Dark Matter

[matt]

Wow!!!

Did anyone just see that story on Channel 10 news about dark matter and the findings which have been revealed using the Hubble????

The story on TV was a bit brief, but fascinating.

They've confirmed its presence and created a 3D image of the universe and the location of dark matter.

[Kal (Andrew)]

There is a newscientist article, including a picture and a link to a video of the 3D map here

Interesting to note how this is the largest study hubble has performed, using 10% of it's imaging time over a 2 year period!

[matt]

Thanks Kal

[mickoking]

Modern Cosmology really blows me away, thanx for the link Kal I would really like to know what dark matter is made of tho

[Tamtarn]

Another brief report on the ABC News at 7pm.

Thanks Kal for the link

[sheeny (Al)]

Here's a link to the article in Nature.

http://www.nature.com/news/2007/0701.../070101-7.html

You may need to open an account (free) with nature to view it.

Al.

[Striker (Tony)]

Yep saw it....didn't appeal to me it just looks the like the blob I made out of plasticine when I was 5 years old....haha

[xelasnave]

I still say (a belief of course but based on the crude observations of the data and more important the history and the reasons why they need it) that dark matter fitting the description etc they have given it simply will be found not to exsist..er I think..I have some doubts but if I belief I am wrong I will say so.
It all has to do with the misinterpretation of attraction being involved in the scheme of things and I say there is no such thing as attraction..there is only a pushing force..the pushing force of the most powerful energy in the Universe..dark energy.. I say it comes from each bodies radiation and therefore requires no mass to be present where they look for it.
I said earier that is my current project to chase down these alleged photos of dark matter and see how convincing they are..
Shake your heads wring your hands but at least I am honest and dont go along with the croud on something that does not make sence..fotos or no photos.
alex

[xelasnave]

This I found from a Goggle and I quote it to point to the area I think is open for other interpretation.

"Draft version August 18, 2006

Preprint typeset using LATEX style emulateapj v. 11/26/03

A DIRECT EMPIRICAL PROOF OF THE EXISTENCE OF DARK MATTER .

Douglas Clowe1, Maru sa Bradac 2, Anthony H. Gonzalez3, Maxim Markevitch4,5, Scott W. Randall4 ,
Christine Jones4, and Dennis Zaritsky1

Draft version August 18, 2006

ABSTRACT
We present new weak lensing observations of 1E0657..558 (z =0:296), a unique cluster merger, that enable a direct detection of dark matter, independent of assumptions regarding the nature of the gravitational force law. Due to the collision of two clusters, the dissipationless stellar component and the uid-like X-ray emitting plasma are spatially segregated. By using both wide-eld ground based
images and HST/ACS images of the cluster cores, we create gravitational lensing maps which show that the gravitational potential does not trace the plasma distribution, the dominant baryonic mass component, but rather approximately traces the distribution of galaxies. An 8. signicance spatial oset of the center of the total mass from the center of the baryonic mass peaks cannot be explained with an alteration of the gravitational force law, and thus proves that the majority of the matter in the system is unseen.
Subject headings: Gravitational lensing – Galaxies: clusters: individual: 1E0657-558 – dark matter
The bold I added to draw attention.
My contention is that no photos can be taken of dark matter and this illustrates my belief that any "photos" are indeed showing where they believe dark matter to exist.. an existance I say is from an inference that the current understanding of gravity requires a mass interaction. I suggest different is possible if one can except that gravity does not attract but comes from the force of dark energy..which is a pushing force.
Clearly if one sees gravity as a force of attraction one will need matter to cause the attraction, if one sees the Universe in the context of dark energy and the force of gravity effectively as a pushing force I believe that the necessity to find dark matter will disappear. The areas which they conclude hold dark matter I suspect hold no such thing but are in effect areas where the force of dark energy (gravity rain, universal pressure or whatever to describe the side I am on) is reduced due to a shielding from outside that area.
I hope you can understand what I am attempting to convey..simply so you can assess it fairly and then dismiss or more unlikly accept my proposition.
alex

[Kal (Andrew)]

Perhaps space/time itself is simply not constant. A bit like how matter causes bends in space/time that are seen through the effects of gravity, yet if we remove all matter from the universe does the remaining empty space/time have to be flat?

Assuming that these observable inconsistancies are attributed to invisible 'dark matter' seems about as plausable as an inconstistant space/time theory to me!

[Argonavis (William)]

A very interesting article in the latest SciAm on dark matter and dark energy.

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?cha...CA562C33C4F03C

It points out how the Universe as we observe it, principally the large scale filamentary structure, as well as galaxy evolution, is sculpted by dark matter.

The underlying assumption is the cosmological principle the the Universe, and the forces of gravity and space/time, are the same everywhere.

[xelasnave]

I thought that was excellent. Not easy job to relate all that information so clearly in an easy to read style but the author did an excellent job I thought.
I was interested to see an expression of the "energy" of dark energy.
There was no mention of the manner of line up of galaxies which I think figures more in the understanding of things than any other information to hand to date.. spirals are like buttons on a string to form, as I understand it, these filiaments. These alignments I have seen no explanation or comment.
And have not seen any more since the first anouncement of that finding.. just net luck I guess.
Thanks for the link.
alex

[centauri]

Xelesnave, your belief on forces may well be close to the truth.
However I like to refer to the "pushing force" you describe more as a pressure force exhibited on objects by dark energy and that gravitational "attraction" (for want of a better word) may be the resultant indicator of this force.

[xelasnave]

AND have I changed my mind about anything I have said to date..not really. But it gives me something to look into..which is always good.
alex

[xelasnave]

Originally Posted by centauri

Xelesnave, your belief on forces may well be close to the truth.
However I like to refer to the "pushing force" you describe more as a pressure force exhibited on objects by dark energy and that gravitational "attraction" (for want of a better word) may be the resultant indicator of this force.

If you want to know what I really believe can be found at
http://forums.astronomydaily.com/vie...er=asc&start=0
There is enough there to have me locked up but I believe there is a pressure and have said such.
What I do not believe is that there is any force of attraction..anywhere.. We name something that does not exist .. dont ask me how I see the forces observed in a magnet I can not find any way that two bodies can transmit such information between them.. its a long story as they say .. I think attraction it is a mere false conclusion not tested by experiment .. pushing is it in my Universe .
Thanks for sharing your thoughts .
alex

[ispom]

What is the matter with the "dark matter",
no satisfactorilyexplanation till now,
but the String Theory has such one:

The LXD (Large Extra Dimension, the 4th spatioal dimension) influence events in our world,
such that three of the four interactions "which hold our world together" (QED, QCD, Weak) are constrained on the 4 "old" dimensions and only the fourth interaction, the gravity, can propagate into all dimensions.

If energy can be emitted into the LXD by gravitational waves should also be detectable in high energy collisions with the LHC (Large Hadron collider) in 2008.
Similar to the impact of two billard balls, emerging shock waves (sound waves in billard, gravitational waves or gravitons in particle collisions) are not constrained on the dimensions in which the impact takes place (the billard table - our world).

The so far successful standard model of particle physics has no explanation for the not visible "Dark Matter" and can therefore predict virtually nothing on the much bigger part of the mass existing in the universe!
But with LXD of the ST, heavy objects need not to be seen where the gravitating mass is located, because gravitons are able to propagate into the extra dimensions, but photons are not.

large extra greetings from Ispom

[xelasnave]

Thanks for that input . It must be obvious to all by now what ever the position I will probably disagree .
I dont buy the extra dimention thing. I dont accept gravity is a weak force it is merely at this point incorrectly quantified.
If dark matter exists they better send a craft out to get some I recon..if it is so "there" they better take a car trailer there will be so much. I am cynical of anything that does not see it my way ..how human is that .
I love finding out about all the stuff that the really bright folk are doing ..magnificent stuff and great to see we are trying so hard for answers.
Thanks again. Hows the cat dept I can offer you one of six genuine Australian very special cats er kittens ..I can send photos
alex