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Old 18-01-2014, 03:17 PM
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phobos27 (Nick)
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Skywatcher Refractor Ed100 vs Skywatcher 250mm Reflector

Hi,

What is the difference between having such a small diameter (100mm) on the refractor vs the (250mm) diameter on the reflector? The smaller of the 2 is $400 more than the 250mm. Why is this? Is it better? Are they both as good as each other on a NEQ6 mount? Which ones is better for astrophotography?

That was a lot of questions but if you could answer any that would be helpful!

Regards Nick!

+I would primarily use the scope for astrophotography.
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Old 18-01-2014, 05:00 PM
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barx1963 (Malcolm)
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Very good question! We often hear it said that aperture is king, so why would a smaller scope for similar or more $$$ be used.
The answer is complex and has a number of facets. Firstly, why is a 100 refractor more expensive than a 250mm reflector? Well a lense has 2 optical surfaces that need figuring, while a mirror only has 1, so each lense needs a minimum of twice the time to make. Also small faults in the glass of smaller mirrors will not affect the optical performance unless the are on the surface, while for a lense the glass must be near perfect right through. Also modern refractors use multiple elements which increases the surfaces to be figured. AND refractors have to be collimated in factory while a manufacturer of a reflector leaves that to the end user.
A high quality refractor can hive advantages over a reflector over and above light grasp. Not having a central obstruction improves contrast, they don't need collimation each time they are used, coma is usually not an issue, thought other aberations, particularly colour fringing etc can be evident in non apochromatic refractors of shorter focal length.

Malcolm
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Old 18-01-2014, 05:11 PM
raymo
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There is another factor to consider. The 250mm reflector is faster than
the ED100, and also has over 6 times the light gathering ability, which
means much shorter exposures for those with for whatever reason,
limited guiding ability.
raymo.
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Old 18-01-2014, 05:22 PM
SkyWatch (Dean)
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Good quality refractors are always more expensive than reflectors because the manufacturing process is longer and more complex, and the types of exotic glass used cost more.
There are many different opinions about which is "better": but it is always true that, all else being equal, larger apertures gather more light and give brighter images at the same magnification. A larger aperture will potentially give finer resolution as well: although this will not generally be noticed in low power images. For visual use you will definitely see fainter objects in a 250mm scope vs a 100mm. For AP use it wont make much difference as you can take longer images, gathering more light to compensate for the smaller aperture.
A good refractor will generally give cleaner star images and better contrast than a reflector, due to the central obstruction of the secondary mirror in the reflector. The reflector will also show "spiked" stars because of the vanes holding the secondary mirror. This means the refractor may give a more aesthetically "pleasing" visual image, and for this reason many people are refractor afficionados (myself included).
For AP, both should give you great images but the lighter of the scopes may perform better as the mount isn't straining as much to push it around. Generally, if you want to do AP, you don't want to go much above 50% of the mount's rated capacity.
The ED100 is I believe f9, while the 250 is f4.8 or 6 (seem to be different ones out there). The faster the focal ratio, the less time you need to capture an image: so the 250 would win easily on that score.
However, I will leave it to the AP experts to comment further.
All the best,

Dean

PS: I was writing this while the other guys posted: but I agree with their comments.

Last edited by SkyWatch; 18-01-2014 at 05:24 PM. Reason: added PS
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Old 18-01-2014, 05:34 PM
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phobos27 (Nick)
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Thanks for all the advice but do you think it is worth the extra money for the 'better' optics? Better was put in apostrophe's for a reason...
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Old 18-01-2014, 05:51 PM
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cometcatcher (Kevin)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phobos27 View Post
... do you think it is worth the extra money for the 'better' optics?....
No. Not unless (as mentioned above) you really hate diffraction spikes on photos. They won't bother you with visual use.

The big reflector is much better bang for your $$$ both for visual use and photo use, as long as you don't mind a collimation adjustment every now and then. Refractors are pretty much maintenance free.
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Old 19-01-2014, 03:15 PM
SkyWatch (Dean)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phobos27 View Post
Thanks for all the advice but do you think it is worth the extra money for the 'better' optics? Better was put in apostrophe's for a reason...
For visual work the reflector will enable you to see a lot more in terms of fainter DSO's. If you want to do mainly AP it will enable you to take quicker exposures because of its much better light-gathering ability and faster optics. However, the mount is rated to 20kg, and the OTA alone is around 15kg from what I can see- so while it will be fine for visual work it is big and heavy and, with a camera, finderscope, autoguiding camera etc. it will push the mount to its limit. As I mentioned previously, the rule of thumb for AP is around 1/2 of the rated load of the mount.
If you have an observatory and don't have to set up every time it would probably be OK- but if you don't, and AP is your goal, you should think long and hard about the refractor instead. It is much lighter and easier to lug around and set up, and the mount wont be strained to cope with the load.
I would recommend you have a look through both types of scopes before you buy- say at a local club- and talk to astro-photographers...
Good luck!
- Dean

PS: the other thing that I haven't seen mentioned is cool-down time. The 250 mm mirror will take longer to cool down than the refractor, and this will affect the quality of your images until it reaches ambient temperature. You will probably want to install a fan to cool the mirror quickly. Again, in an observatory this wont be as much of an issue.

Last edited by SkyWatch; 19-01-2014 at 03:20 PM. Reason: added PS.
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Old 19-01-2014, 03:45 PM
raymo
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You could always go with a 200mm Newt; still 4x the light gathering ability, and well within the limit for your mount; and MUCH less
cumbersome to use.
raymo
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Old 19-01-2014, 04:54 PM
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cometcatcher (Kevin)
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+1 to what Ray said.

The F9 refractor is a little slow with DSLR's for all but the brightest objects and the 250mm reflector probably needs an EQ8.
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