Eyepiece help

[Quoll (Bill)]

Hi Again

As promised in my Intro posting in the “Beginners Talk” forum, I’ve some questions I would appreciate help with.

As mentioned in my earlier Intro posting, we have a Skywatcher 8” Dobsonian (1200mm f5.9) which came with Skywatcher 10mm and 25mm “super” EPs which are obviously not top of the range, so we would like to replace them with something better without breaking the bank (my other pastime is photography and it takes care of that!).

The more I read on EPs the more confused I become, so any advice people can offer would be much appreciated. We will mainly be observing the moon and planets from our light polluted suburban site, but we’re hoping to fit in a few trips to dark sky sites to pursue DSOs. We also just like scanning the sky to see what we discover.

The replacement EPs under consideration are Mead series 5000 HD-60 EPs, available in 9mm, 12mm, 18mm and 25mm ($99.00 each Bintel) but I’m not sure what sizes to get. There is a 9mm and a 25mm as straight replacements, but I’m not sure that’s the best way to go. I’ve read somewhere that 12mm is the scopes “sweet spot”?

The blurb says the Meads are 6 element, have 60 degrees AFOV and “more than” 17mm eye relief. Do people recommend Meads? Any Mead 5000 HD-60 users out there?

I’ve read good reports about the 2” Bintel/GSO Superview EPs and I’d like one of them for what I believe to be their larger FOV and brighter images. Would probably go for the 30mm. The problem is I can’t Barlow them with the 1.25” Barlow we have.

So our options are (1) get the 9mm and 25mm Meads which we can Barlow and forget about the Superview. (2) get the Superview and the 9mm and 25mm Meads (3) get the Superview and two Meads but not necessarily the 9mm and 25mm (4) some other option?

The other option is to get a different brand of eyepiece altogether – any recommendations within the same price range, or cheaper? I have no idea how to judge EPs apart from price. I’m assuming the pricier EPS are better quality, although I’m aware this might always not be the case.

Choosing EPs is like trying to choose toothpaste in the supermarket – too much choice

Cheers, Bill

[StutzJr]

I have the 6" version of the same skywatcher dob and it came with the same EP's. I have since got a GSO 2.5x barlow and 15mm super plossl eyepiece and am pretty happy with those in combination with the existing "super" kellner ones. I also got the GSO 8x50 right angle finderscope. I cannot fault any of the GSO parts I've bought, they're good enough for me.

[barx1963 (Malcolm)]

Hey Bill
Firstly you will find that visual observers have a wide range of opinions on what are the best eyepieces. Personally I love using Televue ones, but they can be a bit expensive.
My usual advice is use the ones you have as much as possible until you are a little more experienced and you can make a more informed (and often less expensive!) choice.
That said my advice if you are on a budget is to keep the 25mm that came with the scope as a low power EP.
The 25mm Plossl (and I have had both SW and GSO ones) are generally pretty good, especially as essentially a freebie!
The 10mm on the other hand can be hard to use, not much eye relief and a really small exit pupil. Remember if you barlow the 25 you have a 12.5mm anyway which is pretty good power at 96x anyway with better eye relief.

I am loath to give any recommendation beyond that as you are on a budget and my experience is with EPs that are probably more than you are prepared to spend, having not used the Meades you mention I cannot comment on those. I will note that 60deg against the 50deg of a plossl is not a huge jump.

Malcolm

[Allan_L (Allan)]

Hi Bill,

(from my limited experience)

As Malcolm suggested, opinions on eyepieces can be very varied and heated.
When I started out, like many, I wanted high magnification EPs for planetary detail. I soon found the plossls were difficult to use below say 12mm. For example: I bought a 4mm and it was worse than trying to look through a straw.

I got some good results from under $100 each from some ED eyepieces (probably Synta) especially for high magnification planetary work, with decent eye relief and exit pupil. I still have a 5.2mm that I pull out occasionally for planetary.

Next up the scale, I bought some William Optics eps for just over $100 and found these very reasonable quality. I still have a SW 20mm with 72*FOV, nice, and light to boot. But they seem more tailored to DSOs.

After that I tried Vixen LVW; Baadar; and Televue.
These are all superior eyepieces ...
But they are all in the $300+ vicinity.
and Like Malcolm, I keep coming back to Televue.

What you should do is get along to a few observing nights near you, talk to people, and try a few of their EPs in your scope. Then you will know what to expect, what you can see, and if the extra $$$ are worth it for you. And you may decide not to compromise on Better now, but make do with what you have for now and to start saving for Best in the future. (Advice designed to save money in the long run, and that not many of us take [myself included].)

[louie_the_fly (Stew)]

Remember that when you Barlow your ep's you effectively double your ep collection. Albiet with some loss of optical quality ( I find). I have an older meade series 5000 super plossl. I find it to be pretty good. I have a few shorter plossls as well. I bought a short 1.25" 70º widefield plossl from an IIS member a while back. For what it cost it's excellent. I also have a 2" bintel 30mm superview which I think is great value for money. I use it quite a bit, except it does my neck in because I don't have a 2" diagonal yet. My next purchase. Good for DSO's. Resist the urge to lash out. Try a few before buying if you can.

[Quoll (Bill)]

Thanks everybody for taking the time to respond to my post, much appreciated. I think it’s the photographer in me looking for sharp images that has me so fixated on quality EPs. My son is happy with what we have, and of course my granddaughter is over the moon with what she can see. So decided to stick with the EPs we have for now.

New to the forum so not sure how to insert quotes to reply to each of you in one posting so I’ll do it this way:

StutzJr: My order is in for an 8X50 right angle finder scope, the straight through scope is a real pain.

Malcolm: Yes, I’m quite happy barlowing the 25mm, I find it very easy on my eyes compared to the 10mm. My son has no problem with the 10mm, perhaps it’s just my old eyes, or maybe the photographer in me is looking for shaper images than he is happy with.

Allan: I’m hoping to get along to a few observing nights and talk to other people about their EPs. Appreciate the “advice designed to save money in the long run” – I wish you had told me that before I got into photography though, which has similar traps to astronomy.

Stewart: As you can see I have mange to “resist the urge to lash out”. I still find the 2” 30mm superview an attractive proposition, considering the price and might just give it a go.

[barx1963 (Malcolm)]

Excellent Bill
The point about "old eyes" is really important. At my age my pupil can only dilute to about 5mm, but a 20yo can dilate to 7mm or more. May not sound much of a difference but it makes position your eye over a small exit pupil on the eyepiece much easier of you have a big pupil.

Malcolm

[David Niven (David Niven)]

Hi Bill,

Just starting off, I would stay away from buying expensive eyepieces till a bit later.
During my early days, I upgraded to a pair of William Optics Swan eps.
They cost $110 each then but Vti Optics selling them for $70 now.
They are good to begin with and easy on your wallet.
Try not to catch the fever with eyepiece or you will end up collecting instead of using them. I reckon 5 is more than you will ever need.
Enjoy!

[Quoll (Bill)]

Hi David

Sound advice - although what we mean by “expensive” EPs can mean different things to different people. I agree with your comment: “Try not to catch the fever with eyepieces or you will end up collecting instead of using them”.

Without catching the fever, all I’m interested in is getting some better quality EPs to replace the ones that were supplied with the scope - without spending heaps. I’m not interested in top of the range EPs because I don’t think I’m ever going to get into astronomy that deeply (at least that’s what I’m thinking at this stage) that I would be justified in spending that sort of money on the hobby (assuming of course that I had that sort of money to spare).

I will probably just end up being what could be called a “casual astronomer”. My main hobby is photography, which I combine with other interests, and there’s no problem with that soaking up any spare cash I have. My son and granddaughter also share the scope and if they end up pursuing astronomy further then they might want to consider top of the range EPs, but that’s not the case at this stage. My son currently works fly-in-fly-out (FIFO), which doesn’t give him lots of opportunities for observing/pursuing astronomy.

As you can imagine, I’ve been scouring the web to garner all the information/knowledge I can on EPs. I came across an article on EPs on another forum which made interesting reading. I quote here in full the introduction to the article:


“I have considered the question of what a person needs in his eyepiece kit, as a bare minimum, for quite a while. Personally, I don’t have a lot of disposable income, and I recognize that a lot of amateur astronomers are getting along on a shoestring budget. So, if you can afford to go out and buy a full set of Naglers, or even Radians, go ahead, this article isn’t for you. It is for those of us who have to choose between a new eyepiece and a new spring jacket and are already garnering disapproving looks from our partners for buying that natty little refractor at a higher price than they really, truly expected.”


Cheers, Bill

[AstralTraveller (David)]

I can't add too much as I haven't used the eps you are asking about. But:

* The Meade series 4000 are supposed to be better than the 5000s. In fact the 14mm 4000 gets very good reviews.
* If you want cheap good quality eps for planets don't forget orthoscopics - provided you can deal with the limited eye relief. I love my UO orthos, though even I find the 5mm uncomfortable. The 7mm eats my Celestron 7.5mm 'silver top' for breakfast.
* I have a GSO 9mm, an Andrews 9.5 ED and now a 9mm Nagler (Type VI). Naturally I use the Nagler (and the ED for public viewing nights). My side by side comparison (done a long time ago) rated the on-axis views as Nagler 10, the ED 8.5-9 and the GSO 5-6. Naturally you get more fov with the Nagler.

[Marios (Marios)]

Don't go past the Baader hyperion EP's for Excellent mid level quality with good eye relief and threads for Camera.
On sale at http://agenaastro.com

[Quoll (Bill)]

Hi David & Marios

Thanks for the input.

I'm suffering a bit from information overload at the moment, so I'm going to step back a bit and give myself time to digest it all before I make any decisions about buying EPs.

Cheers, Bill