Choices For Aussie Time Travellers

[AJames]

to Everyone on Australia Day...

One of my favourite television programmes for some time are the ones that involve time travel to the past or the future. At the moment, two are featured on the tele. One is "Journeyman" on 7HD, which tells the story of a journalist who unexpectedly, and inexplicably, travels back in time to help some individual in the past - often to save them from their own unfortunate fate. The other is "Goodnight Sweetheart" on the ABC, which is about a man, Gary, who can travel through a time portal into the past, and tells the story of his machinations involving his two wives - one in the 1990's - one in the 1940's.
Although, physics doesn't seem to allow us to really do this, this kind of travel has got me thinking - especially today on Australia Day. So without really worrying if such time travel is possible or not.

* If you could travel back (or forward) in time, where and what year would you go to in Australia's History?
* Who would you meet?
* And, other than political change, what would you do to improve our wonderful country for the present Australia in 2008?

Regards,
Andrew

[Ric]

I'd go back to the time of Federation and have it written into the constitution that the Australian skies must be kept pristine and free of light pollution for all time.

Cheers

[acropolite (Phil)]

I'd like to go back to the time when my parents were young (the 1930's)

I'd like to meet my mother and father as kids and learn about their childhood and ancestry because my mother was very guarded on that subject, so we never found out anything of her past. It wasn't until her funeral that my brother spotted Mum's maiden name on our Uncles (we didn't know he existed) suitcase that we even knew her maiden surname.

As for what would I do to improve our country, I don't believe that it would be possible without political change, most, if not all our problems, can be pinned on very average government. I suppose the best thing would be to give a warning of what the future holds.

[leon]

Phil, have you been watching Back to the Future, with Michael J Fox in it, now that was a good movie i reckon.

Leon

[Glenhuon (Bill)]

I'm not really up on Australian History, but I think if it was possible to slip back in time I'd like to go meet the idiot who came up with the idea of "clearing a million acres a year" and show him/her the results of this short sighted policy in the year 2008. Millions of acres lost to salt and drought.

Bill

[GrahamL]

Yeah I can relate to that phil .. my grandmother could never speak about her brother who died in action a week or two before the first world wars end .
He'd been sending her money to buy a piano each month .. she got the
piano.. but her brother never got to here her play it .. her funeral 2003
was the first I ever knew of all this ..

[ballaratdragons (Ken)]

This is a very interesting idea, Andrew

As much as I'd like to see the far future, it would be better to go back to the early 1800's with a few current newspapers (videos, DVD's etc would be useless).

Show them what happens if time follows the path that is has.

[programmer]

I'd like to go back and divert the meteor that killed off the dinosaurs.. then come back and see how things turned out!

[Ric]

We also have to remember that what we change in the past will affect the future so we may wipe out future timelines and never exist in the first instance.

That would put a dampener on things

[Glenhuon (Bill)]

Originally Posted by Ric

We also have to remember that what we change in the past will affect the future so we may wipe out future timelines and never exist in the first instance.

That would put a dampener on things

Yep, we don't want paradoxes, have the dept of Temporal Security on us

Bill

[AJames]

Some interesting replies.

While I do also fear temporal investigations might soon be tapping on my door - I think that changing the future here might not be the point. We can certainly learn from historical events - so in the future they don't happen again.
It is funny that both the programs that I highlight also have such paradoxes, main to add drama and the point that one should act appropriately if one goes backwards in time. If you stray out of the temporal flow, so to speak, what happen is more catastrophic. Ie. "Goodnight Sweetheart" finds Gary changing something so when he returns someone else is living in his future residence. This same show also has his young son in the past, then when he finds him 50-odd years later as a down and out living in squaller. This saddens Gary greatly, so he goes back in the past by using an obscure song sheet in the future - leaving the rights and residuals of the song to go into a fund for his sons future. We he returns his son is now transformed into a successful business man with his own family. In "Journeyman" he fixes up someone's life from their fatal error - and the wrongdoing disappears from the history books.
Furthermore science-fiction often uses this atypical premise, like say, "Heroes", who see the future as a devastation of New York, which the present day characters then try to avoid. This is also seen in the latest "Babylon 5" "Lost Tales" anthology (2007) release, where an error in the characters current path is pointed out and is shown the consequences of his decision.

Of course, this is all make-believe, but is shows a deep human desire of correcting regrets and choices of our past - and the wish that such decisions could be changed.

Yet my question here is more of things individuals might like to see - not necessarily to change but to even learn from.

If I had the chance, what I'd like to see would be;

- James Dunlop doing his southern double star and deep-sky observations and ask him about the perspectives on the double he's viewing. Then also seeing through his telescope to see the quality of the image.

- I would like to go back and look at the Australian megafauna 47 000 years ago, and see for myself creatures like the Marsupial lion, Diprotodon, etc.

- See in Sydney the famous dome of the International Exhibition Building of 1879 or Garden Palace in the Botanical Garden that was built in 1851, and preventing them from burning down in the fire. Ie. The Garden Palace that was destroyed it in September 1882.

- Meet Marco Polo in 1300 AD and ask how he actually knew of Australia existence.

- Walk through the gum tree forest that now been converted in the city centre of Sydney

- Prevent the separation of Victoria from New South Wales in 1851, to finally end the old Sydney-Melbourne Rivalry, and then stop the the formation in Queensland in 1859.

- Convince the New Zealanders to become one of the States of Australia during the Colonial Conference in 1897. (Bribing the United Kingdom to enforce this issue). Renaming our Federation as the "Federation of Australasia."

- See and record a performance of Dame Nellie Melba in 1910-15

- Tell William Brahe to just wait one more day at Cooper's Creek for Burke and Wills and save them from their unnecessary death in mid-1861.

- Travel to 2100, and see how the current generation has really stuffed up the planet.

Just some ideas,

Regards
Andrew

NUMBER 1 NOW!: Influence all Australian governments to stop saturation advertising - like the NSW skin cancer ad shown on all channels, 24 hours a day. I think I have REALLY have got the message.

[AJames]

Originally Posted by Ric

I'd go back to the time of Federation and have it written into the constitution that the Australian skies must be kept pristine and free of light pollution for all time.

Cheers

Yeah! and also under the penalty of death!

[AJames]

Sorry. I requested no political arguments for the sake of harmony (for a change by me), but I realised in the last post that I have also broken my own request!

NOTE: The only reason I've said that Victoria, Queensland and New Zealand should not have separated from New South Wales, is that it would have made one larger bureaucracy which might have made an even greater southern land. As to New Zealand declining the offer of not joining our Federation probably might have given us more clout in avoiding the errors like disaster of Gallipoli decided by the imperial British. Of course, the biggest problem is that we we wouldn't have the Wallaby-All Black rivalry , and Australian Rules would have to be called something else! Secondly, the number of sheep between us, would top 200 million!

[xelasnave]

Andrew your thoughts are so interesting and considered.
AND your observation re advertizing is most valid.
I can not help but think that the Government of the day pushes cash in the direction of certain add agencies to keep them onside and sing the praises of the Government (whilst getting cash in their hat).

But it is so hard to say but you need not advertize about something as deadly as cancer..complaining seems almost grumpy..and so the adds of this nature seem reasonable.. however if these matters are only for public safety perhaps the dollars spent would be better placed on buying more Doctors and Teachers ...an old fashion educate and fix approach..but no the politically safe opinion is choosen.
I would like to go back or forward in time to a place where self interest in Government is something that is outlawed and always exposed by the oppositions we elect to do that job.
The add thing goes on and on and each new Government tells how they will fix it...mmm stop the cash and the problems fixed one would think but given the inaction the problem must be sio much greater than we the public can imagine...
I would like to go to a future where we are colonizing other worlds and see how the politics have changed.
alex

[xelasnave]

Sorry Andrew I seemed to have been a little political..
still its there now
alex

[Glenhuon (Bill)]

Originally Posted by xelasnave

Andrew your thoughts are so interesting and considered.
I would like to go to a future where we are colonizing other worlds and see how the politics have changed.
alex

If history is any guide, probably not a lot

Bill

[AJames]

Originally Posted by nightstalker

Yeah I can relate to that phil .. my grandmother could never speak about her brother who died in action a week or two before the first world wars end.
He'd been sending her money to buy a piano each month .. she got the
piano.. but her brother never got to here her play it .. her funeral 2003
was the first I ever knew of all this ..

I've been thinking a little about this particular heartfelt post all day... that made me question what I've already done in my life and how little I know of the fine details of my personal origins
When talking about this subject, the usual discussion of travelling to the past, is the anecdote of the paradox of going back in time and killing one of your earlier decedents (generational matricide or patricide, ergo, immediately eliminating your own existence. However, this isn't the only drastic consequence of time travel, even though doing this to a family member is silly because you have nothing to gain by doing it, and your own future is also eliminated.

One of the consequences with time travel into the past is dealing with meeting people you know or are related too. There would be a great temptation to visit those who have since passed away and in meeting them alive again. This would be very difficult for the time traveller both emotionally and psychologically. For example, if you know they died from a preventable disease, you couldn't really prevent yourself by giving them some foreknowledge so the condition or event that would not occur in the first place. Even if you could keep it to yourself, your behaviour with the past person would be difficult as you would know their fate - down to the year and hour. If you had to go through a long grieving process, the chance to see them alive again would be very overwhelming - and if you had deep affection for them you would never want to let them go.
In fact, I could see that most of your life would be living somewhere and sometime other than the present time where you are meant to be! (This is the same concept of Heaven in some ways, where all your family, friends and others you will meet again after you also die. For some this primordial need is so important to deal with the short fleeting human finiteness existence of living.)
If I were going to re-meet a passed loved one, my instincts would be to completely overwhelm the person wanting to hold on to every moment. Smothering someone with this much of attention would probably cheese them off - only causing them ending up not wanting to be with you! Furthermore, if you have suspicions of someone's particular past actions, travelling to the past means you could check on their future behaviour, making trust of others both unnecessary and kind of false.
If time travel were actually feasible, I think temporal sociology and psychology would be booming industry.
So for me travelling into the past (or future) would be a two edge sword, making you or others venerable to gross exploitation.

Maybe, in fact, it is far better to have some mystery in ones life - and only the here and now can provide it! If you knew everything about another person, you'd end up clearly having nothing to talk about!

There is a saying all of us probably have thought of at one time or another ... "If had my life over again what would I do anything differently?" If you answer is truthfully, No, then you would probably be a good Aussie time traveller. If not, you would probably be tempted to improve you own life or lot in life somewhat, meaning you could fall into the trap of both changing and wanting to react to doing something the past.
Philosophically, these sorts of arguments would lead to the conclusion why God universe He created does not have time travel as an option. On the other hand, this could also be the reason that physics abhors time travel because of the consequences of such time paradoxes. If human evolution had time travel in the past, then we would be a different kind humans than we are now.

* Another slight worry would be dying in the past (Greater than 100 years, say), would be lonely, because no one that you knew would have been born yet, and therefore you immediate family and friends would not be there to morn you to see your passing. (unless your body was returned to your own future.)

Now NOT to end on a depressing note, my Australia Day and weekend so far has been brilliant. I had a nice BBQ, went out for lunch, and took some well deserved R&R. In this case, if I could go back to Thursday again, I wouldn't change it one iota for quids!

Regards,
Andrew

Note: If you are interested in Time as a subject, you might like to watch Science show ABC TV "Sleek Geeks", whose repeat of last Wednesday in freely available on the internet at; http://www.abc.net.au/science/sleekgeeks/
(88Mb though)
I only just watched a tape video this afternoon. Quite fun, especially at the very end the Play School skit with "Big Ted" and his brother "Morris" - doing relativity. Classic!

[xelasnave]

Andrew said....

Philosophically, these sorts of arguments would lead to the conclusion why God universe He created does not have time travel as an option. On the other hand, this could also be the reason that physics abhors time travel because of the consequences of such time paradoxes. If human evolution had time travel in the past, then we would be a different kind humans than we are now....



I would submit that for all practical purposes we are indeed a species that has managed time travel...and I dont mean in a physical sense but in a mental sense...

We study history and have reasonable ideas about it and can form some view of the past... we can imagine the future and it is the humans who imagine the future who make it.... through a combination of many things but tracable to our imaginations and ability to plan and organise...

But what I suggest is not a fanciful notion.

I never feel stuck in this time.

My consciousness has been exposed to not only the history of the Earth but perhaps of the Universe itself... and I have a fair idea of what the future can hold for humans both on a negative or positve approach.

But when in the present we can not see this is avaialable to us because we assume we have no control on the past...and lament it.. but we hold the inteligence to realise no matter how obscure actions cause events ..that both good and bad come from them.. and as a species we learn from the events and resultant actions... and then admit if we could travel back in time there is nothing we would dare change...so we travel but can not exercise that control we say we would not even if we had it...

AND most all actions product a responce that adds to our history and understanding what we know so that we can change things for the better in the future, if we hold the resolve... the fact we often do not bother to change things is a lack of belief that we can or knowing that we can find we really do not want to bother...we would not change things in the past that we regret but we can select the future....and that is so neat.

So we are Lords of time in a very real sense in my view.

alex

[jjjnettie (Jeanette)]

I'd like to go forward in time if I could, a decade at a time. So I could experience time slices of the next few centuries.

[xelasnave]

Originally Posted by jjjnettie

I'd like to go forward in time if I could, a decade at a time. So I could experience time slices of the next few centuries.

Try imagining how it could be... have many alternatives one may be the one.
I go backwars imagining my ancestors...so as to see folk of past times as real I guess...what it may have been like to be a man in the shield wall at Hastings for example.. a serf.. a hunter gatherer...a fish with new legs

Going forward ..well consider history and add your favorite SI FI book...not War of the Worlds although one wont know if you are right until you are in the present er in the future

alex