How dor peeps feel about us funding the US to go to Mars?

Stonius (Markus) · #1 23-09-2019, 08:36 PM

I'd love to see a Mars mission, but I fail to see what Australia gets out of this arrangement.

The US didn't ask for cash. We get nothing out of it, and there's no plan to pay for it other than cutting services for Australians.

Maybe I'm missing something, but it feels like...'why'?

Markus

LewisM · #2 23-09-2019, 08:50 PM

Figures don't lie:

FY2019, NASA's allocated budget is $21.5 billion

FY2019, the US Department of Defence budget is approximately $693 billion.

Easy in the light of hard figures. The US' priorities lie solely on war and the sale of weaponry - FULLSTOP.

billdan (Bill) · #3 23-09-2019, 09:34 PM

Maybe that amount of money goes to upgrade our space facilities here in Aust' to help NASA with communications and tracking etc.

Stonius (Markus) · #4 23-09-2019, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billdan

Maybe that amount of money goes to upgrade our space facilities here in Aust' to help NASA with communications and tracking etc.

I think you're right - it's a $150M investment in the Australian space sector to support the US bid for Mars.

So...cautious optimism for space sector.

Still, I wonder how they're going to pay for it when there's a recession looming.

M

billdan (Bill) · #5 23-09-2019, 10:56 PM

According to Scomo's speech at the White House yesterday, we are on track for a $20 Billion surplus this coming financial year.

multiweb (Marc) · #6 24-09-2019, 01:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LewisM

Easy in the light of hard figures. The US' priorities lie solely on war and the sale of weaponry - FULLSTOP.

Nah.... I reckon the space industry and defence in the US are the same thing. That's where all the money goes. NASA budget is only the tip of the iceberg and keeps the media and main stream science happy. I suspect their actual capabilities are decades ahead of the rest.

Wavytone · #7 24-09-2019, 08:04 AM

IMHO it’s a pointless waste of money and there are far more important domestic needs - starting with addressing the issues arising from the drought, water mismanagement and over-population.

Considering Mars has an atmosphere that is mostly CO2 (totally lethal) at an unsurvivably low pressure, the temperature range and lack of liquid water the notion that there is any point going there is laughable when quite frankly we haven’t managed to reverse desertification on earth - quite the contrary - we’ve made a mess.

Stonius (Markus) · #8 24-09-2019, 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wavytone

IMHO it’s a pointless waste of money and there are far more important domestic needs - starting with addressing the issues arising from the drought, water mismanagement and over-population.

Considering Mars has an atmosphere that is mostly CO2 (totally lethal) at an unsurvivably low pressure, the temperature range and lack of liquid water the notion that there is any point going there is laughable when quite frankly we haven’t managed to reverse desertification on earth - quite the contrary - we’ve made a mess.

Good Point. Though I guess by that standard we didn't need to go to the moon either.

Tropo-Bob (Bob) · #9 24-09-2019, 08:12 AM

I have heard this type of discontent expressed in the 1960s regarding the race to the Moon, yet that heralded an era of great technological improvements that we could not operate without today.

So yes, I think pile on and share in the rewards.

Wavytone · #10 24-09-2019, 03:45 PM

Well unlike the 1960s we do now know quite clearly what the moon and mars are made of, what’s there and more importantly what’s NOT there.

And considering we have been unable to “terraform” anything on earth the notion of doing so on the moon in a vacuum, or on mars - is ridiculous.

Hence it’s a total waste of money.

OTOH happily give those keen to go a one-way ticket to mars if that’s what it takes to shut them up.

multiweb (Marc) · #11 24-09-2019, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wavytone

Well unlike the 1960s we do now know quite clearly what the moon and mars are made of, what’s there and more importantly what’s NOT

If it's made of cheese all we need to bring with us is wine and crackers. Sounds pretty straight forward to me.

taminga16 (Greg) · #12 24-09-2019, 04:02 PM

"For all of the money we are spending, NASA should NOT be talking about going to the Moon - We did that 50 years ago," Trump said on Twitter. "They should be focused on the much bigger things we are doing, including Mars (of which the Moon is a part), Defense and Science!" Donald Trump. (June 2019)

RyanJones · #13 24-09-2019, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wavytone

IMHO it’s a pointless waste of money and there are far more important domestic needs - starting with addressing the issues arising from the drought, water mismanagement and over-population.

Considering Mars has an atmosphere that is mostly CO2 (totally lethal) at an unsurvivably low pressure, the temperature range and lack of liquid water the notion that there is any point going there is laughable when quite frankly we haven’t managed to reverse desertification on earth - quite the contrary - we’ve made a mess.

You’re right. We should all just sit still and do nothing adventurous until all minority groups are happy.....

( please note , tongue in cheek )

Sunfish (Ray) · #14 24-09-2019, 09:54 PM

Maybe Scomo thinks he is JFK. Or maybe he is just a very naughty boy.

Although I did think that the current value of NASA moon rocks exceeds the cost of the entire Apollo program. So the accountants can not really complain. Then there are all the spin offs .

Although sending people to Mars seems a bit premature and possibly lethal when we can now send machines, it does make a change from starting another war . Let POTUS and Various Presidents for Life , slug it out in space.

Some cheese from the moon and maybe there is tomato sauce on Mars. Perfect.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stonius

I'd love to see a Mars mission, but I fail to see what Australia gets out of this arrangement.

The US didn't ask for cash. We get nothing out of it, and there's no plan to pay for it other than cutting services for Australians.

Maybe I'm missing something, but it feels like...'why'?

Markus

Wavytone · #15 24-09-2019, 09:57 PM

It reminds me of Marie Antoinette. It is not a rational decision.

Government should be about managing the economy, sensibly. Not chasing votes based on issues peddled by vocal minorities - including this one.

And yes If the government is actually doing its job, it’s boring from the perspective of the public and the media.

In this respect the media are disruptive - they don’t care what damage they do to achieve a 5 second video grab that will make the headlines, regardless of the damage done to individuals or the country.

And equally if the government isn’t doing its primary job - managing economy - it should be thrown out of office. Quickly.

If it has the cash to splash the rest is easy - but if not ... we know where that leads. And it hits every taxpayer and retireee.

mynameiscd (Andy) · #16 24-09-2019, 10:12 PM

Perhaps if Captain Cook or Christopher Columbus had decided to stay home instead of boldly going where no one has gone before, the Americas or Australia wouldnt be inhabited by Europeans and thefore thd Australian Space Agency or NASA wouldn't exist.
Probably a whole lot less green house gases as well!
I wonder what the budget was to organize a fleet of ships to be built by the Spanish instead of feeding the people at the time?
Probably similar to NASA
It just human nature to explore, its what make us different and keeps us elvolving.
Cheers
Andy

Wavytone · #17 24-09-2019, 10:38 PM

The aborigines frankly were lucky - if La Perouse had been a week earlier Australia would have been a French colony and the aborigines would have been wiped out.

The French view of superiority/inferiority at that time is quite clear.

mynameiscd (Andy) · #18 24-09-2019, 11:38 PM

Could have been a Dutch colony as well.
Its only they didnt land on the east coast is probably the only reason they didnt colonize.
The 1600s veiw on indigenous peoples was was similar in Holand as well.

Sunfish (Ray) · #19 25-09-2019, 09:15 AM

I would not mind if we all spoke French or Nederlander, at least we would not have to listen to bad US press and toady up to the president.

In 2200 9/10 people will be African and Asian so the difference between one European adventure and another will be a minor historical blip.

taminga16 (Greg) · #20 25-09-2019, 04:15 PM

If Trump really wants a space project then he should assign NASA to clean up all of the **** they have everywhere. It is estimated that there is more than 180,000 kgs of litter on the Moon alone.