Go Back   IceInSpace > Beginners Start Here > Beginners Equipment Discussions
Register FAQ Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
  #1  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:15 PM
Rockah (Zal)
Registered User

Rockah is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 43
Setting up a guidescope - Questions!

Hi guys

I've taken the plunge into astrophotography and I'm aware of the need of guiding the main imaging scope with a guidescope - so I have almost all the equipment to now do so, and while I'm awaiting the delivery of my autoguider, I'm trying to figure out the best way to mount my guidescope. This is not an SBS vs other types of mounting question, but just a "what am I doing wrong" type of thing.

I have an ED 80 as my imaging scope with the tube rings that came supplied, and a ProStar short tube refractor as a guidescope. The guidescope was purchase from myastropshop 2nd hand and they kindly made up some guide rings (modified skywatcher rings) with custom adjustment screws for alignment (which you can see in one of the images below). However, it's mounting these rings on top of each other that's presenting the issue!! I've tried looking through the forums for ideas, I've looked at other people's setups but I can't figure what to do - It seems everyone has their guidescope mounted on a dovetail bar which bolted onto the holes of the main imaging scope if I'm not mistaken?

So, I thought "yeah, the holes at the top of the of the ED 80's rings will be the same size/thread of the holes of the bottom of the guide's rings (as they're the same style of rings)" so I measured the small bolts that came with the guide's rings and it came out to be an M6 size, and accordingly I went out and bought appropriately sized bolts of a longer length so they could go through the top of the ED80's rings, through the bottom of the dovetail and then into the guide rings... well it was then I found out that the top of the ED80's rings (the piggy back thread) is not really the same fit as the bottom of the tube rings. This seemed really odd to me, and so I measured the thread size and then noticed that the top whole has a wider thread spacing that that of the bottom of the rings.

So I had effectively bought long bolts that couldn't fit through the top of the ED80's ring holes to make it through the dovetail and the rings. And it appeared that the piggy back screw that comes with the ED80's rings is too big to fit through the corresponding hole at the bottom of the rings. So as a frustrated/quick fix, I drilled out the threading of the bottom of the guide rings, took a spare piggy back screw from one of my other scopes and threaded it through the two ED80 top piggy back holes. However, these screws are too short to make it through a dovetail plate and then into the guide rings. So right now, I've got the guide rings sitting right on top of the imaging scope rings with a bolt on each end holding things in place (see photo). This, to me, seems like a stupid idea as I'm sure this is going to introduce all types of flexure issues.

So how the heck does everyone do it?? Am I missing a key component to my setup here?! Is it just a matter of getting some extra long screws of the same size/thread that fit through the top of skywatcher tube rings (seems to be camera thread sized)??

The first image simply shows a close up of the top ring above the ED80 ring with a nut holding it in place. The second image is showing how the 4 rings are currently setup. The third image is of the two screws (both supplied as piggy back screws from my ED80 and my other skywatcher) on the front and back ring. And the fourth is just how the ED80 sits on the dovetail, which is how I thought everything would fit together for the top rings... but hence the reason for this huge post!!

So any info/ideas you guys have would be really appreciated - and go easy on me... I gave a pre-emptive warning of newbie questions in my introductory post

I'm also very sorry for the super long post, but I've literally written everything that popped into my head, and I'm sure I'll add more later!!

Thanks guys!!
Attached Thumbnails
Click for full-size image (guide1.jpg)
41.9 KB30 views
Click for full-size image (guide2.jpg)
58.6 KB33 views
Click for full-size image (guide3.jpg)
43.4 KB30 views
Click for full-size image (guide4.jpg)
35.8 KB25 views
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:22 PM
asimov's Avatar
asimov (John)
Planet photographer

asimov is offline
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Bundaberg
Posts: 8,819
I'm in the exact same boat. Exact same setup, only I haven't pulled the trigger on a guide scope yet. I'll look forward to seeing your responses..

To me though, I don't think it's an ideal setup to stop flexure but I'm prepared to be wrong!
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:33 PM
Rockah (Zal)
Registered User

Rockah is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 43
Yeah John, I don't think it's going to stop flexure but I just think the current setup I've got will be flexure central!

If you're after a guidescope setup bintel have a pretty good deal on the Orion ST80 with rings and dovetail - I was going to get that but opted for the prostar as it had a slightly bigger apature and I liked the look of the build quality... but I've heard really good reviews of the Orion
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:42 PM
asimov's Avatar
asimov (John)
Planet photographer

asimov is offline
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Bundaberg
Posts: 8,819
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockah View Post
Yeah John, I don't think it's going to stop flexure but I just think the current setup I've got will be flexure central!

If you're after a guidescope setup bintel have a pretty good deal on the Orion ST80 with rings and dovetail - I was going to get that but opted for the prostar as it had a slightly bigger apature and I liked the look of the build quality... but I've heard really good reviews of the Orion
Thanks for that, I'll go check Bintel out regarding a guide scope

BTW I'm formulating a plan to build a side by side setup. Being an ex engineer, it'll be 18mm ally plate or something ridiculously overkill I'm not into flexure lol.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:42 PM
AdrianF's Avatar
AdrianF (Adrian)
Currently Scopeless

AdrianF is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Moura Qld
Posts: 1,774
This is how I have mine setup. 2 dovetails one connected to the EQ6, mounting rings, dovetail and then guide rings.

Probably not ideal but works.

Adrian
Attached Thumbnails
Click for full-size image (IMG_6901.JPG)
167.2 KB70 views
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:50 PM
Rockah (Zal)
Registered User

Rockah is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 43
Hey Adrian

Thanks for that, seems to be exactly what I thought the setup should be. However, it's the bolts/screws that are giving me the problem. The centre holes in all my dovetails seem to be threaded to the same size as the stock piggy back screw that comes with in the top of my main tube rings, and the holes at the extreme ends of the dovetail are unthreaded and can fit anything M6 sized into them - both combinations are a real pain because it seems you have to have an M6 screw with a threading the same of that found in camera threads.

Nice setup by the way!
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:54 PM
asimov's Avatar
asimov (John)
Planet photographer

asimov is offline
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Bundaberg
Posts: 8,819
I think I'd be drilling out the holes in both sets of rings as well as the bar, & plonking in bigger bolts (plus nuts) Zal?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 07-07-2010, 08:56 PM
AdrianF's Avatar
AdrianF (Adrian)
Currently Scopeless

AdrianF is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Moura Qld
Posts: 1,774
The holes in my dovetails are unthreaded only the holes in the rings are threaded.

Adrian
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-07-2010, 09:00 PM
Rockah (Zal)
Registered User

Rockah is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by asimov View Post
I think I'd be drilling out the holes in both sets of rings as well as the bar, & plonking in bigger bolts (plus nuts) Zal?
Yeah thought about that, but then i'd be drilling out the thread that fits the camera screw at the top of the ED80 rings.. and for basic camera piggy backing, i'd want to still have that option. I guess I could just mount the camera on top of the dovetail though... hmmmmmm!!!
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-07-2010, 09:05 PM
asimov's Avatar
asimov (John)
Planet photographer

asimov is offline
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Bundaberg
Posts: 8,819
That's what I've been doing on the odd occasion I've done widefield work with just a camera - Lose all scopes & just leave the bar on the mount with camera bolted on
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 07-07-2010, 09:06 PM
GraemeT's Avatar
GraemeT (Graeme)
Learning fast

GraemeT is offline
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 197
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockah View Post
Hey Adrian

. The centre holes in all my dovetails seem to be threaded to the same size as the stock piggy back screw that comes with in the top of my main tube rings, and the holes at the extreme ends of the dovetail are unthreaded and can fit anything M6 sized into them - both combinations are a real pain because it seems you have to have an M6 screw with a threading the same of that found in camera threads.
Camera threads are 1/4" Whitworth and are a different pitch to M6, even though the two are (almost) the same - 1/4"BSW is 6.4mm.
Cheers
Graeme
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 07-07-2010, 09:14 PM
Rockah (Zal)
Registered User

Rockah is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 43
Ahhhhh that would explain why the same size M6 with even the same (apparent) spacing in threading still wasn't fitting! Thanks Graeme, that makes more sense and makes me feel a little less crazy thinking that I couldn't get two screws that looked exactly the same to fit in the same thread!
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 09-07-2010, 03:19 PM
bmitchell82's Avatar
bmitchell82 (Brendan)
Newtonian power! Love it!

bmitchell82 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Mandurah
Posts: 2,597
i utlilize the ED80 ontop of my 10" newt, though i use guidescope rings, that is they have 3 screws at 120 deg so i can adjust my field of view to match the field of view for the 10 (makes for easier spotting of the target ). Though they are just attached to the main scope rings, not though a dovetail bar then to the rings
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +10. The time is now 09:28 AM.

Powered by vBulletin Version 3.8.7 | Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertisement
Bintel
Advertisement