A light pollution discusion area?

[JB80 (Jarrod)]

Hi all,
After reading a recent topic in the general section and then going back through some archives and looking for further info on the web it is clear that there is not a huge amount of practical info about light pollution in Australia available.
It also seems that it is totally off of the radar of the public, local councils, electric companies and even the government. There is no real mention of it in the Environment Protection Agency website(depending on your state), no mention of it on my former local councils(West Torrens) website and there doesn't seem to be many if any agencies or campaign groups out there to give much practical advice on how to deal with light trespass.

So this got me thinking that it could be a good opportunity for IIS to offer up a small section of the forum to discuss light pollution.

I think it would be good to have a place where say people can share their experiences in dealing with it, whether it be they had a light shield installed to a simple chat with a neighbour or about the 'correct way' to deal with the local authorities.
People should know there rights regarding to LP and it could be a good place to inform them of it.
Maybe there is a local campaign to switch off lights past a certain time that people can get involved with.

People can post both positive and negative experiences but in reading the positives and having them documented you can easily check to see if there is a precedent set in your area.

I also think it would be good to post any news articles related to LP that come up and think it would be good to post any studies or laws that mention LP to have these documents at hand.

Lets not forget light pollution is not just an issue for astronomy, think of the massive waste of energy and taxpayer money.
There can also be serious detrimental health effects to not only animals but humans due to excessive lighting.
I think the forum should cover all of the side effects not just astro related.

Sorry to ramble on but it was just an idea I had, what do people think?

[mithrandir (Andrew)]

Jarrod, solissydney (Ken) is in SOLIS (Sydney Outdoor Lighting Improvement Society). You can expect him to chip in at some point.

[gaa_ian (Ian)]

Hi Jarrod
There are opportunities to intervene.
My club was one of 16 respondents to an EIS an a new development and we were successful in getting full cut off fittings used in a number of locations.
The IDA (International Dark Sky Association) is activ ein this area,
I am with you, it is important on a number of fronts !

[JB80 (Jarrod)]

Thanks Andrew and Ian for the replies.

It would be great if Ken could chime in and give his thoughts too.

Ian, that's just the sort of thing I'm talking about. It'd be great to have an area of the forum where these type of opportunities can be discussed especially from people who have experience in those matters and can offer links and contacts etc...
It's all about awareness in the end.

[mswhin63 (Malcolm)]

Overall I feel that a national organisation need to be established with the right Incorporation to have any real impact on governing policies. Affiliation with IDA would be a must as well.

It would also need active participation too. Organisations are a dime a dozen and some well marketed can be very effective in getting action.
As mentioned the AS are fairly weak in getting action down but as I found there are some aspects that action can be taken. Usually the first successful action taken from an organisation member can lead to successive actions then finally a standard being enforced.

I was in such a position where I had 5 street lights beaming into my back yard an was able to at least get some information on state government policy before I had to move. In that case there was a real opportunity to allow me to get something done but could never really test it.

[JQ (John)]

The topic does not seem to be stirring a great deal of interest at least in terms of what can be done about it. My 2 bobs worth is more story-telling than anything else and it's personal at that. The Brisbane City Council has a right of way for pedestrians that runs up the side of our land. It's about 150 metres long and has a string of bright lights along it. The result is that we are flooded (OK not quite flooded) with extraneous light. I am thinking of trying to get the lights shielded so light does not intrude quite so much onto our property. The result of all the light is, of course, that it hinders observations. I have been told (not by BCC) the only real chance we have of getting shields put on is to make a case for disturbance to sleep. I have found BCC quite responsive in the past to matters raised so let's hope this time too.

If anything transpires I'll let you know.

John

[multiweb (Marc)]

Here's what it looks like in Sydney to date. Not much we can do about it. Just look for the darker spots still within reasonable driving distance.

[Phil Hart]

Originally Posted by multiweb

Here's what it looks like in Sydney to date. Not much we can do about it. Just look for the darker spots still within reasonable driving distance.

That's a great image Marc.. is there a page where you can do the same thing for anywhere in Oz?

On the thread's theme, the Astronomical Society of Victoria also has an Outdoor Lighting Improvement group led by Barry Clark who tirelessly makes submissions to councils/governments on proposals with adverse lighting effects.

Phil

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by philiphart

That's a great image Marc.. is there a page where you can do the same thing for anywhere in Oz?

On the thread's theme, the Astronomical Society of Victoria also has an Outdoor Lighting Improvement group led by Barry Clark who tirelessly makes submissions to councils/governments on proposals with adverse lighting effects.

Phil

Not really. I did that one for my own record to check dark(er) spots within my area. I'm on the A pin. The light comes from a recent satellite picture at night time that I googled so the colors are also real. I just worked out the overlay on a current Googlemap snapshot then blended a few layers to show the LP and still be able to recognise the streets and structures. What's interesting is that the LP is actually moving west and the CBD lights don't affect me as much as recent local developments. Everything that has a 'park' in the name is an industrial area. Biggest culprits IMHO. Residential impact seems to be minimal although it contributes.

In short if there was some kind of legislation to limit overnight lighting in unoccupied industrial buildings and car parks at night I reckon we'd cut our LP in half without jeopardizing suburbs lighting if they want to keep it there, the argument being security, etc...

[naskies (Dave)]

Originally Posted by philiphart

That's a great image Marc.. is there a page where you can do the same thing for anywhere in Oz?

Phil,

The Blue Marble website has the worldwide maps integrated into Google Maps:

http://www.blue-marble.de/nightlights/2010
http://www.blue-marble.de/nightlights/2012

The 2012 version is higher resolution, but it's also the recently controversial version (it's more like a "star trails" equivalent of light pollution rather than snapshot - so it over-estimates in the regional areas that have had bush fires etc).

[Phil Hart]

Originally Posted by naskies

Phil,

The Blue Marble website has the worldwide maps integrated into Google Maps:

http://www.blue-marble.de/nightlights/2010
http://www.blue-marble.de/nightlights/2012

The 2012 version is higher resolution, but it's also the recently controversial version (it's more like a "star trails" equivalent of light pollution rather than snapshot - so it over-estimates in the regional areas that have had bush fires etc).

Thanks Dave.. I'd seen those original images when they came out but the integration with google maps. Very handy and much more up to date than what I had been using.