lookin lookin Meade Series4000, S5000, SuperWideAngle or UltraWA

[The3rdKind (John)]

Hello good folk of IIS,

I'm looking for a kit form of the Meade series 4000 (or 5000 but pricier I guess).

I say kit because these usually come with the Barlow and filters and a fairly respectable array of EP powers.

I've found something approaching Zen at star optics on the Gold Coast but these are standard FOV (52 deg Super Plossl).

Ideally, they will have the yellow writing on the side of the EP (if it's white its been made in a toy factory). They will also ideally have from 60 to 80 FOV. It doesn't necesarrily have to be in a kit but this would be easier .

If anyone can help out please let me know

[renormalised (Carl)]

Bintel....Series 4000, $359....Series 5000, $429, $859 (UWA ep's)

[The3rdKind (John)]

Originally Posted by renormalised

Bintel....Series 4000, $359....Series 5000, $429, $859 (UWA ep's)

Hi Carl,

Thanx mate, I've been to that site but I beleive I can get the s4000 in SWA and/ or UWA in the 6-8 element range (I might be bonkers but did hear this!!).

Are yours 52 deg apparent and does apparent mean that technically they are wider FOV than 52 deg?? Are yours 4 element or more??

Also if that is the case are they superior to the two plossle EP's that came with my Skywatcher (specs down below-no name Brand). I really am craving a wider FOV in the 1.25" range but of course correction and sharpness at the edges). Maybe I should go with the s5000 range of 2" and purchase Barlow to suit

[Suzy]

Woohoo Johnno you're finally getting w/angle ep's! I knew it would be a matter of time .

[renormalised (Carl)]

John....mine are 4 element ep's with the 52 degree apparent views. However they're probably a little more than that. If you want really wide FoV's, go for the series 5000 ep's.

[Paddy (Patrick)]

Hi John,

I wonder if kits are the best way to go. I have no experience with Meade eyepieces, so I wouldn't comment on this line in particular. But in my limited experience and from the reading of many posts on the subject, some ep lines do better at some focal lengths than others. And this varies from scope to scope. For example, I have been very happy with my 9 & 13 mm T6 Naglers, but gathered the 16mm T6 has very tight eye relief. So I paid a bit more and got a 17mm T4 Nagler which I really like. Comparing it with the T6 16 mm at the last VicSouth star party in my 16" f4.9, I was very happy with this decision. Comparing the 2 eps in Tim Nott's 22" f3.6, the T6 was superior optically and clearly better suited to the faster scope than the T4 was.

Also you might miss out on some of the very good deals on second hand eps on this forum.

It might be worth working out which focal lengths you use most, have a look through some different eps in your scope at a star party and wait and watch the forum. You will also get a good idea of how much FOV vs eye relief means to you. Good glass is a very good investment.

[The3rdKind (John)]

Hi Paddy,

Thanks for the advice. I am a little concerned, myself, about grabbing a kit for around $350.00, Meade or otherwise, and ending up with half the EP's unusable in my 10" f5 (f4.72).

With my scope, my 25mm is most used as I'm always on the lookout for clusters and nebulae, not to mention galaxies (eg Sombrero M104). However I get frustrated as I want to get closer and obviously still keep a decent FOV. When I drill down to a 10mm this becomes an issue.

I recently borrowed a friend's Meade 18mm s4000 SWA (6 element I think, maybe 8) and was immediately impressed. Both in terms of 68 deg FOV appar. (I dont really want wider until my 20" SDM pipe dream comes true ) and the resolution. Not to mention the finer focusing ability this gave to my Crayford. Really pinpoint wide views and no coma/astigmatism. Colour was great and natural. So begins my Odyssey. I was looking at Star Optics here on the Gold Coast and they have a kit of s4000 Meades but they are 52* and 4 element. The filters and barlow are what drew me in, but I'm thinking now that these are cheap enough to by at individual purchase.

Alex (Mental) gave me a rundown of EP's that have great specs through Andrew's Communications but I don't want to get into a kaleidoscope of EP's in my collection as it's too easy to treat one as a favourite and poo poo the others. My EP collection is a work in progress and I like to work all the EP's in my collection regularly. There is plenty of opportunity to do this on any given night. So this is the other major attraction for a kit.

The other thing I feel I want to do is make a commitment at this stage of the hobby to either 1 1/4" or 2" and build a decent collection from there. This is based on some comments of another friend who owns a 20" SDM. But he works with 2" Naglers and the like at $900 a pop.

Therefore now I'm thinking the Meade s5000 EP range. Star Optics has a kit but there are only 3 in it all 2" and all with 8 element lenses. A whopping 100* FOV has me wondering about overkill in my little 10".

I've a deep love for planetary and lunar but my fast scope is not ultimately suited (don't worry I'm looking at a slow 8" refractor for this-Another Pipe Dream).

We're talking economies of scale here as I'm a broke mature age student scraping through an IT Diploma. I guess all of this blah blah is a reaction to my situation and an acknowledgement of people like yourself and Mental and that I'm not just trying out your opinions but giving my side of the coin and saying I want to make miracles happen on a real tight budget.

I like menatls advice about learning more about eye physiology and making the most of what you've got. I like your advice about being patient and seeing what might end up cascading off the rainbow.

I'm really comfortable with second hand as I know from club experience that amateur astronomers have a tacit ability to look after their gear.

So, some filters (broadband) a good 2x Barlow and say a couple of high power (3 & 5mm), midrange (15 & 18mm) and Low (30 & 35mm) possibly in 2" category would be a go.

Actually, I feel a need to close this thread and start a new one with these specs in mind and hope that one day someone will have something to sell to a guy who knows how to take care of them.

Thanks again Paddy, (hope I haven't put you to sleep)

Cheers,

John

[Paddy (Patrick)]

Hi John,

You didn't put me to sleep. I'm interested to know what your thoughts are. And I appreciate your budget issues if you're studying. I'm glad you've looked through some of the eps that you're considering. I'm not sure why you want all your eps to have the same barrel diameter. I also wonder whether you would get that much joy from having eyepiece focal lengths so close together ie 3 & 5, 13 & 18, 30 & 35. Rather than 6 eyepieces, you might do better with 2-3 and a barlow. You might be able to affordably go wider with FOV if that's the case. I also wouldn't discount good eyepieces for your 10" scope. The longer you have them, the more value you get out of them. And many of us have eyepiece collections that are worth more than the telescope.

Anyway, I know you said you want to close the thread so I'll leave it there. Good luck with your hunt for good glass.

[dannat (Daniel)]

i agree with paddy - stick with 2-3 really good ep's you will use nearly all of the time..its finding the 3 that suit you & your budget which is the problem..the best thing is to goto a star party -trial 20-30 different ep's and then make a decision..i had a meade SWA 16mm , great views but the twist-up cup & short eye relief annoyed me no end - so i got rid of it - even though i really liked the views it gave. I since leanrt you can just cut the twist up eye cup off - which i would have done had i known

[The3rdKind (John)]

Originally Posted by dannat

i agree with paddy - stick with 2-3 really good ep's you will use nearly all of the time..its finding the 3 that suit you & your budget which is the problem..the best thing is to goto a star party -trial 20-30 different ep's and then make a decision..

Originally Posted by Paddy

Hi John,

I'm not sure why you want all your eps to have the same barrel diameter. I also wonder whether you would get that much joy from having eyepiece focal lengths so close together ie 3 & 5, 13 & 18, 30 & 35. Rather than 6 eyepieces, you might do better with 2-3 and a barlow. You might be able to affordably go wider with FOV if that's the case. I also wouldn't discount good eyepieces for your 10" scope. The longer you have them, the more value you get out of them. And many of us have eyepiece collections that are worth more than the telescope.

Anyway, I know you said you want to close the thread so I'll leave it there. Good luck with your hunt for good glass.

Thank you my brothers,

Yes I can see that similar powers is a little redundant. In fact this has reminded me of something else that Alex said which is pretty important. The higher to medium powers (a 5mm and an 18mm for example) would do well with say a 60 to 68 FOV and about 6-8 element. Then say a 30mm or 35mm 2" with similar FOV complimented with a good quality 2" Barlow. In effect 2 x 1.25", 1 x 2", and 2" 2x Barlow.
Am I getting warmer??? I think so

Furthermore, I am going to the Qld Astrofest in August . I do have a budget but, if I go, EP buying is dust. Additionally, despite Queensland's tropical image these events are COLD . So, my budget will be blown on Thermo clothing and added expenses as this will be my maiden voyage.

However, it is an investment in EP's in one respect. I am going to work the group like it hasn't been worked before coz I'm going to be trying out more EP's than a Lady in a Milliner's Shoppe on Melbourne Cup Day .

So, for now I'll hold off on the classifieds until Mid-August. In actual fact, I'll let this thread die its natural death (ie keep it open for further input, if forthcoming) but I think that your advice cannot be priced. You've really helped me out something fierce. Paddy, I agree, good glass is the only way to move forward (after all, the best chefs only ever owned the one set of knives). Daniel, bad karma on the eye cup but I feel you're in for a dose of good vibes very soon.

Thanks again and I look forward to further tweaking

Cheers, John

(PS do you get my relief)

[Paddy (Patrick)]

Originally Posted by The3rdKind

The higher to medium powers (a 5mm and an 18mm for example) would do well with say a 60 to 68 FOV and about 6-8 element. Then say a 30mm or 35mm 2" with similar FOV complimented with a good quality 2" Barlow. In effect 2 x 1.25", 1 x 2", and 2" 2x Barlow.
Am I getting warmer??? I think so

I think so too. It all sounds a very good plan.