Webcam options for autoguiding

jbloggz (Joe) · #1 08-07-2016, 09:35 PM

I've recently bought a neq6 to get into imaging and I'm starting to think about autoguiding in the future (I'll probably get some experience with unguided images for a while).

What are the options these days for webcams that can be used for autoguiding? What's the cheapest autoguiding camera that you can get away with these days (and still get good results)? I imagine I would use it with a 80 x 400mm guide scope.

Visionoz (Bill) · #2 10-07-2016, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbloggz

I've recently bought a neq6 to get into imaging and I'm starting to think about autoguiding in the future (I'll probably get some experience with unguided images for a while).

What are the options these days for webcams that can be used for autoguiding? What's the cheapest autoguiding camera that you can get away with these days (and still get good results)? I imagine I would use it with a 80 x 400mm guide scope.

IIRC - Philips SPC900NC Webcam with 1.25" Nosepiece is suitable and sometimes sold here for aro $60-$80 used... but why bother when you can get used autoguider cams like the QHY5 or Orion Starshoot Autoguiders for aro $150-$180 used.

HTH
Cheers
Bill

jbloggz (Joe) · #3 11-07-2016, 11:14 PM

I've seen the Phillips webcam mentioned in various places, however it seems quite hard to find. Does anyone know of any other sub $100 options, or is that unrealistic?

Is there a good reason why some auto guiding cameras cost over $500? Whats so good about these cameras? I guess I just assumed that an autoguiding camera wouldn't need to be very fancy.

StuTodd · #4 11-07-2016, 11:23 PM

Have a look around other forums

You can pick good cameras up from cloudynights, ebay, astromart and astrobuysell.com easily, just ask about shipping to Aussie or wherever you are (mentioning at your cost has always swung it for me).

$100 is maybe pushing it but I struck lucky in NZ by finding a SPC900NC from a "normal" who happened to be having a clear out of his garage. $NZ45

Hunt around but I have always found brand new CCD cameras to be way over priced..generally.

Stu

troypiggo (Troy) · #5 12-07-2016, 06:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbloggz

I've seen the Phillips webcam mentioned in various places, however it seems quite hard to find. Does anyone know of any other sub $100 options, or is that unrealistic?

Is there a good reason why some auto guiding cameras cost over $500? Whats so good about these cameras? I guess I just assumed that an autoguiding camera wouldn't need to be very fancy.

I started with a the Phillips webcam. They do work, but they're not designed for imaging stars, they're webcams. Images are noisy and can be difficult for the guiding software to find suitable guide stars with suitable signal/noise ratio.

I then thought I'd get a better cam that can do planetary imaging and double as a guide cam - the Imaging Source DBK21. Again, it worked for guiding, but it's not specifically designed for that. It's meant for fast frame rates on brighter targets like planets, so again S/N on guide stars wasn't always perfect.

The slightly more expensive guide cams like the QHY5 are specifically designed for guiding, and have cleaner images, better signal/noise ratio for guide stars.

If you're serious about getting into astrophotography, I'd recommend pony up for the slightly better guide cam. You'll end up going that way sooner or later anyway, and save yourself some heartache and $100 in the long run (ie it's an investment, even if costs a little more now).

sil (Steve) · #6 12-07-2016, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by troypiggo

If you're serious about getting into astrophotography, I'd recommend pony up for the slightly better guide cam. You'll end up going that way sooner or later anyway, and save yourself some heartache and $100 in the long run (ie it's an investment, even if costs a little more now).

so true!

ZeroID (Brent) · #7 12-07-2016, 10:14 AM

The SPC880\900 is an old product now, you won't find new. It's big advantage was that it was capable of being modified for long exposure. The chips and board were relatively easy to get at. I've got one floating around downstairs unmodified. It was not a great guide camera as has been said, noisy, but software was available that could give some degree of control. Hence it's popularity.

Prostar has been mentioned in another thread as both a reasonably cheap guide camera but also an entry level imaging camera. Might be worth looking into.

jbloggz (Joe) · #8 12-07-2016, 12:21 PM

thanks for the help everyone.
I guess my assumptions about guiding cameras being simple/cheap was wrong.
I did notice the prostar guigin cameras were selling for a little over $200 (PS-LPGUIDE-C or PS-LPGUIDE-M). If these are considered good for guiding then that might be a good start.

Is there any difference in performance using the monochrome vs colour one? Is one considered better for guiding?

troypiggo (Troy) · #9 12-07-2016, 01:47 PM

Mono will be more sensitive

jbloggz (Joe) · #10 12-07-2016, 08:43 PM

I assume that more sensitive = better for guiding?

I also just noticed also for around the $200 mark is the ZWO ASI034MC, which claims to be good for guiding too. Anyone have any experience with either this one or the ProStar ones?

EDIT: Just found this thread, which talks about the ProStar one

PRejto (Peter) · #11 12-07-2016, 09:17 PM

It's important to consider pixel size. The ZWO is probably a good camera but it has small pix. Thus, for a long FL the resolution will be too high. You really need to consider this and whether the camera can bin as well. Larger pix = greater sensitivity = higher price. You get what you pay for!

Peter

mswhin63 (Malcolm) · #12 12-07-2016, 11:44 PM

I currently have a Webcamera that is constructed and fits quite well int my finders scope. It is not high level stuff, but i have been able to get some really good images from it.

https://goo.gl/photos/jCA3fLiPihFumRnK9

http://www.liquiddigital.com.au/#!pr...c-47fab5fcf9fe

ZeroID (Brent) · #13 13-07-2016, 07:00 AM

I'd suggest the OSC is better for a starter as it is certainly sensitive enough for autoguiding and as you learn it will work as a OSC DSO camera later. Moving straight to mono imaging would be a big ask although if it's just as a guider and you go DSLR as an imaging option it doesn't matter.

I'm using my ASI120MC as a guider now on an 80F5, planning to get the ASI1600MC Cooled as my next big step. Currently using the 1200D unmodified and working well.

troypiggo (Troy) · #14 13-07-2016, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbloggz

I assume that more sensitive = better for guiding?
...

Correct. Any imaging, including guide frames, are all about maximising signal to noise ratio with the gear/money/time you have.

jbloggz (Joe) · #15 13-07-2016, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Moving straight to mono imaging would be a big ask although if it's just as a guider and you go DSLR as an imaging option it doesn't matter.

I have a decent DLSR (Canon 750D), so it would be just for guiding.

Does anyone know is there is a noticeable difference with PS-LPGUIDE-C vs PS-LPGUIDE-M. Is the M model able to find much dimmer stars?

Visionoz (Bill) · #16 13-07-2016, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbloggz

...

Does anyone know is there is a noticeable difference with PS-LPGUIDE-C vs PS-LPGUIDE-M. Is the M model able to find much dimmer stars?

Why not contact Steve Massey directly on the phone and have a chat with him about his Prostar cams; found him to be extremely straightforward and "he's a no bull, not trying to flog you something" type of person and he'll let you know exactly what you need to know...

Just my experience and MHO only - YMMV

HTH
Cheers
Bill