Best way to go about image processing

barx1963 (Malcolm) · #1 13-12-2015, 03:40 PM

Hi all
I have ventured into a bit of imaging. I think I have the capturing part pretty well down now. I am using a Canon 760D and an ED80 on a HEQ5 mount with ST80 and an Orion autoguider.
Polar alignment is all OK, guiding is working, have Backyard EOS working fine, but I am having very little luck with processing.
I am happy to buy software but am not wanting to spend a lot of time trying stuff out.
I have tried DSS and it seems to work OK, but beyond that I am just basically lost.
What is the best way ahead and what resources are around to guide through a processing scenario.

Cheers

Malcolm

Merlin66 (Ken) · #2 13-12-2015, 04:18 PM

Most AP guys use a stacking pre-processing software followed by the tweaking in Photoshop....
I suggest AstroArt for darks/ flats etc. stacking, processing etc. followed by PaintShopPro (which does 99% of what PS does - at a fraction of the price)
Try the demo versions first - see how you get on.
You didn't mention any filters? I assume therefore you're capturing a OSC image and hoping to "improve it"

glend (Glen) · #3 13-12-2015, 04:18 PM

It is possible to get away with just using Photoshop Elements, it does not give you access to all the features of the expensive version but there is enough there for you to get images out of RAW files. Stay from Pixelinsght if you want simplicity in processing. There are some others and I'm sure you will get a lot of opinions and advice but at this stage keeping it simple will give you the enjoyment of producing images without the 'learning curve' dramas that create frustration. Get the basics before you tackle the complexities. You can also subscribe to Photoshop as a cloud based app for about $10 a month I think, this negates a big investment up front and lets you try it out. Have fun.

Atmos (Colin) · #4 13-12-2015, 04:28 PM

From what I have heard DSS works really well on DSLR images so continuing down that path could be good. There is also Gimp which does a lot of what PS does but it is free.

speach (Simon) · #5 14-12-2015, 11:49 AM

The most important thing is first get your hair cut really short, this prevents you pulling it out.

sil (Steve) · #6 14-12-2015, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by speach

The most important thing is first get your hair cut really short, this prevents you pulling it out.

Agreed. Learn to love biting your fingernails too.

DSS is good but adjusting levels I found difficult, Photoshop I thought would suit me well (already use it as a photographer) but again found it too limiting to tease out faint structures. Dedicated astrophotography programs tend to assume you are capturing a certain way with certain gear and rarely help when you are capturing with the gear you have and use.

Look at taking your stacked image from DSS as your master image and process from there elsewhere. I use PixInsight It has a steepish learning curve but easy enough once you get the hang of the interface and you figure out a workflow you are happy with.

If I'm capturing video (usually planetary) I tend to use PIPP to give me uncompresssed stills cropped with object centered (eg aligned/integrated). I might stack with Registax where I'm more comfortable using its wavelets (using PixInsight I havent been able to pulll out and more details and registax for planets is easiest for me).

DSLR stills imaging is mostly what I do and PixInsight is mostly what I use, sometimes DSS to make my master image.

My simplified process is something like:

register (align) images
integrate (stack) images
at this point I have a single 64bit FITS image, this is my starting point for processing
crop
gradient removal
cosmetic processing... through to output image to taste

I don't always do darks, flats but when i do i still end up at the third point with a master file containing all data. From that I work on a copy in PixInsight. Sometimes that master is created in PI sometimes DSS or elsewhere. Just depends on what I've captured and what I am after from the data. PI is the closest to what I would call a single app to do it all but it just happens to be the one I learnt easiest ( and i've bought pretty much all AP programs but PI is what i prefer), just personal choice really. StarTools is also pretty good but too simplistic controls for me. AstroArt and Nebulosity were promising but not too happy with my source data. I still go through phases of updating and retrying these programs periodically to see if they can wow me into investing more time to learn them, but PI so far doesn't let me down, as I learn and want to try different things out PI always seems to have a way for me to try.

I don't know which commercial software has demo version to try but I recommend grabbing them and checking youtube for tutorials and see what you find comfortable.

Merlin66 (Ken) · #7 14-12-2015, 04:11 PM

Sil,
You mention:
""AstroArt and Nebulosity were promising but not too happy with my source data""
I'm a little surprised....
I use AstroArt for all my cameras -DSLR through to ATik314L.
What was the specific issue with your data and AstroArt???

doppler (Rick) · #8 14-12-2015, 10:25 PM

I found this video tutorial a good starting point. It is for photoshop but I think the basic principals would apply to most other graphics programs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBQQ_Gs6YHM

sil (Steve) · #9 17-12-2015, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merlin66

What was the specific issue with your data and AstroArt???

To be honest I can't remember the specific problem i had with AA.

In general though some apps expect flats and darks and won't let you register and integrate without them, some expect shot to have been taken on tracking mounts so dont like registering a moving star field, some don't like working with raw (at the time i tried them), some only work from video files or stills but not both.

Over the years I've always taken shots of the night sky with different gear and trying different techniques so I like to be able to go back and use my source data in new software and see what i can do with it.

Ideally I'd like to use my C11 and SBIG for imaging, but I suffered a stroke a few days after the sbig and filters arrived so I've never used it and may never be able to use the C11 ever as it can't be set up permanently here for me to try to use one handed.

I've used webcams and zwo for solar, lunar and planetary so I'm still on my quest for the ideal AP software that can easily take the data I can capture (the way I can capture with limited skies, gear and capabilities) and just handle it from start to finish. Some programs seem to do certain things better than others and some i just find annoying to use and can't wrap my head around their workflow and terminology.

I do keep trying them occassionally, after all I did invest a lot of money at the time into these programs (no more money now so cant afford any other newcomers just yet). PixInsight is where I've ended up for what I have and can do, I've seen tons of great work done with AstroArt, Nebulosity etc but there was just something about them that stopped me going further with them at the time. Not that they are bad programs, maybe more I am a bad fit for them. PI was daunting at first but finding a tutorial I could follow with my own data alll the way through gave me a solid starting point to write down the steps to follow "just to get a picture", after that its just refining and tweaking and lots of learning and I still consider myself a learner with PI and AP. But I enjoy it, its amazing what even poor equipment can see in the sky once you've taken the time to go through the steps.

PS I still haven't given up on spectroscopy. Thats another can of worms for me, might take me a few more years to find the time to dive in deeper at the shallow end of it

Merlin66 (Ken) · #10 17-12-2015, 09:56 AM

Sil,
OK - I thought there may have been something specific that I could assist with.
RE ""In general though some apps expect flats and darks and won't let you register and integrate without them, some expect shot to have been taken on tracking mounts so dont like registering a moving star field, some don't like working with raw....""

AstroArt does all these things can control the camera and process with/ without darks/flats and will register the frames.
Fabio even "upgraded" AA to assist the spectroscope guys by improving the guiding system to accommodate the slit gap and position. He also made enhancements to improve the handling of the spectral image registration.
I use the C11/ NEQ6pro/ Atik 314L for the spectroscopy.