Another IIS Member Observatory in Queensland

[darrellx]

Hi all

There is now another member observatory on the horizon.

My wife and I have just purchased a rural property south of Warwick in Queensland and I am planning to build a small observatory there.

The property is about 8kms from the nearest town (of one thousand people). The nearest light bulb is about 3kms away. So after a few years of putting up with the light pollution on the Gold Coast, I am expecting some beautiful consistent dark skies.

I have started to plan the observatory and will probably go for a cement pier. And I like the split roll-off roof by Bluescope, so I might make an imitation.

I am so looking forward to this. And you can be sure that I will bore you all with questions and photos.

There are a few infrastructure projects that must be completed first (like a road), but I expect 2009 will be the year of my Observatory (appropriate name yet to be settled).

I already have a few questions.

Does anyone have an idea on how many private observatories are there currently operated by IIS members?

From your experience what is an "optimal" size? I was thinking of something around 3m x 3.5m, but I keep adding to it and now have something about 4m x 3.5m in mind. I want to have room for all the bits and pieces, but I don't really want to build a house.

Darrell

[Tandum]

On ya Darell, I'm dying to get mine finished.
Having the gear always ready to go is a big advantage.

Mine is shaping up to be a tiny remote shed 1.8x1.8x1.8.

[spearo]

hi
mine is circular and 4 meters in diameter
frank

[Barrykgerdes]

I used to look at the ads for the Sirius 2.3 metre dome and think they were too small. However when I built a new house I changed my mind and built a small observatory using the Sirius dome on a purpose built "garden shed" 2.4 metres square.

This houses my 12" LX200 GPS on a permanent pier, computer, spare telescope, some other junk and a crane that plumbs the pier to remove and replace the scope. There is still room to use the scope with visitors present.

I settled for the dome because I only need to open the portion necessary to view the section of sky of interest. This keeps the extraneous light at bay.

The project was done in about three weekends.
Week one:-
Form work for the floor/base. My concreter finished it during the week. Ordered the Dome. and the colourbond cladding.

Week two:-
Gave the floor two weeks to cure. Ordered the timber for the frame at the local timber yard in lengths suitable for cutting with minimal waste. The Timber man said would I prefer it cut out of scraps. I said yes so it was all cut exactly to size for $5. Saved me a lot of cutting. Took it home and assembled the four frames and erected them over the week end. I even cut down an old door to suit. Also picked up the colourbond sheets and screwed them to the frame.
During the week I made the metal pieces for the roof and fitted them. I then scribed a circle on the roof and cut it out for the dome mounting ring.

Week three:-
Picked up the dome and assembled it, fitted the mounting ring and two of us easily lifted the dome onto the ring. Finished the painting, installed a tempory pier (it is still there after 9 years). Installed the computer, Mounted my LX200 10" and was ready for action.

A picture and the plans are on my web site.

Barry

[darrellx]

Guys

A bit of variety in sizes there. A couple of questions for you.

Do you have much cupboard or storage space in your observatories? Do you store much stuff in there?

With your piers, are they centred in the observatory, or off-centred? Well, the circular ones will be centred I suppose!

Thanks
Darrell

[PeterM]

Hi Darrell,
Why don't you come along to our next Leyburn weekend at the end of the month. If you came out on the Saturday you could get a good look at the 6 observatories built there and they will no doubt give you some good ideas. The best idea I have built into mine (3 x 3 meter) is a small warm / control / mozzie room and this has caught on among others who have since built them. If interested PM me with a contact no. Leyburn is not far from Warwick and about 2.5 hrs from Gold Coast. Nice day trip and you get to meet some friendly like minded people.
PeterM.

[bluescope]

Hi Darrell

My obs is 3x2.4m with the mount slightly off centre so I have one end for computer desk etc with a curtain hung between the two sections for a bit of light control from monitor. I think it would depend a little on what mount you're going to use i.e. fork or equatorial ... an equatorial requires a bit more manouvering space ... also what size is your largest scope ... my 10inch Newt is 1.2m long and fits well inside my obs.

I don't keep anything in the obs other than my mount and old desktop computer ... my scopes, camera and other bits and pieces live in the house ... better temp control and more secure.

Congratulations on your new dark sky site ... you'll love it mate ! Look forward to photos.

:thumbsup:

[bluescope]

Any chance of a photo of the little warm room Peter ... I've been thinking of something more substantial than my curtain setup.

:thumbsup:

[darrellx]

Hi All

Well the first infrastructure project is complete - the 360 metres of fencing between me and the "neighbour". I hope this stops the cows from using my equipment when I am not there. (They never pack things away properly.) And by the way, the neighbour did the fencing, not me.

Picture attached. This is the view to the south.

Peter

Just had a look at where Leyburn is. Yeh, its not far from Warwick. Is Leyburn where the SAS meet when not at Pimpama? I might try and get there for the next meeting. What is the date?

I hadn't really thought of a separate room, but I imagine I will appreciate the facility in winter.


Bluescope

I will be using an equatorial mount. I currently have an 8inch newtonian, but I would like to get a 10 inch in the near future. I figure I could still have this off-centre. It would give me a few more options for the rest of the room, especially considering the inclusion of a warm room.

Darrell

[PeterM]

Hi Steve,
Here goes,
What I did was (Southern end) section off & frame 1.2meters of the Eastern wall of the observatory running diagonally from East to West, coming back to about 800mm on the Western side next to my main observatory door. This gave me plenty of room to fit my Desk (1.2w x 880mm deep) 2 LCD monitors (wall mounted), DVD/TV/Stereo (above desk) the 2 laptop computers, some mood lighting, a weather station, did I miss anything? Oh yeah a telephone. Inside the observatory I put in a frame about 180mm below the height of the walls. I then put 15mm panelling across that frame as a roof, this gives me extra storage space above me. I soon got used to ducking when I go in there - I sit in a chair anyways. 12mm wall panelling extends from the Eastern wall to where you see the curtain. The curtain material (stapled to the frame above) forms the door to the warm room and is heavy stage curtaining (you can buy it in spotlight), it keeps the warmth in winter (from screens, computers etc) and the mozzies out in Summer (I have a fan, as well as a bookshelf behind where I sit). The scope is a 12inch LX200R with a dew shield and yes there is plenty of room for it to do a 360 rotate. The internal framing also adds substantial strength to the observatory structure.
Ok, it looks like mission control (the Tardis) but everything has its function and is only lit up here for effect. I spend a lot of time down there (104 nights last year) so I want creature comforts. I know a few who have built in a separate window between them and the scope but the curtain is all I need. Sure, I can control it all from in the house if I wanted (and I don't at this stage) this is like having your own home theatre in the backyard.
Hope this is of some use.
PeterM.

[PeterM]

Hi Darrell,
Yes, some SAS members (and other friends) do head out to Leyburn - next is on the 27-29th March. Our meetings are at Pimpama, next one is this Saturday 14th, the main item being astro image. If you go to Leyburn (I can't - sons 21st) look up Ray, Kevin or Mark . Your property looks great.
PeterM.

[mat,v]

G,day Darrell,,,you certainly have a beautiful outlook for an observatory there,,,I also live in a rural setting,,don't know why everyone complains about streetlights and such,,,i can't see any,:whistle:,,,,Ahhh how's the serenity,,,:thumbsup: MAT

[bluescope]

Geez looks a bit flash for my humble shed :lol: ... thanks for posting the pics and rundown mate ... it's always good to see other people's ideas.

:thumbsup:

[bluescope]

Looks good Darrell ... now what's to the east, west and north.

You will fit a 10inch no worries ... as I say mine fits in with room to spare and my obs is 2.4m deep so there's still room to get past if you need to. I don't tend to move around much when I'm in the observatory imaging anyway and I don't have visitors.

:thumbsup:

[darrellx]

Bluescope

Here are the views North, East, West. I am fairly pleased with the views. Well, a bit of an understatement there.


Mat, I agree. I can't complain about streetlights. I have to drive nearly 5kms to see one. :rofl:And wow, the quietness. Unbelievable. My first night out there, my ears were ringing in the silence.

Darrell

[astroron]

Welcome to the Country Gentleman Class;)
It looks really nice:) a few of us looked around there quite a few years ago to set up a South East Queensland observatory site for the clubs, but nothing came of it:(

[PeterM]

Ah yes, the nights we spent at Mt Colliery just outside Warwick in the 80s. Some nights we were nearly blown over, others were just stunning. And it got bloomin as cold as. Yes Darrell, you will need that warm room.
PeterM.

[bluescope]

Looks even better now that I see the whole panorama ... you should be well pleased ... and you've even got green grass at this time of year.

Peace and quiet ... fresh air ... dark skies ... what more could you ask for.

Have you got a house on the block or is that coming later ?

:thumbsup:

[darrellx]

My wife and I have spent nearly 2 years looking around for a suitable pice of land. We have looked between the Gold Coast down to Uki in NSW and out to a litle west of Warwick. We ended up buying this 37 acres.

There are no buildings on the property at all. There is one dam. Now that the fence is up, there will still be a dozen or so kangaroos I guess. The number varies all the time. And at last count there were a few koalas.

At the moment we camp when we go out there. I am on leave in April, and have plans to start building then. Small cabin and garage first, then the observatory.

Darrell

[bluescope]

Sounds like you have a busy time ahead ... good luck !

:thumbsup:

[darrellx]

Hi All

I am just going over some of the finer detail on the design of the observatory and have a sticking point I need help on.

With the rolloff roof, I can "waterproof" three sides - what I call the front and back, and the end wall that the roof rolls over. But what about the opposite end where the roof stops when it is rolling back onto the observatory.

The way I see it, the roof cannot have anything hanging down below the level of the wall, or else it will not be able to roll off.

The only thing I can think of, is to have the top section of the wall hinged, so it can be folded inwards when I want to roll off the roof. This hinged section can then help lock the roof inplace when I want to close everything.

I am wondering how others have addressed this?

Thanks
Darrell

[PeterM]

I just use 6 inch black plastic on the outside of the observatory, the kind that builders use. Comes on 10 metre rolls and is pretty cheap. I put around 1 inches under a piece of edging (painted) to secure it to the end so that about 5 inches hangs down making a nice weatherproofing. Have used it for years and it works great, you do however have to pull it out if it curves under, but that's simple. There is also the same on the inside of the observatory. It is available in most harware stores.
PeterM

[mldee]

I did something similar using black rubber floormatting from Clark Rubber. It has enough flexibility to smoothly 'flop' over the bits at the end of the building when you roll on/off. I also made the roof dimensions so that it overhangs about 4" at each end (not needed on the sides) so that there is plenty of cover between the rubber and the wall gap.

When I finally get the obs looking presentable, I'll take some happy snaps and put them up with some comments on my learning curve.

[darrellx]

Hi All

This weekend I have moved a step closer to my Observatory. After some messing around with local authorities I now have a road (of sorts), and gates onto the property. It has taken a little longer than I expected, but at least this major hurdle is over.

The photo of the front gate is taken from the inside looking out.

Now to work on the design.

Darrell

[Bolts_Tweed]

Gday - I see a bit earlier that Mr Peter M was talking about Leyburn and observatories (not that you should believe a word he says :lol: - but what the heck) he did convince me to put a warm room in my observatory at Leyburn. I have been there for the last 3 nights and it was minus 1 on Friday early morning (cold for a Gold Coast sook) - I was sitting in my control room in a T Shirt. It is a 5 x 3 metre framed shed with a 3 x 3 metre roof section that rolls off and leaves a smallish (1.7m x 3 m) room for a control / warm room. Walls and ceiling are fully insulated and I have found just having the computers and electronics running in there - the room stays comfortably warm - no need for the gas heater yet but that will change next month I am sure. The insulation also allows me to have Led Zepplin playing at dB levels that will make your ears bleed without annoying anyone else.

My advice is that an observatory should be a place you want to be in - not a cold miserable place you cant wait to get out of - I use this latest observatory 10 times as much as I used my last home observatory. It costs a couple of extra bucks but I think it is a great investment.

Someone asked about obs images efore - I dont have any of Petes but have included a couple of mine for ideas - best advice from Pete I ever got (Even supernova hunters have good ideas sometimes - I'm going to cop hell for this aren't I PM ;))

I agree with Pete - please feel welcome to come bush as see us sometime

MB

[Bolts_Tweed]

I forgot to say Darrellx - I think the waterproofing you are talking about is in my photo where the roll off section meets the fixed roof ection. If it isnt forget everything I am going to say.

What I have done (well in the process of doing really) is I have left the corrugated end of the fixed section of roof on an up (corrugation finishes high) if that makes sense (as opposed to a down (trough)). The roll off section of the roof is just high enough to roll over the fixed secion by about 150 mm (horizontally) and 25 mm higher. I have just got some rubber material about 50 mm wide and 10 mm thick and I am attaching to the 'up' section of the fixed roof so that when the roll on section comes to it it pushes on it and forms like a horizontal U. For such a simple thing it takes some describing.

I also put what they call cats whiskers (ie the stuff on the mudgaurds of semi trailers) around the roll off section to assist in keeping the dust out. Its damn expensive but works really well - also sweeps the channel clean as the roof rolls.

If you got this far in this tome - good luck

MB

[bloodhound31]

I would say from experience, to plan a bit of space around your scope. There is nothing worse than having to try to squeeze around it in the dark without knocking it.

Had I known, I would have planned a 5 metre dome instead of three.

Baz.

[darrellx]

Thanks for the tips guys. I love the idea of a fixed roof section. That should help evercome most of my concerns about the roof and a warm room. I read your post twice (or three times) Mark. It makes sense.

The size is something that I just have to settle on. Space on the property is not an issue. I started out with a 3x3 shed; went to a 4x3 shed. Now I am thinking 4x3.5 or 5x4. I don't want to be cramped, but I don't want a hugh empty cavern either. My plan is to have somewhere between 500mm and 1000mm of space all around the scope if it were to swing in a horizontal arc.

Before I build anything, I will have to make a trip to Leyburn and have a look.

Darrell

[Bolts_Tweed]

Please do drop in mate.

I agree with Barry re room around the scope. I lost 3 subs last weekend by bumping the counterweights as Rho Opiuchus rose near the meridian. (I was using a shutter release cable on the DSLR - I had left the DS-USB cable at home) - you think a fool would learn by the second bump :). That is in a 3x3 area.

We have 6 completed observatories out there now and another 4 under construction and everyone has their own ideas - I dont know who is right but it might be a source of ideas if you are interested - on your way to Warwick one weekend. Temporary accommodation is available - just a bed in a van but it meets the quarter star requirements of the Goodyear travel guide.

MB

[darrellx]

Mark (and Peter M)

I realise that Leyburn is associated with the SAS. Do you guys go out there most weekends? Or do you just have "gatherings" at regular intervals? I would like to drop in and have a look around while someone is there. I will need some directions once I get to the township.

Darrell

[Bolts_Tweed]

gday mate

Its not associated with the SAS apart from the fact that a lot of people from the SAS go there (with my blessing) but anyone is welcome. I am a member of SAS but becuse I am out there just about every weekend I've only been to one meeting in about 5 years. I will PM you to explain and give directions.

MB

[darrellx]

Mark

Nice photos of the observatory. Just one question - how high are the walls (not the roof apex)?

Darrell

[Bolts_Tweed]

Gday Darrel

they are 1900 high to give me anough head height in the control room (I am obvioulsy short) which is bit high for the obs I think but I offest this my making the pier high enough to offset it. Also aids in getting down to the eyepiece of refractors. photo attached

MB

[darrellx]

Hi All

I have decided to go back to the drawingboard for the observatory. After visiting Leyburn (thanks Mark, I got a lot from the visit), I have other ideas for the style of roof.

Originally, I had planned on a simple skillion roll-off. Now, having seen some of the structures at Leyburn, I am VERY impressed with the split roofs in an "A" frame style. One side of the roof can be opened at a time, or both can be opened. The roof halves each roll down a 30 to 40 degree incline. Hard to explain, but that is the thrust of it.

Anyway, I am now looking to change the roof. This will set the construction back a few more weeks.

Darrell

[I.C.D]

Just remember one thing Darrell if are going to build your observatory on top of a hill make sure you anchor it down well ,walls to the floor and the floor to the foundation because wind can become very strong blowing up hill and the last thing your want to see is your observatory blowing across the paddock
Ian C

[darrellx]

Ian C

Well, this is the one thing that has me a little concerned about the "new" roof design. With the single flat roof, I think I had it worked out well to secure it. But with my thoughts on a split roof with a steeper slope I am having a bit of trouble being satisfied that it is secure.

And yes, you are right. Where I am going to build the observatory it does get a bit windy.

This weekend I am going to sit down with a builder mate and see if we can work out some of the finer detail.

Darrell

[I.C.D]

Darrell,
The roll off roof design I am using is made of 40 mm stainless steel uni -strut as the guides with 30mm wheel bearing as the rollers with spacers .The roof is made out of 20mm RSH box tubing with a 200mm pitch to allow for the rain water to run off as well as condensation inside.
The Uin-strut is bolted to the top plate of the walls which is held down by the wall sheeting which is held by the bottom plate and hoop iron strapping which is strapped to floor and the foundation ,hopefully this will stop mind for going walkabout in high winds across the paddock .
If you want some pic of the uni-strut design let me know and I will take some and post them if you wish to talk to me give a ring on 0412998031



Ian C
:thumbsup: