Go Back   IceInSpace > Equipment > Equipment Discussions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
  #1  
Old 11-04-2008, 11:34 AM
g__day's Avatar
g__day (Matthew)
Tech Guru

g__day is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sydney
Posts: 2,900
Query - How many folk have checked the tracking accuracy of their RA motors?

I was reading Telescope drive tracking accuracy http://arnholm.org/astro/tracking/index.htm and I wondered how many folk have checked the accuracy of their RA motors?

I guess you calculate expected rotation rate 86,164 seconds / teeth on drive motor to get the target rotation speed - draw a line on the gear then measure it over a few hours and spot how much error you have - and work out if there is a way to correct for motors that are too fast or slow.

Has anyone done much research into this? Has anyone determined if there motors are a tad fast or slow and better yet - found a utility to counter any specific error?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 11-04-2008, 12:31 PM
gary
Registered User

gary is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Mt. Kuring-Gai
Posts: 5,999
Hi Matthew,

The problem with we ground based observers is that we like to breathe oxygen
and it is this surrounding atmosphere that distorts the picture somewhat.

As I mentioned in my talk at the South Pacific Star Party last Friday, one
of the common misunderstandings with some amateur observers is that there is
some magical point in the sky, namely the NCP or SCP, that it is widely
believed if one aligns the polar axis of the scope to, will result in the optimal
point for astrophotography, Likewise, another common misunderstanding is that
if the tracking rate is exactly at the sidereal rate, this will also be the optimal value
for astrophotography.

Owing to the effects of atmospheric refraction, star trails do not result in perfect
circles in the sky and the tracking rate is not constant in RA.

The ideal polar axis setting depends on what declination and hour
angle you plan on observing and taking into account your latitude and barometric
pressure or at least an approximation based on your height above MSL.

Never forget that the ideal track rate varies continually with zenith distance.

Typically the optimal point to align the polar axis for any given part of the
sky will be somewhere between the true pole and refracted pole.

As a compromise, if one aligns the polar axis of the scope to your local refracted
pole, then the choice of the standard sidereal rate turns out to be pretty good
up near the zenith.

The cited web page is in error when the author states -
"The most accurate polar alignment method, the Drift Method ..."

Though the drift method can provide a good first order approximation of sufficient
accuracy for most imaging scenarios, it is not the most accurate polar alignment
method. The drift method does not take into account the other geometric
and flexure errors within the mount and is based typically only on a couple
of stars. A better analysis is to perform a star pointing test based on a much
larger number of stars and taking into account the geometric and flexure errors
within the mount/OTA.

Rather than look at the average tracking rate over several hours, a more useful
analysis is to determine the standard deviation of a given fixed tracking rate.
In other words, you want to make sure that when the motor is commanded
to track at some set speed when moving the weight of the OTA and moving parts
of the mount that it stays constant (i.e. that its speed is constant). Ideally the
motor can be externally commanded to speed up or slow down to match the optimal
tracking rate for the part of the sky you are imaging.

If the software that one uses to command the motor to speed up or slow down
is not closed loop, in other words, there is no velocity feedback for it to
make a correction, then one will need to characterize the average speed of the
motor (nominally near the sidereal rate) and set that as a constant in the
controlling program, if the controlling program allows for that. In other words,
some software packages will assume that the motor has a base rate that is the nominal
sidereal rate and may be applying speed offsets around that constant.

Reading between the lines I believe you suspect your RA motor is turning
at some speed considerably different to the nominal sidereal rate?

When making measurements and recoding them, make sure the scope
has reached ambient and record the temperature in your results to see if
there is any correlation with it. Come summer, you may get different results
depending upon the time source for your motor controller.

As you know, auto guiding mechanisms can also help close the loop independently
of velocity control.

Though it does not answer your query, I hope the above is of some help.

Best regards

Gary Kopff
Mt. Kuring-Gai
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11-04-2008, 03:19 PM
g__day's Avatar
g__day (Matthew)
Tech Guru

g__day is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sydney
Posts: 2,900
Gary,

Thank you - I had assumed if you apply the King rates to allow for elevation based refraction (like the SkySensor2000-PC does) this will alter sidereal rate to accurately track stars.

If I don't nail my set up on a permenant pier - then I would see at worst a 2 arc minute and hour mount too fast - and at best a 30 arc second per hour mount too fast in RA error - with no DEC drift on the meridan.

A MaxPoint sky model with 80 stars said pointing was accurate to within 34 arc seconds; well tracking is just real time pointing - so something wasn't adding up. It can't be accurate to half an arc minute in pointing and yet manifest a half an arc minute drift in RA in 30 minutes - and certainly not so consistently if everything else is correct!

Initially I put this down to polar alignment error and / or mirror shift - but now I am also pondering if the motor rate is a tad fast (regardless of the fact that adaptive King rates are being applied).

If drift is all of:

1) only in RA
2) not elevation sensitive
3) a consistent amount each hour
4) consistent even when pointing East or West, and
5) pointing is very good

What might you suspect is the cause and what would you suggest to model it out or remove it?


Matthew
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +10. The time is now 05:13 PM.

Powered by vBulletin Version 3.8.7 | Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertisement
Bintel
Advertisement