm dreaming for now but you never know maybe one day.

[Hans Tucker (Hans)]

I some how find this announcement of a TSA-120 a bit of an anti-climax . Since Takahashi has been removing certain scopes from their product line (FS Series Refractors, CN-212 and BRC-250) there has been a lot of rumour about their possible replacement or on a new product line. The CCA-250P has me more excited and I was hoping that Takahashi would re-introduce a range of larger Epsilon scopes. Then there is still the rumour of the TOA/TSA-170.

[anj026]

It does seem like things move slowly in the new release department. I guess their biggest market is the domestic Japanese one. They have probably been forced to rationalise their range. I think there are issues of availabilty of the larger exotic glass blanks from their suppliers also.
I would expect the new TSA to be relatively popular. I am surprised they haven't come up with a TSA 80 to replace the old FS 78. On the other hand the 80mm market is already well catered for.

[Hans Tucker (Hans)]

Originally Posted by anj026

I am surprised they haven't come up with a TSA 80 to replace the old FS 78.

Well they sort have did if you count the FSQ-85 (Baby-Q).

I love Takahashi stuff and eagerly await any announcement of new products. My mount (NJP) and three of my four scopes (Mewlon 250S, FSQ-106ED and FS-78) are Takahashi. If I wasn't so stupid and not go for the rare collector approach which saw me purchase an APOMAX 130 I would have tried to get hold of a TOA-130, well this was all before the release of the TOA-150. Then I saw a rare TSC-225 ooohh this would have made a good addition to the collection.

Is it obscene or mental to have, or contemplate, so many scopes??

[anj026]

It is only human Hans. The temptation to add to the collection is always there. When you look at the cost of boats and European motorcycles, telescopes don't seem so expensive.

[casstony]

There's been a few new refractors mentioned on cloudynights recently including photo's of a skywatcher 110mm f/7 ED triplet
http://www.astronomy.com.cn/bbs/thread-117556-1-1.html

[gregbradley]

This should be an awesome scope.

The reviews I have read about the TSA102 are nothing short of amazing. This one is now listed by Anacortes at US$3900 I think.

Roland Christen of AstroPhysics has been touting the advantages of an FPL53 triplet for years. Tak has finally joined the club and will reap the benefits.

It'll be interesting to see if they persist with the TOA range and expand it or expand the TSA range. I predict the TSA range as they will be lighter and that means the possibility of larger telescopes on people's existing mounts. If you have to get a larger mount to get that larger refractor then that would stop a lot of people.

Greg.

[Hans Tucker (Hans)]

Originally Posted by gregbradley

This should be an awesome scope.


Roland Christen of AstroPhysics has been touting the advantages of an FPL53 triplet for years. Tak has finally joined the club and will reap the benefits.


Greg.

At what expense...their superb Fluorite line of FS refractors. Ever since they, Japanese, banned Fluorite Takahashi had no option but to go to FPL53 and material is only half the equation the other half is the critical figuring of the lens elements. Interesting that TEC is still using Fluorite..although at a cost to the buyer.

[gregbradley]

Originally Posted by Hans Tucker

At what expense...their superb Fluorite line of FS refractors. Ever since they, Japanese, banned Fluorite Takahashi had no option but to go to FPL53 and material is only half the equation the other half is the critical figuring of the lens elements. Interesting that TEC is still using Fluorite..although at a cost to the buyer.

Yes TEC gets their fluorite from Schott Glass in Germany. I have seen the blanks.

The main reason for the fluorite in TEC scopes is to get enable faster F ratios and retain superb colour correction. Although APM seems to be able to do that with FPL53 with their air spaced triplets from LZOS in Russia. Although there was a 200mm F8 TEC fluorite triplet (no longer made). Fluorite as you probably know also has far less scatter which AP will say makes no difference but Yuri feels it does. If you use both type of scopes you do notice the fluorite has a subtle factor of letting in that little bit extra but its not a huge thing. Perhaps more noticeable for visual users where more subtle detail can be extracted.

Its hard to compare as an AP scope has other little optical tricks that make them so good.

Greg.

[Hans Tucker (Hans)]

Originally Posted by gregbradley

Its hard to compare as an AP scope has other little optical tricks that make them so good.

Greg.

Sorry but Roland can have all the tricks in the world and he is a skilled maker whom produces top rate refractors, and other scopes if he ever gets them out of the prototype stage, but I am not convinced they are that better made than say Takahashi or TEC to warrant the sometimes excessive resale price. eg A second hand AP160 that the seller put up for auction and wanted $17K + for it. No 6 inch scope is worth that, not even a Takahashi FCT-150.

Please I don't want to get into the all to common AP vs TAK debate and this thread was originally about the new Takahashi TSA-120.
James Edwards said that Takahashi was, in the next few months, about to announce some new scopes to their product line. Ok the TSA-120 is confirmed but I sure hope that this is not it...surely there is more to come.

Addition: I just read that the TSA-120 is just one of the announcements...more to come.

[anj026]

I have heard this mention of fluorite being banned before but Takahashi still produce the FS 60 and Sky 90 using fluorite. I thought that it was just too expensive in the larger sizes as well as being more fragile and critical when the coatings are being applied.

[gregbradley]

There was planned to be a TOA110mm and a TOA180mm per the Anacortes website.

I wonder if they intend to expand the TSA line even further. Triplets are very popular. Perhaps in the smaller apertures to replace those models you mentioned.

I think the Japanese go for the smaller apertures more so it would make sense business-wise to fill the small aperture market with their new triplet and TOA series.

I guess Taks problem is to decide whether to do TOA or TSA in various sizes.

How would you rate the TOA series as a business success? The FSQ is probably Taks biggest selling scope (at least in the West).

Greg.

[anj026]

I would guess the TSA 102 would have sold more than the FSQ simply because it is more versatile and more affordable. The FSQ series are really astrographs. But I really don't know. It would be a good question for Claude at AEC. I see he has a price of $5750 for the first two TSA 120's ordered.

From what I have read on the forums, in the TOA series two of the three elements are FPL 53 and they have a really sturdy cell that requires a balancing counterweight at the focuser end. The TSA type has one of the elements made from FPL53 and a simpler type of cell.
Please correct me if I am wrong, I am not claiming to be an expert just an interested telescope nut.

The FSQ85 is a beautiful small scope however I think a TSA 78 would be a lot lighter and less expensive. Maybe halfway between the cost of a FS 60 and a Sky 90. I think it would be a big seller but maybe I am only dreaming.

[gregbradley]

You may be right Andy. I mainly frequent imaging groups and a lot have FSQs. But the 4 inch visual market would be very large.

TSA 78 and 60 is a likely candidate.

Greg.